Following up, I think it's important to understand the places the importer
is used for my team (and probably others who use a mix of tools)

The importers are rarely used as a "one shot" tool to convert a design
permanently from a different CAD tool to KiCad. Instead, we use the
importers persistently. For example, we directly add non-KiCad libraries to
the table (which triggers parsing them in many different places, as Seth
mentioned). But, we also use KiCad as a viewer for non-KiCad board and
schematic files. We open these files over and over again, and having that
open process blocked by a dialog is a real interruption.

I would expect dialogs to only appear when a serious error has happened
that is not recoverable. Information that KiCad does not support a certain
feature from an external file is not even an error, let alone a serious
one.

-Jon


On Sat, May 4, 2024, 10:20 Jon Evans <[email protected]> wrote:

> I agree that the information should be exposed somewhere. But I think
> interrupting the load process with a dialog is a nag. It gets in the way of
> using KiCad as an efficient way to view files designed in other programs.
>
> On Sat, May 4, 2024, 09:52 Jeff Young <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> I don’t agree.  A nag dialog would be something that told you we don’t
>> have an editing feature that Altium supports, not that we can’t express the
>> same end result as we found in the Altium file.
>>
>> There are certainly border-line cases.  Complaining about not being able
>> to import a datum dimension is a bit closer to an editing feature.  But if
>> it’s something like pad-stacks, then I’m going to have to make changes
>> somewhere to get the design right.  So I’d rather know about those.
>>
>> > On 4 May 2024, at 14:29, Jon Evans <[email protected]> wrote:
>> >
>> >> The only place we disagree is what to do in the meantime for
>> schematics and boards.
>> >
>> > Using wxLog to pop up dialogs reporting that KiCad does not support
>> > some feature of some other EDA tool is inappropriate in my opinion.
>> > It goes against the KiCad guideline of not showing nag dialogs.  I
>> > don't think boards/schematics are any different from libraries in this
>> > regard.
>> >
>> > On Sat, May 4, 2024 at 9:24 AM Jeff Young <[email protected]> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> We do report context info (at least line number and offset) in some of
>> the other importers.
>> >>
>> >> I agree that the system could be improved.
>> >> And I agree that we have to do something about the library importing.
>> >>
>> >> The only place we disagree is what to do in the meantime for
>> schematics and boards.
>> >>
>> >> Cheers,
>> >> Jeff.
>> >>
>> >>> On 4 May 2024, at 13:04, Jon Evans <[email protected]> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> Jeff,
>> >>>
>> >>> In both cases I disagree that the current warning system should
>> >>> appear.  The warning system we have today is really not that helpful,
>> >>> and I don't want to bring it back the same way for boards or for
>> >>> libraries.
>> >>> The advanced_config option was something Seth and I discussed as a
>> >>> simple stopgap for V8 if we are looking at something better for V9.
>> >>>
>> >>> A more helpful warning system:
>> >>> - Would not use pop-up dialogs that block the UI to let people know
>> >>> that any warnings exist (instead would show up in the info bar, the
>> >>> same way our previous-format-version warning does)
>> >>> - Would have a more rich system of logging, so that people always get
>> >>> context about what part of their file had an issue
>> >>>
>> >>> I think if we want to show this info, we need a new kind of REPORTER
>> >>> that can capture context rather than just a string, and a "post-import
>> >>> report" dialog launched from the infobar.
>> >>>
>> >>> The library loader can keep track of these on a per-library basis so
>> >>> that the infobar can be shown in the symbol/footprint editor after
>> >>> launch.
>> >>>
>> >>> -Jon
>> >>>
>> >>> On Sat, May 4, 2024 at 4:53 AM Jeff Young <[email protected]> wrote:
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Presumably we can tell the difference (in the code) between a
>> schematic or layout import and a library import?
>> >>>>
>> >>>> It would seem to me like a schematic or layout import should show
>> the warnings (even without an advanced setting or the like).
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Personally I also think the library importer should show the
>> warnings the very first time.  Maybe we could do that by setting a plugin
>> option (m_warningsShown or something) after reading the library?  I think
>> those are saved per-row in the lib table, but I’m not 100% sure.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Cheers,
>> >>>> Jeff.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>> On 4 May 2024, at 09:47, 'Stefan Weber' via KiCad Developers <
>> [email protected]> wrote:
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Hi,
>> >>>>
>> >>>> I recently started a discussion with @Jon Evans in my MR
>> https://gitlab.com/kicad/code/kicad/-/merge_requests/1935 regarding the
>> visibility of Altium importer warning & errors for not yet supported
>> schematic and layout features.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Since commit
>> https://gitlab.com/kicad/code/kicad/-/commit/83be5ba63d82e237b8944ee6ee7c639215b14027
>> the Kicad Altium Importer does no longer shows warning & errors for not yet
>> supported schematic and layout features in release builds.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> As Jon mentioned this was implemented to get rid of those annoying
>> warnings which pop-up every time you use an Altium library which contains a
>> not yet supported schematic and layout features. This I absolutely
>> understand.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> I also do not expect that importing data from other EDA tools will
>> be 100% accurate. But as the importer already knows it's limits I
>> personally would like to have the possibility to get those warnings and
>> errors back when I am importing an Altium schematic or layout.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Jon mentioned:
>> >>>>
>> >>>> "I would be fine with adding some new way to show these optionally,
>> in a less obtrusive way."
>> >>>>
>> >>>> "We try to avoid settings wherever possible. It is best to come up
>> with a solution that can be enabled for everyone, meaning that people who
>> want the information can get it in a way that does not slow down people who
>> don't want the information.
>> >>>> One option would be to create a "post-import report" that can
>> optionally be launched from an infobar notification, for example."
>> >>>>
>> >>>> "One pretty simple option would be an advanced_config flag that
>> changes the behavior of the WXLOG_REPORTER to use logging calls that are
>> present in release builds"
>> >>>>
>> >>>> I am curious what's the opinion of others.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Best regards,
>> >>>> Stefan
>> >>>>
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