Hi Ricardo, While currently the velocity of change of the code base is unprecedented, we do need to pause and freeze 5.0. Otherwise, it can go like that for months :) My thoughts on the remaining scope:
1. ObjectSelect grammar - https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/CAY-3026 2. Modeler support for the grammar 3. Get rid of EJBQLQuery 4. See what public API we can deprecate (I am thinking "cayenne-lifecycle" and "cayenne-osgi") While #1 is kinda big, models are really good at parsers, so I think we can squeeze it in M4. Then we let people try it, then freeze and declare RC1 (or maybe skip M4 all together and go straight to RC). So soon... For the record, things we are postponing till 6.0 or later: 1. Revamp of vertical inheritance 2. Horizontal inheritance 3. Single-file XML projects 4. Combining ObjEntity + DbEntity ("EOF-style"... requires research) 5. Unifying expressions and properties API 6. Memory efficient snapshots (better DataRows) 7. Cache model makeover (requires research) 8. Read-optimized contexts (requires research) and more... Andrus > On Sep 10, 2026, at 11:19 PM, Ricardo Parada <[email protected]> wrote: > > Hi all, > > Hugi answered my second question another chat. I can use an AI Skill for > that. I will try that out. > > My experience with Cayenne has been with 5.0-M1 and liked it very much. I see > now the latest is M3. > > How long does it take to get out of alpha? > > Thank you > Ricardo Parada > > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Sep 6, 2026, at 3:31 PM, Ricardo Parada <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> Hello everyone, >> >> Is Cayenne 5.0-M3 still considered alpha? It looked pretty good when I >> looked at it last. >> >> Has anyone had experience using GenAI tools for migrating an EOF code base >> to Cayenne? >> >> I already did some of the tough work. All the utilities we have based on EOF >> have been converted to Cayenne similar. I also wrote a tool that converts >> our EOModels to Cayenne and generates business objects. >> >> Thank you >> Ricardo Parada >> >>> On Sep 3, 2026, at 9:23 AM, Hugi Thordarson <[email protected]> wrote: >>> (pardon my comically late replies, I'm abhorrently busy these first days >>> after summer and being a socially awkward programmer, human contact gets >>> de-prioritized) >>> >>> I'm a big fan of those great end results you refer to :). >>> >>> And my opinion might be skewed (with my projects being somewhat homogeneous >>> and not too huge in scope or complexity) but even in my larger projects, I >>> generally don't consider API changes a big deal — they're statically >>> verifiable and just about always for the better, for both users and library >>> developers (not least these days when users have LLMs to assist with >>> API-updates). >>> >>> Behavioural changes may be a different issue (the select/transaction change >>> being the reason I held back a bit on using -SNAPSHOT until M3 was >>> released) . But in the case of Cayenne, even these don't scare me that >>> much, given the code's test coverage. >>> >>> I also still think of Cayenne as young, with its best years and greatest >>> adoption still ahead of it. So any changes made now are preparing for a >>> cleaner and happier future :). So; congrats again on the release. My apps >>> are running happily ever since upgrade, and the improved SQL-logging is a >>> very real quality-of-life enhancement during development. >>> >>> Cheers, >>> - hugi >>> >>> >>>>> On 25 Aug 2026, at 21:44, Andrus Adamchik <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>> Great feedback. Keeps me motivated :) Every time I embark on a coding >>>> cycle resulting in a lot of breaking changes, I'm like "the end result >>>> seems great, but then a bunch of people are going to get confused and have >>>> to re-learn stuff" :) And there are still a lot of candidates left. >>>> >>>> >>>>> On Aug 25, 2026, at 4:51 PM, Hugi Thordarson <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> Awesome! >>>>> First, thanks for UPGRADE.md, it makes these updates much easier. >>>>> ~20 maps updated and 9 apps deployed with M3 in a couple of hours (M2 -> >>>>> M3). Most projects more or less just (1) opening/updating the >>>>> projects/maps -> (2) Updating runtime creation code to use new APIs -> >>>>> (3) re-configure logging -> (4) build and deploy. No surprises. >>>>> I'd call that a lovely update process, given that large-ish change in the >>>>> model layer (removal of DataNodes — which I immediately like; think it >>>>> makes the whole setup feel simpler). >>>>> And I think I can definitely feel improved performance? Although that >>>>> should probably be considered conjecture for now, since I haven't >>>>> measured anything yet. Possibly everything just feels fast after a couple >>>>> of hours upgrading boilerplate :) >>>>> Oh, and the modeler's new clothes look really nice. >>>>> Cheers, thanks and once again, congrats on a great release! >>>>> - hugi >>>>>> On 25 Aug 2026, at 18:23, Nikita Timofeev <[email protected]> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> 5.0-M3 is live now. >>>>>> It was a rather quick release, thanks everyone again! >>>>>> On Tue, Aug 25, 2026 at 2:45 PM Nikita Timofeev >>>>>> <[email protected]> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> +1 >>>>>>> Javadocs are missing from the Central for this and the M2 release; this >>>>>>> seems not critical for the milestone. Should be fixed for the next one. >>>>>>> Here's a final voting result: >>>>>>> Andrus Adamchik (PMC): +1 >>>>>>> John Huss (PMC): +1 >>>>>>> Nikita Timofeev (PMC): +1 >>>>>>> I will finalize the release later today. >>>>>>> Thank you, everyone! >>>>>>> On Mon, Aug 24, 2026 at 6:32 PM John Huss <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>>> +1 >>>>>>>> 1) verified signatures >>>>>>>> 2) verified archives are basically identical between platforms >>>>>>>> 3) RAT indicates no unlicensed files >>>>>>>> 4) compiled from source >>>>>>>> 5) unit tests ran successfully >>>>>>>> 6) macOS specific and Platform-agnostic modelers launch on macOS >>>>>>>> On Fri, Aug 21, 2026 at 10:27 AM Andrus Adamchik <[email protected]> >>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>> My checklist is green. I am +1. >>>>>>>>> + MD5/SHA512 matches >>>>>>>>> + Signature checks >>>>>>>>> + rat passes >>>>>>>>> + builds from source >>>>>>>>> + Modeler runs on OS X >>>>>>>>> + Cross-platform Modeler runs on OS X >>>>>>>>> + Upgrade Bootique using the Maven repo >>>>>>>>> + Upgrade Agrest using the Maven repo >>>>>>>>> + Upgrade LinkMove using the Maven repo. >>>>>>>>> FWIW, DataNode unwinding from XML allowed to simplify Bootique >>>>>>>> integration >>>>>>>>> a lot. Cleaner design paying off. >>>>>>>>> Andrus >>>>>>>>>> On Aug 21, 2026, at 5:32 AM, Nikita Timofeev < >>>>>>>> [email protected]> >>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> Hi all, >>>>>>>>>> Here's a next 5.0 milestone release. >>>>>>>>>> Release notes: >>>>>>>> https://github.com/apache/cayenne/blob/refs/tags/5.0-M3/RELEASE-NOTES.txt >>>>>>>>>> Maven repo: >>>>>>>> https://repository.apache.org/content/repositories/orgapachecayenne-1064/ >>>>>>>>>> Assemblies: https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/cayenne/5.0-M3/ >>>>>>>>>> Please evaluate and cast your votes. >>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>> Best regards, >>>>>>>>>> Nikita Timofeev >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> Best regards, >>>>>>> Nikita Timofeev >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Best regards, >>>>>> Nikita Timofeev
