Below is the transcript of a committer's meeting held on #duraspace at irc.freenode.net at 20:00 GMT on August 19, 2009.
We intend to hold the next meeting on #duraspace August 26 at 16:00 GMT. In addition, there will be a jira issue review meeting on #duraspace on August 25; details will be posted soon. The #duraspace channel is logged, you can see past meetings (including Fedora Commons meetings as well) at http://www.duraspace.org/irclogs/ You can see the upcoming (weekly) schedule as well as other DSpace developer events at: http://www.google.com/calendar/embed?src=3mfp5qsv0kejvsbh558lmshujk%40group.calendar.google.com Or on the DuraSpace public calendar at: http://www.google.com/calendar/hosted/fedora-commons.org/embed?src=fedora-commons.org_o5iransoopr4i05f7ajpkab7ms%40group.calendar.google.com Anyone is welcome to attend. Meeting Summary: Updates from Andrea Bollini on Authority Control and Community Admin development, and plans to get them in 1.6. Review of proposed 1.6 schedule and approval. Embargo developing well. Planning for a jira issue review meeting. Discussion about what a PMC for DSpace would look like, and agreement to hold a public discussion about it at DSUG. Transcript: bradmc: Hi folks, let's get started in a few minutes. Topics? [4:01pm] bollini: authority control [4:01pm] bollini: 1.6 roadmap [4:01pm] bradmc: (Foundation is now ready with admin support for walking through back bugs, so maybe we can discuss that process) [4:01pm] bollini: community admin [4:02pm] stuartlewis: Yep - talk about the JIRA triage would be good. [4:03pm] ben_atmire joined the chat room. [4:04pm] rrodgers joined the chat room. [4:05pm] bradmc: I think we should lump together 1.6 status, roadmap, Jira triage; shall we do authority control, then comm admin first, then the 1.6 block, then progress? [4:05pm] stuartlewis: Sounds good [4:05pm] bradmc: Authority control then: Andrea? [4:06pm] bollini: we have a proposal from Larry [4:06pm] bollini: I'm working on it and it sounds really good [4:06pm] bollini: I have almost completed the JSPUI/postgres porting [4:07pm] bollini: we have received many comments from Dupriez and documentation about a different approach [4:08pm] bollini: but we have not received any codes and (as far as I know) the Dupriez code works on an old dspace 1.4 or less [4:09pm] bollini: with the Larry model and few changes that I have made we can cover the functional requirements of Dupriez [4:10pm] stuartlewis: Excellent - sounds good. Are you going to liaise with Christophe to check that his functional requirements are met? [4:10pm] bollini: the only think that remains out is the out-of-box SKOS "integration" of the Dupriez model [4:10pm] bollini: no Stuart, I haven't [4:11pm] bollini: I have check it by myself because there are the same requirements that I need for an us customer [4:11pm] stuartlewis: Do you think it can all be integrated in time for 1.6? (would be another great feature to be able to have) [4:12pm] bollini: I can prepare a patch for the 14th September [4:13pm] stuartlewis: Excellent [4:13pm] bollini: we need to test it and make some changes also to the xmlui [4:13pm] bollini: I'm working only on JSPUI and postgres [4:13pm] stuartlewis: And Larry is working on Oracle and xmlui? [4:13pm] bollini: yes [4:14pm] bradmc: Anyone disagree with that path? [4:15pm] bradmc: All of that sounds good; are we ready to move on to community admin? [4:15pm] bollini: I'm expect some comments after that the IRC transcription will be post to the list [4:16pm] bollini: about community admin: I have planned to complete the http://jira.dspace.org/jira/browse/DS-270 before the 21th September [4:17pm] bollini: I will appreciate if anyone can confirm the functionality list to make configurable [4:17pm] tdonohue: the authority control patch sounds fine to me...and hopefully it can be stable for 1.6 [4:17pm] tdonohue: wow...bollini, you've got a lot on your plate [4:17pm] bollini: [4:18pm] stuartlewis: Sounds great Andrea - thanks [4:18pm] bollini: I have also another big toast in progress... but I need comments by RichardR [4:19pm] rrodgers: the policy stuff? [4:19pm] bollini: I'm searching the jira number... is about thesis [4:19pm] bollini: yes [4:19pm] bollini: http://jira.dspace.org/jira/browse/DS-270 [4:20pm] bollini: have you had the time to look to the patch? [4:20pm] rrodgers: Yes, I will add some commentary. But the short answer is that I have no issues with moving when the policy is first assigned, but am concerned about having submitters set policies... [4:21pm] rrodgers: It's not a technical issue, it's more about usability [4:21pm] bollini: the big deal is that if we go ahead with this