On 02/02/16 17:24, [email protected] wrote: > Hi, > > I'm the maintainer of Web of Trust [2] and Freetalk [3], which are the first > systems which will likely be deployed as installed by default for purposes > subject to what you proposed with PSKs.
As I understand it, Sadao is interested primarily in writing his own incompatible forums system with centralised moderation (i.e. the ability to remove users), at least as a first step? > > While I admittedly didn't take the time to fully understand all details PSKs, > I think I can nevertheless speculate the following about their general > concept: > > There are a lot of systems based on WoT already: Freetalk, Freemail, Sone, > FlogHelper, WoTNS, Infocalypse, and the ones I forgot about at [1]. > They share a common concept: If content is downloaded, it is downloaded from > the very same person responsible for it. This is to allow WoT to fulfill its > purpose of spam filtering by saying "person X is not trustworthy anymore" and > causing the content to be deleted then. I.e. we know who is to blame for > spam, > so we can just delete his stuff. We still know who posted something with PSKs. That's why we need a new key type: You can post if your key is signed by the owner's key (at least in Sadao's original proposal). > With PSKs, that principle wouldn't apply anymore, there would be many people > who have access to one keyspace, there wouldn't just one person be to blame > for spam. > This is a very disruptive change to architecture and thus would likely not > work with the existing foundation of all the existing WoT systems and cause > their 'core' to have to be rewritten. > So what I'm trying to say is: This would be *years* of work. I agree it would be a lot of work to adapt WoT to use PSKs. Mainly because of the complexity of creating groups of identities, detecting misuse of owner powers etc, all automatically. > And we've already spent years on WoT-based systems and they still aren't > finished to the point where we can ship them as default with the installer. > So I am preferring to finish WoT and its client applications with their > architecture as is, because the users want to finally see results. > Rewriting everything for yet another half a decade without having any > officially-installed-by-default forum system is not an option :( > And especially: The bugtracker contains sufficient ideas to make WoT and the > apps based on it scalable, so there doesn't seem to be a need to pull out the > optimization which PSKs are just yet. It is a lot more complex than the known > optimizations, since it requires throwing everything we have away. The known > ones would just improve upon systems as they are, they don't require as much > work. I don't see why it would require "throwing everything away". In any case, Sadao is perfectly entitled to build his own forums system. But as I've explained I don't have time to implement PSKs at the moment; maybe he will be able to. Of course he could work on something else, and that might be more productive, but if he wants to implement PSKs, that's a good thing. > Sorry. > > I'm nevertheless glad for your idea of PSKs,and it can for sure be an option > some day. Just please not now. > I'd rather wait for this until: > 1) WoT and a few apps based on it are finished and deployed. > 2) it turnes out in benchmarks that the simple optimizations did not help > enough. > > Meanwhile, if you do want to contribute some code to Freenet, notice this: > Nowadays, at [1], we've gathered a *huge* list of all known subprojects. This > should be a good tool to find something to work on! :) > Once you've found something, it would be nice if you could join us on > Freenode > IRC at #freenet. Most developer communication happens there. > > > Greetings and thanks for your returning! :) > > > [1] https://wiki.freenetproject.org/Projects > [2] https://wiki.freenetproject.org/Web_of_Trust > [3] https://wiki.freenetproject.org/Freetalk
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