On Tuesday, 23 April 2013 at 01:06:49 UTC, eles wrote:
On Monday, 22 April 2013 at 23:35:56 UTC, Flamaros wrote:
The problem is not that D is usable or not as it is. The
problem is that, until officially "handled to the user", it
won't be taken too serious by the industry.
In other words, you won't find jobs as a D programmer.
C++ will improve more with the pending modules and other
features that do not even have to wait 2014 for that (a TR will
do the job). But the point here is not about C++.
The problem with D is that it's never finished. Everybody waits
for the next version. Everytime I spoke to my boss about D, the
answer was like: "hmmm... we'll discuss about it when it's
ready".
D1 was killed by a under-developed phobos and by the the
conflict tango-phobos, at least in part. What really killed D1
was the announcement of D2. And I have the feeling that after
D2 is rolled out, people will start working on D3.
That's the wrong approach. If it is usable as it is, then shift
the main effort on tools for it and on promoting it. Then, let
it in the market, get feedback from compiler implementors and
commercial users and formalize that as a proposal for the next
D standard. Then, after public scrutinize the proposed changes
for 6 months or 1 tear, implement them.
Only recently the focus was placed on implementing those shared
libraries. Really, who'd have been expected to use D in
commercial, large applications, without that support? Why did
people wait for so long?
Keep running circles around Optlink and other specific tools
just for the sake of them? I agree they *were* valuable, but
they *were*. Focus on the ldc or gcc/gdc implementation, for
example. Use that as the official compiler. Do not split
effort. There are a lot of standard tools that will facilitate
adoption, yet the effort is misplaced.
Put the current language version on the market, along with a
document summarizing proposals for the future standard and get
feedback from users that will start using it for real
applications, on large scale.
No need, for now, to make Phobos the best of the best. The
curse of Tango vanished. Ship it as it is, incomplete but
cleaned, then some libraries will be written and they will find
almost naturally place in the standard library, just as the C++
standard integrates parts from Boost, integrated STL etc.
Pursuing perfection will miss the good.
I couldn't have said it better!
