Hi, I am personally not a big fan of providing two APIs to do the same thing. If we believe that one API is better than the other, we should indicate this by deprecating the old API IMHO.
Just my two cents. -Matthias On 4/30/17 11:05 PM, Michael Pearce wrote: > See > > https://hc.apache.org/httpcomponents-client-ga/tutorial/html/fluent.html > > Doesn't cause much issue over there where you have a fluent api wrapper for > those who like that style, and the original more verbose api. > > Surely it would be better than removing a way of doing things that everyone > has got used to and built their code around ala constructors approach. And > simply provide a wrapper to provide a per field way of doing things. > > > > > > Sent using OWA for iPhone > ________________________________________ > From: Stephane Maarek <steph...@simplemachines.com.au> > Sent: Monday, May 1, 2017 6:37:44 AM > To: dev@kafka.apache.org > Subject: Re: [DISCUSS] KIP 141 - ProducerRecordBuilder Interface > > I’m not sure how people would feel about having two distinct methods to build > the same object? > An API wrapper may be useful, but it doesn’t bring opinion about how one > should program, that’s just driven by the docs. > I’m okay with that, but we need concensus > > > On 1/5/17, 6:08 am, "Michael Pearce" <michael.pea...@ig.com> wrote: > > Why not, instead of deprecating or removing whats there, as noted, its a > point of preference, think about something that could wrap the existing, but > provide an api that for you is cleaner? > > e.g. here's a sample idea building on a fluent api way. (this wraps the > producer and producer records so no changes needed) > > > https://gist.github.com/michaelandrepearce/de0f5ad4aa7d39d243781741c58c293e > > In future as new items further add to Producer Record, they just become > new methods in the fluent API, as it builds the ProducerRecord using the most > exhaustive constructor. > > > > ________________________________________ > From: Matthias J. Sax <matth...@confluent.io> > Sent: Saturday, April 29, 2017 6:52 PM > To: dev@kafka.apache.org > Subject: Re: [DISCUSS] KIP 141 - ProducerRecordBuilder Interface > > I understand that we cannot just break stuff (btw: also not for > Streams!). But deprecating does not break anything, so I don't think > it's a big deal to change the API as long as we keep the old API as > deprecated. > > > -Matthias > > On 4/29/17 9:28 AM, Jay Kreps wrote: > > Hey Matthias, > > > > Yeah I agree, I'm not against change as a general thing! I also think if > > you look back on the last two years, we completely rewrote the producer > and > > consumer APIs, reworked the binary protocol many times over, and added > the > > connector and stream processing apis, both major new additions. So I > don't > > think we're in too much danger of stagnating! > > > > My two cents was just around breaking compatibility for trivial changes > > like constructor => builder. I think this only applies to the producer, > > consumer, and connect apis which are heavily embedded in hundreds of > > ecosystem components that depend on them. This is different from direct > > usage. If we break the streams api it is really no big deal---apps just > > need to rebuild when they upgrade, not the end of the world at all. > However > > because many intermediate things depend on the Kafka producer you can > cause > > these weird situations where your app depends on two third party things > > that use Kafka and each requires different, incompatible versions. We > did > > this a lot in earlier versions of Kafka and it was the cause of much > angst > > (and an ingrained general reluctance to upgrade) from our users. > > > > I still think we may have to break things, i just don't think we should > do > > it for things like builders vs direct constructors which i think are > kind > > of a debatable matter of taste. > > > > -Jay > > > > > > > > On Mon, Apr 24, 2017 at 9:40 AM, Matthias J. Sax <matth...@confluent.io> > > wrote: > > > >> Hey Jay, > >> > >> I understand your concern, and for sure, we will need to keep the > >> current constructors deprecated for a long time (ie, many years). > >> > >> But if we don't make the move, we will not be able to improve. And I > >> think warnings about using deprecated APIs is an acceptable price to > >> pay. And the API improvements will help new people who adopt Kafka to > >> get started more easily. > >> > >> Otherwise Kafka might end up as many other enterprise software with a > >> lots of old stuff that is kept forever because nobody has the guts to > >> improve/change it. > >> > >> Of course, we can still improve the docs of the deprecated > constructors, > >> too. > >> > >> Just my two cents. > >> > >> > >> -Matthias > >> > >> On 4/23/17 3:37 PM, Jay Kreps wrote: > >>> Hey guys, > >>> > >>> I definitely think that the constructors could have been better > designed, > >>> but I think given that they're in heavy use I don't think this > proposal > >>> will improve things. Deprecating constructors just leaves everyone > with > >>> lots of warnings and crossed out things. We can't actually delete the > >>> methods because lots of code needs to be usable across multiple Kafka > >>> versions, right? So we aren't picking between the original approach > >> (worse) > >>> and the new approach (better); what we are proposing is a perpetual > >>> mingling of the original style and the new style with a bunch of > >> deprecated > >>> stuff, which I think is worst of all. > >>> > >>> I'd vote for just documenting the meaning of null in the > ProducerRecord > >>> constructor. > >>> > >>> -Jay > >>> > >>> On Wed, Apr 19, 2017 at 3:34 PM, Stephane Maarek < > >>> steph...@simplemachines.com.au> wrote: > >>> > >>>> Hi all, > >>>> > >>>> My first KIP, let me know your thoughts! > >>>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/KAFKA/KIP+ > >>>> 141+-+ProducerRecordBuilder+Interface > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> Cheers, > >>>> Stephane > >>>> > >>> > >> > >> > > > The information contained in this email is strictly confidential and for > the use of the addressee only, unless otherwise indicated. If you are not the > intended recipient, please do not read, copy, use or disclose to others this > message or any attachment. Please also notify the sender by replying to this > email or by telephone (+44(020 7896 0011) and then delete the email and any > copies of it. Opinions, conclusion (etc) that do not relate to the official > business of this company shall be understood as neither given nor endorsed by > it. IG is a trading name of IG Markets Limited (a company registered in > England and Wales, company number 04008957) and IG Index Limited (a company > registered in England and Wales, company number 01190902). Registered address > at Cannon Bridge House, 25 Dowgate Hill, London EC4R 2YA. Both IG Markets > Limited (register number 195355) and IG Index Limited (register number > 114059) are authorised and regulated by the Financial Conduct Authority. > > >
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