Jason I saw your sed script to remove comments. That is that problem solved :-)
I don't have any problem with the docbook toolchain and wouldn't lightly consider changing it. I think it works well. There is some learning involved and a shortage of non-technical tooling but yet it works well. I would consider upgrading to 5.0 (or 5.1) as that might widen the scope of tooling available and would be relatively painless. But I agree that we need to focus on the concrete requirements rather than products. And most of all, the content. On 7 April 2016 at 14:40, Jason Pickering <jason.p.picker...@gmail.com> wrote: > Perhaps, but see my earlier mail regarding framework wars. > > This is the same discussion we are having about testing, use this framework > or that framework. However, there are still too few tests, as no one can > agree. > > We have something which works. We have content which needs to be improved > and updated. If there is a compelling reason to move away from something > which, albeit somewhat dated ...works, maybe it would be good to outline the > reasons for this change. > > > > On Thu, Apr 7, 2016 at 10:21 PM, Knut Staring <knu...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> I see that Flare supports DITA, would that be a good alternative to >> DocBook? >> >> http://dita.xml.org/ >> >> On Thu, Apr 7, 2016 at 3:16 PM, Bob Jolliffe <bobjolli...@gmail.com> >> wrote: >>> >>> On a spectrum between low-level standardized technical docbook through >>> to "user friendly" (use Word), vendor-locked proprietary and patent >>> encumbered technology, this one seems to fall on the far right :-) >>> Not quite what I had in mind. >>> >>> I can see the attraction but I would be very wary to go in this >>> direction. >>> >>> On 7 April 2016 at 13:52, Rachael Brooke <rach...@dhis2.org> wrote: >>> > Hi everyone, >>> > >>> > Cecilia and I have been thinking about trying out a new tool that could >>> > handle big documentation projects, translation files and other >>> > resources. So >>> > it's good timing that this issue is being raised by you. >>> > >>> > We were considering looking into a solution which you may know, called >>> > MadCap Flare: http://www.madcapsoftware.com/products/flare/. >>> > >>> > If you have any other suggestions, we'd be happy to hear your thoughts. >>> > >>> > Thanks for bringing this up - we're investigating! >>> > >>> > Rachael >>> > >>> > On Thu, Apr 7, 2016 at 1:42 PM, Knut Staring <knu...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >> >>> >> Would be good to hear from our new documentation experts (Rachael and >>> >> Cecilia) on this issue (what kinds of tools they would be comfortable >>> >> with >>> >> etc). >>> >> >>> >> Knut >>> >> >>> >> On Thu, Apr 7, 2016 at 1:30 PM, Bob Jolliffe <bobjolli...@gmail.com> >>> >> wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> Hi Jason, Lars >>> >>> >>> >>> I am not sure the link about oxygen nested comments is really >>> >>> addressing the "thing". >>> >>> >>> >>> I agree with Lars that having the "<!-- Created by Serna Free -->" >>> >>> text inserted into all our documents is ugly, wrong and misleading. >>> >>> If you are using Serna Free I think it might be a simple courtesy to >>> >>> just strip those comments before committing. Of course its possible >>> >>> to forget and maybe some sort of removal hook could be configured >>> >>> automatically (sed, xsltproc ..) but its maybe not so hard to just >>> >>> delete the line. >>> >>> >>> >>> I am not sure of what the problem is with oxygen encountering these >>> >>> comments are though. Maybe I also don't get the "thing" :-) I open >>> >>> the docbook files with oxygen and don't encounter a problem related >>> >>> to >>> >>> the comment. The docbook4 "type" seems to be immediately recognized >>> >>> and I get a Docbook4 menu appear when I switch to author mode whether >>> >>> the comment is there or not. Is it an oxygen version issue (I >>> >>> currently use 17.1) or is there some other issue I am missing? >>> >>> >>> >>> Though I think there are deeper issues at play. First is that Serna >>> >>> Free seems no longer to be maintained (as a free version). One >>> >>> consequence of this being that using it keeps us frozen in time at >>> >>> docbook 4.4. The last release of the docbook 4.x series was 4.5 back >>> >>> in 2006. The 5.0 (and now 5.1) series has been out for quite a long >>> >>> time now (2009?). AFAIK the only reason for sticking with 4.x has >>> >>> been the availability of Serna Free. >>> >>> >>> >>> (Which is not a small thing. The sad truth is that another good >>> >>> free >>> >>> candidate for docbook editing by non-technical authors hasn't ever >>> >>> emerged. Of course if you are more than a bit geeky then emacs does >>> >>> a >>> >>> good job. But even I don't use emacs anymore for editing docbook >>> >>> documents. I use oxygen, which is not free.) >>> >>> >>> >>> Two thoughts come to mind: >>> >>> (i) it probably really makes sense to rejoin the (docbook) world and >>> >>> move from 4.4 to 5.0. Particularly if the now defunct Serna Free is >>> >>> the only factor holding us back. I understand that there are >>> >>> transforms available to make this a painless journey. The best >>> >>> available in terms of free editing tools with a strong docbook focus >>> >>> seems to be the eclipse DEP4E plugin. Otherwise there are the >>> >>> non-free tools as well as host of xml schema aware editors. >>> >>> Admittedly none of