For my part, I'm not convinced that September is realistic for 1.0. But I definitely hope to get 1.0 out by ApacheCon US (December). I need to spend some time on what I want to see in 1.0. Perhaps a 1.0 release number should be added to JIRA, so we can put things in there, and then mark them back to a sooner milestone where appropriate.
Aaron On Tue, 19 Jul 2005, David Jencks wrote: > Thanks for pushing on this issue. > > I think it is really important that we put out a 1.0 release very soon. > I think it needs to work, and be tck compliant, but I don't think it > has to be all that much more usable than what we have now. I'd rather > get feedback and users than perfection. > > The features I think we need for 1.0 are: > > clean up some architectural problems. I think I'll get the ones I know > about fixed by the end of this week. > clean up the plan xml. I think this is a fairly quick job. > Decide what we will continue to support from our 1.0 release. IMO this > is only the plan xml schemas and possibly some interfaces exposed by > some gbeans, primarily gbeans "exposed" by jsr-77 > get the web console in, preferably with instructions on how to change > the static page in which the portlets appear. > > I'd like to get 1.0 out by Sept 15th. > > Can everyone think carefully about what they really need to be in 1.0, > what they will commit to actually implementing themselves, and when > they think it can be done by? > > thanks > david jencks > > > On Jul 19, 2005, at 12:58 PM, David Blevins wrote: > > > > > On Jul 19, 2005, at 7:06 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > >> Maybe after M4 is out we should look at creating some further > >> milestone versions in JIRA and start assigning some of the tasks that > >> were in the Roadmap that Geir discussed to them, so we can get a good > >> visual on the project's plans. > >> > >> At the moment it isn't obvious (from JIRA) what needs to be done to > >> get to a 1.0 release, and how we are going to achieve that (steps > >> along the way). The JIRA roadmap view is useful to see what is > >> planned for future releases and would probably assist prioritizing > >> work. There are also a lot of unscheduled issues that would be nice > >> to place on a roadmap. Maybe a review of tasks for future milestones > >> should be done at the end of each milestone? Comments? > > > > We are still hammering on M4, so I don't want to distract people to > > much. Just want to get people thinking. > > > > I have a couple things in my mind still in the abstract. Will try to > > get them out in some sensible way. Bare with me. > > > > <rambling> > > RELEASE OFTEN, PERFECT OR NOT > > > > Ok, so it's been a year since M3 (ouch) and we have threatened to do > > an M4 several times. Why did we keep putting off M4 even though we > > knew very well M3 was no good? I think the reason is something along > > the lines of 1) being optimistic in many forms, 2) wanting the next > > release to be some form of perfect, 3) being focused on a couple (or > > one) very large goal. > > > > More important than 1, 2 or 3 is time. > > > > Let's ask ourselves: > > - How much usablility feedback could we have gotten in an entire > > year's time? > > - How many releases could we have done in the last year? > > - How many would-be committers and users did we miss out on by not > > releasing? > > > > Let's be more humble and admit that every release is going to "suck" > > to some degree (i.e. not be perfect) and it's better to work on > > getting them out faster, not slower. > > > > We need to stop making such a bid deal about the next release, which > > only slows it down, and start thinking two or three releases out. > > > > Normally some form of competition would drive us to push releases out > > the door quickly and keep our goals in check with what people really > > do need now and what they would be fine having later. There is > > competition out there, but it's us not competing with them, not the > > other way around. Sorry, just calling it like I see it. > > > > MILESTONES AND USABILITY > > > > Alright, IMHO, we've outgrown milestones. Better said we've attained > > our goal of passing the CTS, the major technical milestone. Now we > > all are focusing on usability. From my experience, obtaining > > usability is all about iterations, as many as you can get and as often > > as you can get them. I think milestones will actually slow us down on > > achieving our goal of usability. > > > > We are going to have to crank out a half dozen releases minimum over > > the next couple months in order to achieve the kind of growth we want. > > At this point in the game it's all about momentum. We need to be an > > unstoppable freight-train leaving a trail of release numbers behind us > > and picking up as much community we can carry as we go forward. > > > > Pushing a milestone every three months is not going to cut it, nor is > > Geronimo 1.0 M12 such good idea either. > > > > 1.0, THE UNATTAINABLE GOAL (CROSSING THE LINE) > > > > The 1.0 release is not about the cool things we want to add to make > > Geronimo great. It's about reaching a point where you and the users > > agree on what will be supported in a year's time, which won't be much > > as it's a 1.0, not a 2.0 or 3.0 or 4.0. That's it, no more, no less. > > All sorts of cool things can be added later! > > > > Here is the point where I have particular experience, ... you will > > cross that magical "1.0" line at some point, wether you choose to call > > it 1.0 or not! > > > > At some point, people will start using the software and become > > dependent on whatever you are at the time. Their expectations will > > naturally settle on what you have and not where you say you are going. > > 1.0 or not, you now have to maintain stability, only you weren't so > > clear on what was going to change and what was to remain supported (be > > at least backwards compatible), so now you are in the position to have > > to support much more than you wanted. > > </rambling> > > > > Anyway, those are my rambling thoughts and experiences. Just throwing > > them out there for now. > > > > -David > > > > > > > >
