Le dim. 30 mai 2021 à 16:09, Qian Zhang <zhq527...@gmail.com> a écrit : > [...] So given the > active committers and contributors that we have in the community, I do not > think we can do anything big in the short term, instead we should do small > things to gradually activate the community. Here are what in my mind: > 1. Review and merge the outstanding PRs. > 2. Review the tickets in JIRA and select some high priority ones to work on. > 3. Add at least one new committer.
Yes I think it's important to mention, in response to Javi's point, that one doesn't need to be an hard-core C++ dev to contribute. The code base is actually very clean and easy to read, the main problem is the use of libprocess/actor model which takes some getting used to, especially for people who're more used to a reactor, green thread, etc models. The libprocess doc [1] gives a good overview. The stout doc [2] is also worth a read although nothing surprising about its design. But in any case I think there's a lot of valuable work which doesn't require any C++, for example as Qian mentions going through the huge backlog of JIRA issues. I know it doesn't sound like the most exciting thing but it would actually help a lot to do some triage, try to reproduce bugs, close stale tickets, respond to user questions etc. I remember seeing a few other people answering Qian's call for contributors a couple months ago [3], it'd be great if they could reach out if they're still interested - if not it's fine, I know we're all busy with our lives :). Cheers, Charles [1] https://github.com/apache/mesos/tree/master/3rdparty/libprocess [2] https://github.com/apache/mesos/tree/master/3rdparty/stout [3] https://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/mesos-dev/202103.mbox/%3CCABY6VOb%3DT8VxehVaS1YBrC5_odEwKhZzj3R4o3b-ykCytDw3JA%40mail.gmail.com%3E > > Please let me know for any comments / suggestions, thanks! > > > Regards, > Qian Zhang > > > On Sun, May 30, 2021 at 7:59 PM Zahoor <zah...@zahoor.in> wrote: > > > Hi > > > > Better to rewrite/redesign Mesos with a more popular language (like > > golang) to attract more developers. > > Just a mind voice. > > > > ../Zahoor > > > > > > On Sun, May 30, 2021 at 4:08 PM Javi Roman <jroman.espi...@gmail.com> > > wrote: > > > >> Totally agree that the main problem with this project is trying to > >> increase the developer community. > >> > >> From my point of view, attracting new developers to a project of this > >> complexity is difficult (C++ low level developers, creating Java and Python > >> bindings is not easy). However, if we try to broaden the objectives of the > >> project we may be able to attract other developers (not only C++ > >> developers) who can help. > >> > >> One idea I have always had is to incorporate the concept and technology > >> of D2IQ DC/OS [1], in this way we would continue the abandoned work of D2IQ > >> by extending Apache Mesos to a more user-friendly technology and broaden > >> the base of developers with interest in (ReactJS, Go, Scala, databases). > >> > >> I would be interested in contributing in this line, being able to apply > >> my knowledge in other areas, beyond C++ (which unfortunately I am not > >> proficient in). > >> > >> [1] https://github.com/dcos > >> -- > >> Javi Roman > >> > >> Twitter: @javiromanrh > >> GitHub: github.com/javiroman > >> Linkedin: es.linkedin.com/in/javiroman > >> Big Data Blog: dataintensive.info > >> > >> > >> On Sat, May 29, 2021 at 12:47 PM Charles-François Natali < > >> cf.nat...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> > >>> Hi Renan, > >>> > >>> > Renaming the topic because apparently we need to have this discussion > >>> again. > >>> > >>> Thanks for bringing this up again, because it is indeed still a problem. > >>> > >>> > Therefore, the PMC *must* add members or the project *will* fizzle out > >>> > and die. > >>> > > >>> > I'd also be curious to see if we even have enough PMC members to form a > >>> > quorum at the moment as I only see Andrei Sekretenko reviewing pull > >>> > requests on Github and the new chair Qian Zhang on emails. The project > >>> > needs three PMC members for the project to be considered in a good > >>> state > >>> > according to the Apache guidelines [0]. > >>> > > >>> > >>> I must say I'm also a bit confused. > >>> The new project chair was elected exactly a month ago [1]. > >>> Since then, the only thing I have seen - there might be more going on > >>> being the scenes - is a single thread calling for input on new > >>> technical direction [2], which as several people mentioned before is > >>> not the most important issue the project is facing right now. > >>> As far as I can tell, nothing as been done by the PMC/project chair to > >>> address the more fundamental issue of the health of the community. > >>> Now, Andrei has been doing a great job at reviewing MRs, but as > >>> mentioned before he only has so much time available, and the project > >>> can't have only one active committer. > >>> So it would be good to hear from the project chair what they are > >>> planning to do, if anything, to address this situation. > >>> From some private conversations I know that they have been busy with > >>> other obligations in the past month so maybe it's only a bad timing > >>> and just a transient state, however I don't think it's viable to > >>> continue if even the project chair doesn't have any time to dedicate > >>> to the project - not even replying to this thread. > >>> > >>> > At this point I suggest the PMC does a roll call and get Apche board > >>> > members involved so that they can be aware of the situation. > >>> > >>> I'm not familiar with the ASF but yes it does sounds like a possible > >>> course of action? > >>> > >>> Cheers, > >>> > >>> Charles > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> [1] > >>> https://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/mesos-dev/202104.mbox/%3CCAE0xwObaHPiSFM3KrY1SL--E864L48o_LF2E7PP2%3DUu3rk99gQ%40mail.gmail.com%3E > >>> [2] > >>> https://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/mesos-dev/202105.mbox/%3CCABY6VOaOxSp%2BeMJm_jSTdY%3DD5Qp%3DT%2B89Cvaxqw7GLbFYr1qzew%40mail.gmail.com%3E > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > > >>> > -Renan > >>> > > >>> > [0]https://www.apache.org/dev/pmc.html > >>> > > >>> > On 5/24/21 10:21 AM, Charles-François Natali wrote: > >>> > > Hey, > >>> > > > >>> > > Le lun. 24 mai 2021 à 14:12, Qian Zhang <zhq527...@gmail.com> a > >>> écrit : > >>> > >>> several fixing bugs which basically make Mesos unusable on a > >>> recent Linux > >>> > >> distro > >>> > >> Can you please elaborate a bit on this? Do you mean Mesos not > >>> working on a > >>> > >> recent Linux distro? If so, I think we can start to fix the issues > >>> and > >>> > >> maybe do a patch release for that. > >>> > > Yes, there are several issues on recent Linux distributions, e.g. > >>> > > Debian Bullseye: > >>> > > - https://github.com/apache/mesos/pull/387: compilaiton error, > >>> > > although it's only in master not in the last release > >>> > > - https://github.com/apache/mesos/pull/388: problem with the freezer > >>> > > cgroup based task killer which causes over a dozen test to fail and > >>> > > can leave the freezer frozen, tasks in uninterruptible state etc > >>> > > - https://github.com/apache/mesos/pull/384: problem parsing > >>> > > ld.so.cache which also breaks a lot of things > >>> > > > >>> > > You were tagged in some of this MRs, I tagged you in all of them, > >>> it'd > >>> > > be great if you could have a look :). > >>> > > > >>> > > Cheers, > >>> > > > >>> > >> > >>> > >> Regards, > >>> > >> Qian Zhang > >>> > >> > >>> > >> > >>> > >> On Fri, May 21, 2021 at 2:57 AM Charles-François Natali < > >>> cf.nat...@gmail.com> > >>> > >> wrote: > >>> > >> > >>> > >>> Hey, > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> Sorry for being a killjoy and repeating myself, but as mentioned in > >>> > >>> the past, I don't think that technical direction is the most > >>> important > >>> > >>> problem right now - community is. > >>> > >>> Coming up with medium/long-term technical roadmap doesn't do much > >>> if > >>> > >>> there are no contributors to implement them, and users to use them. > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> The following issues which have been brought up are still not > >>> resolved: > >>> > >>> - very few committers