these really qualify as eminently suitable for >>> >>> non-technical authors so the problem isn't really completely solved, >>> >>> but maybe improved slightly. >>> >>> >>> >>> (ii) more radically, it might be time to consider moving from docbook >>> >>> altogether. There are a host of "cool" alternatives (markdown and >>> >>> friends) none of which I am fond of, but they have enthusiastic >>> >>> supporters. To me they all seem like endless reinventions of >>> >>> roff/nroff/groff and certainly lack the maturity of docbook. But >>> >>> maybe the world has moved to a stage that its possible to consider >>> >>> editing html5/css3 documents directly? Certainly there is >>> >>> considerable user friendly editing tools available. And conversion >>> >>> to >>> >>> pdf seems not to be a problem. Though whether this would cause the >>> >>> clean structure of documents to descend into anarchy I don't really >>> >>> know. >>> >>> >>> >>> My 2 cents. I would certainly advocate (i) above (though admit its a >>> >>> strong response to just getting rid of Serna Free comments). (ii) >>> >>> frightens me quite a bit. Certainly would be a lot of work. >>> >>> >>> >>> In the end comes down to (i) who will do most of the documentation >>> >>> and >>> >>> what do they like or tolerate, (ii) what effort is justified to >>> >>> fiddle >>> >>> with what is really quite a nice looking set of existing >>> >>> documentation. >>> >>> >>> >>> For the moment lets at least agree to keep those horrible comments >>> >>> out. >>> >>> >>> >>> Bob >>> >>> >>> >>> On 6 April 2016 at 11:31, Jason Pickering >>> >>> <jason.p.picker...@gmail.com> >>> >>> wrote: >>> >>> > For instance, perhaps this >>> >>> > >>> >>> > http://www.oxygenxml.com/forum/topic3658.html >>> >>> > >>> >>> > which seems to describe a means of getting around comments. >>> >>> > >>> >>> > >>> >>> > >>> >>> > On Wed, Apr 6, 2016 at 7:01 PM, Jason Pickering >>> >>> > <jason.p.picker...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>> >> >>> >>> >> Hi Lars, >>> >>> >> I think there must be a way around this, and I would not be in >>> >>> >> favor >>> >>> >> at >>> >>> >> all of ditching Serna. Its a good tool and not everyone has access >>> >>> >> to >>> >>> >> a >>> >>> >> relatively expensive commercial tool like Oxygen. >>> >>> >> >>> >>> >> Serna Free inserts this automatically unfortunately when it saves >>> >>> >> the >>> >>> >> document, but lets look for a look around to deal with this in >>> >>> >> Oxygen. >>> >>> >> >>> >>> >> Regards, >>> >>> >> Jason >>> >>> >> >>> >>> >> >>> >>> >> On Wed, Apr 6, 2016 at 6:44 PM, Lars Helge Øverland >>> >>> >> <l...@dhis2.org> >>> >>> >> wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> re the documentation.The Serna editor horribly inserts a >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> <!-- Created by Serna Free --> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> comment in all files it creates before the DTD. This throws off >>> >>> >>> Oxygen >>> >>> >>> from detecting it to be a Docbook format. Lets not use Serna >>> >>> >>> anymore >>> >>> >>> or at >>> >>> >>> least make sure we don't get comments in the beginning of docbook >>> >>> >>> xml >>> >>> >>> files. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Lars >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> >>> >>> Lars Helge Øverland >>> >>> >>> Lead developer, DHIS 2 >>> >>> >>> University of Oslo >>> >>> >>> Skype: larshelgeoverland >>> >>> >>> http://www.dhis2.org >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> >>> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~dhis2-documenters >>> >>> >>> Post to : dhis2-documenters@lists.launchpad.net >>> >>> >>> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~dhis2-documenters >>> >>> >>> More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >>> >>> >> >>> >>> >> >>> >>> >> -- >>> >>> >> Jason P. Pickering >>> >>> >> email: jason.p.picker...@gmail.com >>> >>> >> tel:+46764147049 >>> >>> > >>> >>> > >>> >>> > >>> >>> > >>> >>> > -- >>> >>> > Jason P. Pickering >>> >>> > email: jason.p.picker...@gmail.com >>> >>> > tel:+46764147049 >>> >>> > >>> >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> >>> > Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~dhis2-documenters >>> >>> > Post to : dhis2-documenters@lists.launchpad.net >>> >>> > Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~dhis2-documenters >>> >>> > More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp >>> >>> > >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~dhis2-documenters >>> >>> Post to : dhis2-documenters@lists.launchpad.net >>> >>> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~dhis2-documenters >>> >>> More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> -- >>> >> Knut Staring >>> >> Dept. of Informatics, University of Oslo >>> >> Norway: +4791880522 >>> >> Skype: knutstar >>> >> http://dhis2.org >>> > >>> > >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Knut Staring >> Dept. of Informatics, University of Oslo >> Norway: +4791880522 >> Skype: knutstar >> http://dhis2.org > > > > > -- > Jason P. Pickering > email: jason.p.picker...@gmail.com > tel:+46764147049 _______________________________________________ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~dhis2-documenters Post to : dhis2-documenters@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~dhis2-documenters More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp