-Caveat Lector- from: http://www.aci.net/kalliste/ <A HREF="http://www.aci.net/kalliste/">The Home Page of J. Orlin Grabbe</A> ----- ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Impeachment Watch Speaker-Elect Supports Impeachment, Vows to Block Censure Livingston makes up his mind WASHINGTON -- The battle lines over allowing the House to censure President Clinton rather than impeach him hardened sharply Saturday, as Representative Robert L. Livingston, the Speaker-designate, vowed to block such a move and White House allies promised to take the fight to the American public. Livingston shed his ambiguity on the issue moments after the House Judiciary Committee rejected censure as an alternative, and the panel's chairman, Henry J. Hyde, urged House Republican leaders to keep it off the floor, saying such a move would threaten the separation of powers between the legislative and executive branches. In revealing his position, Livingston said that he strongly supported impeachment and that censure was not envisioned by the Constitution's founders. "Censure is out of the realm of responsibility of the House of Representatives," Livingston said before flying back to Washington from Louisiana Saturday. "We have a constitutional responsibility to charge or not charge, impeach or not impeach." Nonetheless, President Clinton's supporters mounted a full-scale campaign to force Livingston to reverse course, aiming to build public support for an alternative to impeachment and to put a glaring spotlight on Livingston's ability to cope with his newly won leadership duties. The Democratic challenge, already facing long odds before Saturday, now confronts a unified House Republican leadership, bolstered by the arguments offered by Hyde, which are likely to influence many undecided Republicans. Only a strong, vocal protest from several moderate Republicans who oppose impeachment could force Livingston to reverse course at this late hour, censure supporters say. And up to now, any Republican who has openly opposed impeachment or supported censure has been hammered mercilessly by conservative groups and right-wing talk radio. Representative Tom DeLay, the Republican whip and a fierce critic of Clinton, fears that allowing a censure vote would siphon votes from impeachment. Recognizing this dynamic, the President's allies Saturday tried to begin gathering the broad public support for censure to give moderate Republicans the political cover they need to openly challenge their leadership. But White House allies voiced worries that it would be hard to rouse a public distracted by the holiday season, even though opinion polls are running hard against impeachment. Moments after the Judiciary Committee voted out a fourth article of impeachment, Democrats on the panel gave an impassioned argument for a censure alternative that condemns the President's "reprehensible conduct" and leaves open the possibility that Clinton could face "criminal and civil penalties" after leaving office. It does not call for a fine. "If you want to punish the President or brand the President with scarlet letters or stamp him on the forehead, censure is the way to do it," said Representative Martin Meehan, a Massachusetts Democrat. To buttress their case, Democrats underscored the gravity of an impeachment vote, by arguing that casting such a vote explicitly urges the President's removal. "This is not sending to the Senate a questionnaire," said Representative Barney Frank, a Massachusetts Democrat. "This is a statement the President should be thrown out." Several Democrats sought to put pressure on Livingston. Representative John Conyers Jr. of Michigan, the ranking Democrat on the committee, conceded that the censure resolution would fail in committee (it did, 22 to 14), but focused on its chances on the House floor. "We will practice our arguments Saturday and prepare them for a larger presentation," Conyers said. "My hope is on the untested Speaker-elect, Bob Livingston." Republicans on the panel rejected the censure resolution as unconstitutional, a bad precedent and feckless. In a letter to Livingston and Speaker Newt Gingrich released moments after the committee adjourned, Hyde said "a resolution or amendment proposing censure of the President in lieu of impeachment violates the rules of the House, threatens the separation of powers, and fails to meet constitutional muster." Representative Bob Goodlatte, a Virginia Republican, said the President's crimes were too serious for censure. "This President mocks the Congress, and this censure is exactly what this President wants," he said in debate Saturday. "He will take this as a vindication of his mocking and we should not give it to him." As committee Democrats began their frontal assault, the House Democratic leader, Representative Richard A. Gephardt, appealed in a letter to Livingston to allow a censure vote on the House floor. Gephardt's aides vowed an intense fight for censure and issued veiled warnings that Livingston, by blocking a vote on censure, was inviting protracted battles with House Democrats in the next Congress. "This first most important decision for you as a leader will mark more than the fate of impeachment," Gephardt said. "It will surely mark the kind of leader you will be, and thereby the kind of Congress we can expect under your Speakership." But Livingston characterized Gephardt's proposition as flouting the rules of the House. "An attack on the rules is an attack on the chair," Livingston said. Democrats and Republicans also threw back in Livingston's face his promise not to whip the impeachment vote, and instead make it a vote of conscience for each member. "The Republican leadership cannot say this is a conscience vote, if they don't allow members of Congress to express their conscience to voice an alternative," said Representative Peter J. King, a Long Island Republican who opposes impeachment. Representative Bob Ney, an Ohio Republican who is undeclared, said, "I'd rather see censure as an open option." The fact that Congress is out of session, and that lawmakers are scattered across the country, has also hurt the censure effort. But as House members filter back, censure supporters say, they will try to gather their allies for a final push. "Between now and Thursday, there has to be on outpouring of public opinion," King said. "People are still not focused on this. The average American thought this ended with the elections on Nov. 3, and they aren't fully aware we're down this path." The New York Times, Dec. 13, 1998 ----- Aloha, He'Ping, Om, Shalom, Salaam. Em Hotep, Peace Be, Omnia Bona Bonis, All My Relations. Adieu, Adios, Aloha. Amen. Roads End Kris DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER ========== CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic screeds are not allowed. Substance—not soapboxing! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright frauds is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. 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