willing to review and merge MRs - currently > >>> only > >>> > >>> Andrei Sekretenko is doing that, and I'm sure he's busy with his > >>> day > >>> > >>> job so only has that much bandwidth > >>> > >>> - very few people contribute MRs and triage/address JIRA issues - > >>> > >>> AFAICT it's pretty much Andreas and me > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> So I think the first thing to do would be to address those > >>> problems. > >>> > >>> Some suggestions which come to mind: > >>> > >>> - to the remaining committers who'd still like to salvage the > >>> project, > >>> > >>> please take some time to review and merge MRs - > >>> > >>> https://github.com/apache/mesos/pulls has a few open, several > >>> fixing > >>> > >>> bugs which basically make Mesos unusable on a recent Linux distro > >>> > >>> - to the various users who've said they were interested in keeping > >>> the > >>> > >>> project alive: start contributing. It doesn't have to be anything > >>> big, > >>> > >>> just get familiar with the code base: > >>> > >>> * start going through JIRA and triage bugs, closing > >>> invalid/stale > >>> > >>> ones, tackling small issues > >>> > >>> * submit MRs so that the test suite passes on your OS > >>> > >>> * submit MRs to merge various commits you have in your private > >>> repos > >>> > >>> if applicable > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> Then in a few months, once the project is back to having a small > >>> > >>> active contributors base, they can together decide how to take the > >>> > >>> project forward, and start addressing larger projects. > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> Cheers, > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> Charles > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> Le jeu. 20 mai 2021 à 18:16, Gregoire Seux <g.s...@criteo.com> a > >>> écrit : > >>> > >>>> Hi, > >>> > >>>> > >>> > >>>> Interesting set of suggestions! Here are a few comments: > >>> > >>>> > >>> > >>>> * Mesos feels simple to deploy (only very few components: > >>> zookeeper, > >>> > >>> masters and agents), customization is done mostly through > >>> configuration > >>> > >>> files. I don't think there is a strong need to make it easier > >>> (even though > >>> > >>> I've used Mesos for years, so I'm pretty used to the difficulty if > >>> any) > >>> > >>>> * Having to manage Zookeeper adds some complexity but since > >>> > >>> Zookeeper piece is required to operate Marathon (which is our main > >>> > >>> framework), I don't see much value in the investment required to > >>> get rid of > >>> > >>> this dependency. > >>> > >>>> * Taking advantage of NUMA topology by default would be a > >>> good > >>> > >>> addition although I don't see it as strategic (at least we have > >>> solved this > >>> > >>> on our clusters with custom modules) > >>> > >>>> * I would love to see improvement on masters scalability for > >>> large > >>> > >>> clusters (our largest cluster is 3500 nodes and may start to > >>> suffer from > >>> > >>> the actor model) > >>> > >>>> Something that I see as a very significant drawback to the > >>> ecosystem at > >>> > >>> large is the difficulty to write frameworks. In addition to this, > >>> most > >>> > >>> open-source frameworks feel abandoned. Without good frameworks, > >>> Mesos value > >>> > >>> really decreases a lot (although it is very technically strong). > >>> > >>>> I think, making Mesos thrive would necessarily go through a > >>> solution to > >>> > >>> this issue. > >>> > >>>> Something that I'd see as strategic would be the ability to deploy > >>> > >>> complex workloads on Mesos without having to write a new > >>> framework. Random > >>> > >>> idea: make Mesos really usable as a backend for Kubernetes (as a > >>> virtual > >>> > >>> kubelet). This would remove a lot of barriers to use Mesos as a > >>> strong > >>> > >>> engine to operate a fleet of servers while allowing to use the > >>> Kubernetes > >>> > >>> API that apparently everybody loves. > >>> > >>>> What do you think? > >>> > >>>> > >>> > >>>> -- > >>> > >>>> Grégoire Seux > >>> > >>>> > >>> > >> > > > > -- > > ./zahoor > > > > Web: http://zahoor.in > > Twit: @jmohamedzahoor > >
