On 15 March 2012 04:42, Kurt Milam <[email protected]> wrote: > One more note and I'll shut my noob yapper... > > Jan asked whether there was anything else Couchbase could do to help fix > the confusion, and this message is a response to that request. > > I never saw couch.io - it was dead before I started researching CouchDB > seriously. I can tell you that the poorly-handled migration from couch.ioto > couchbase.com adds to the general confusion around CouchDB. Have you guys > heard of 301 redirects? Anyone researching CouchDB is going to come across > blog posts, answers on StackOverflow, comments on blogs, etc., that link to > couch.io URLs which no longer exist. You guys need to read up on 'cool > URLs'. I suspect that much of the content that used to be at couch.io URLs > is still online at couchbase.com URLs, but because Couchbase hasn't > bothered to 301 redirect from the old URLs to the new ones, the content is > practically unfindable. It took me forever to find Jan's blog articles on > filtered replication and security, part of his series on new features in > 1.1.1. My google fu is reasonably strong, but these important articles > (important parts of the catalog of CouchDB documentation, imho), were > seriously buried in my search results. > > In short, Couchbase is doing a disservice to itself, as well as to the > CouchDB community by not taking the migration from couch.io from > couchbase.com - put someone on that... Set up the correct 301 redirects. > Fix broken links and images in blog posts. Couchbase.com contains some > excellent CouchDB-related documentation. Do yourselves and the CouchDB > community a favor and fix couchbase.com. > > Best Regards, > > Kurt Milam > > > On Thu, Mar 15, 2012 at 4:09 AM, Kurt Milam <[email protected]> wrote: > >> I'll pipe in as a relatively new CouchDB user, and someone who's spent a >> reasonable amount of time in both #couchdb and #couchbase over the past few >> weeks. >> >> Couchbase/CouchDB is confusing for newcomers. It was (and frankly, still >> is) confusing for me, and I have seen more than one person in #couchdb >> expressing confusion and even worried about whether the CouchDB ecosystem >> is stable enough to consider using Couch(x) for the data layer in serious >> software projects. >> >> I've been aware of CouchDB for at least a year now - the brand is >> well-known in certain circles. I've been aware of NoSQL and MongoDB for >> approximately just as long, but I'd never spent the time really looking >> closely at NoSQL solutions until a couple of months ago. >> >> At that time, I began seriously researching various NoSQL solutions for >> upcoming and ongoing projects. Frankly, the CouchDB ecosystem is the most >> confusing of all of the various NoSQL solutions I've researched - riak, >> mongodb. redis, among others. The documentation is spread out, disjointed >> and sometimes out of date. A number of articles and blog posts link to >> couch.io addresses that no longer exist (note to couchbase listeners: >> your move from couch.io to couchbase.com was, in my opinion, handled >> extremely poorly, with multitudes of dead links and a seriously broken blog >> that was obviously not migrated to the new system/domain with much care). >> >> As I began to research NoSQL solutions more closely, I can say that >> CouchDB was the brand with the most recognition for me, and was therefore >> one of the first solutions that I researched. I was leaning toward using >> CouchDB for a number of reasons - brand strength and a recommendation from >> another developer whose opinion I respect. I can tell you that at least in >> my experience, the decision to go with CouchDB over one of the other >> solutions took much longer than it would have, if CouchBase hadn't confused >> the issue, and if CouchDB's documentation had been in better order. >> >> In the end, I went with CouchDB primarily for the master-master >> replication, the various solutions for installing CouchDB on mobile >> devices, and CouchApps. To be concise, CouchDB was the correct solution for >> the projects we're currently working on, but it took a good deal of extra >> research (due to the confusion caused by CouchBase and the scattered state >> of CouchDB docs). >> >> In case you hadn't noticed, I disagree 100% with Bob Dionne's and Jason >> Smith's estimation, and I'd say that my assessment of the situation, as a >> new convert to CouchDB, is probably much more relevant than the estimation >> of two Couch(x) old hands. >> >> Couchbase is confusing for those just starting to research CouchDB, full >> stop. >> >> Best Regards, >> >> Kurt Milam >> >> >> >> On Wed, Mar 14, 2012 at 10:49 AM, Nick North <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> As a fairly new CouchDb user, I have been confused about the relationship >>> between CouchDb and Couchbase. For some while I was unsure whether the >>> Couchbase site might have a more recent version of CouchDb than the >>> CouchDb >>> site did, especially as it talked about a forthcoming version 2, while >>> CouchDb talked about version 1.1, and it contains API docs that are >>> perfectly usable as CouchDb documentation. >>> >>> Jan Lehnardt's Looking for Apache CouchDb >>> <http://www.couchbase.com/couchdb>page has done a lot to dispel that >>> confusion though. I don't think there is >>> any need for anyone to change product names, but the sort of information >>> on >>> that page helps a lot to make sure people go to the right place. >>> >>> Nick >>> >>> On 14 March 2012 09:35, Jason Smith <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>> > On Wed, Mar 14, 2012 at 9:29 AM, Bob Dionne >>> > <[email protected]> wrote: >>> > > Jan, >>> > > >>> > > Here's my two cents as a couchdb committer. >>> > > >>> > > I don't think you (Couchbase) need to do anything. My observation is >>> > that there has been more representation about end-user confusion than >>> there >>> > has been actual end-user confusion. >>> > >>> > Completely agree. >>> > >>> >> >>
Hi Kurt, Nick, Once 1.2.0 is out the door cleaning docs/wiki up will be my top priority for a while, so it's great to have some direction on what's not working out there! Bring it on.. A+ Dave
