On 7/31/16, Thomas Schmitt <scdbac...@gmx.net> wrote: > > Brian Wengel wrote: >> Are we seriously discussing floppy images? :-P > > As said, small is beautiful.
Oh, oh, ohhhhhh.. I went back to the thread to find a place for my last thought. THIS is the place. I debootstrap my Debian in. On locally provided dialup. Initial download size for a shiny, brand new start I THINK is approximately in the mid-50's MB range. That's floppy size IF it's a feasible option. My kneejerk is yes, it's potentially feasible because I... although, hm... I don't know. I place previously saved debootstrap deb files into each new debootstrap copy's file hierarchy. The reason is because doing so saves a LOT of time and strain on all affected servers (e.g. dialup, Debian, and Debian repositories) It only helps some because there is always something that needs a newer release pulled from online anyway. Note: The rest of this rambles re personal experience with the end point always being advocacy for Debian's potential as a Life enhancing tool for vulnerable and/or poverty level populations...... Hm. I guess... I wonder (out loud) if providing necessary, time appropriate debootstrap prerequisites on the floppy would help avoid the need for online access to the updated debs at first. What I mean is provide e.g. the necessary "lists" that match the provided deb archives so the debootstrap command doesn't go looking for anything more current online. But then you still need dialup sooner than later... 20 minutes to a half hour later is my regular experience when most initial deb archive files are already previously downloaded. In that case, you might as well just get your debootstrap fresh off the Net anyway so that you receive the newest releases available. Yes, you could have the other files on floppies but your lists are probably instantly more current than those so there you head back to online access again... The words "very messy alternative" come to mind... :D Yes, debootstrap just gets your foot in the Debian front door, but still, you're in. The rest you hand pick and choose.. for EVERYTHING per user personality and need. Most of the rest you pull in would take a pile of floppies, but *is* still there as a thought. Right offhand I can't think of anything that is too big for a floppy of its own. My (very bloated) /var/cache/apt/archives shows browsers as the largest deb files at ~49MB. Of course, we're talking about... hundreds to thousands of files that are updated regularly so... that equates to a humongous stack of floppies that literally become outdated at the very moment current files are being copied on to them. My first copy of Debian was that stack of some, what was it, 31 CDs or so. 33? GRIN. Put that up against floppies and ouch, BUT.. somewhere that could become a Life saving tool... Speaking firsthand. Who knows... Not joking here. Somewhere maybe there's a town full of people looking for just such a thing in a country where outdated dinosaur computer hardware is dumped as garbage fill from other countries. Where it could help... I have a few international Facebook friends. Just last night I "overheard" something about another country. It's left a permanent firsthand reminder that there ARE countries out there where folks in charge... are absolute control freaks over every aspect of citizens' lives. Getting communication related technology into the hands of those citizens via whatever hardware is already in their reach helps start flipping the balance in their favor. Back to debootstrap... For each shiny new debootstrap copy I do, total initial download time (for me) on dialup is in the one day range. That brings in things like kernel image, desktop environment, OpenShot, Libreoffice, GIMP, Inkscape, browsers, and a limited number of system tools. If I wasn't using Sid Unstable, keeping up to date would be a breeze after that initial one day's worth of time investment. My very limited, "skeletal" debootstrap'ed copy is still highly maintainable and regularly reflects "0" packages needing upgraded even on Sid Unstable's extreme update schedule and even on dialup. Deboostrap is very much a poverty level friendly option if anyone's advocacy and activities put you on a path where you could help change someone's Life via access to Debian. In fact, debootstrap is an abject poverty level friendly option. Absolute bottom of the social monetary barrel, and I can still keep up with developers at the speed of updates that make up Sid Unstable. Just waiting on a $9.25 external, hardware driven dialup modem to hit my snail mailbox to catch back up to speed with you all.. :) Cindy :) -- Cindy-Sue Causey Talking Rock, Pickens County, Georgia, USA * runs with plastic sporks *