patch we will require a lot of update sql to fire [4:22pm] bollini: for the submitter we can make the UI simple as possible [4:22pm] bollini: anyway, It is only another opportunities to use or not [4:23pm] rrodgers: I'd like to see a design for that submitter UI.... [4:24pm] rrodgers: bollini: true, we do not have to immediately expose [4:26pm] bollini: ok, I will wait for your comments... anyway if we decide to include this in 1.6 we need a lot of test [4:26pm] bollini: especially using live installation [4:26pm] bradmc: Speaking of 1.6, shall we move towards 1.6 status / roadmap? [4:27pm] bollini: yes we are arriving to it [4:27pm] stuartlewis: OK - did everyone see my email with the proposed roadmap to an RC in October at the DSUG? [4:28pm] rrodgers: yes [4:28pm] bollini: yes [4:28pm] bradmc: yep [4:28pm] stuartlewis: Any thoughts about it? [4:28pm] mhwood: yes [4:28pm] stuartlewis: The two big things missing that we have promised to deliver are stats and embargoes. [4:28pm] stuartlewis: Can these be added in the next 5 weeks? [4:29pm] rrodgers: Emargo is coming along fairly well - I see no reason why not [4:29pm] stuartlewis: rrodgers: Great. Thanks. [4:29pm] mhwood: mdiggory is not here to comment on his stat. work [4:29pm] rrodgers: Also, do you want the OpenSearch stuff? [4:29pm] bradmc: mdiggory will be out this and next week. [4:29pm] stuartlewis: Nor unfortunately is Kim - I think he's tried out the solr stats. [4:29pm] mhwood: Yes please, OpenSearch. [4:29pm] bollini: what about the documentation? [4:30pm] rrodgers: mhwood: want to check it in? [4:30pm] stuartlewis: Jeff has been doing brilliant work with documentation Keep firing updates to him, and in return I hope we're fulfilling his requests for clarification. [4:31pm] mhwood: I think I don't have current sources. [4:31pm] mhwood: Your test site looks good, to the (very limited) extent that I know how to test OpenSearch. [4:31pm] rrodgers: I can supply, but I was just ribbing you [4:31pm] mhwood: /\/\/\ [4:32pm] rrodgers: yes, one can see it at dspace-test.mit.edu [4:32pm] stuartlewis: Ok - so as well as the 'big new features' we agreed a month or so ago to have a community JIRA cleanup meeting. We need to arrange that, and get it advertised. [4:32pm] bradmc: Yes, I'm happy to do that. Which day next week, and are we happy with the 6pm GMT proposed time? [4:33pm] bradmc: Tuesday? [4:33pm] stuartlewis: We agreed to dedicate 60 seconds per issue, and either discard it (to be done offline by a committer or DSpace intern), keep it, and if we keep it, decide if anyone has the effort to address if for 1.6. [4:33pm] stuartlewis: It will give us a work plan for 1.6 that will give us an indication of our progress over time. [4:34pm] bollini: Tuesday is fine for me.. better if 8pm GMT (as today) [4:34pm] rrodgers: I can do Tuesday as well [4:34pm] bradmc: Anything we decide to discard, I'll have our intern close the issue and try to contact the interested parties. [4:34pm] stuartlewis: Would a week on Tuesday be better 1st September to give people time to read through the issues, get any new issues in there, and make a date in their diary? [4:34pm] bradmc: I think we'll want to do this periodically. [4:34pm] bradmc: Fedora does it weekly as part of their committer meeting, but they only have to deal with 2-3 reports. [4:35pm] mhwood: Next two Tuesdays are currently open for me. [4:35pm] bradmc: I think that could work for us, too, once the backlog is gone. [4:35pm] You left the chat by being disconnected from the server. [4:35pm] You rejoined the room. [4:35pm] bradmc: So I propose making a start of it next Tuesday, and see how far we get. [4:35pm] rrodgers: what time? [4:36pm] bollini: starting from September 8pm GMT is needed... I can try to be present also at the 6gmt but I'm not sure [4:36pm] stuartlewis: OK - shall I draft an email in the next 30 mins, and get it sent to -commit for your approval? [4:36pm] stuartlewis: 6pm GMT seemed better, as it is easier for the Europeans I hope, and easier on us folks the other side of the world (6am is better than 4am!) [4:36pm] bollini: ok [4:36pm] mhwood: Thank you. [4:37pm] bradmc: Sounds fine. Who will we lose by moving from 6 to 8, (or who would we gain vice-versa; maybe Claudia?) [4:37pm] stuartlewis: Just to check - is everyone still happy for an end-of-September informal feature freeze, and the release of an RC in mid October? [4:38pm] mhwood: Yes [4:38pm] bradmc: Proposal: Tuesday 6PM GMT. If subsequent meeting needed, Following Tuesday 8PM GMT. [4:38pm] bradmc: stuartlewis: +1 [4:38pm] rrodgers: Yep - we can obviously make small adjustments if needed [4:38pm] stuartlewis: bradmc: Sounds great. [4:38pm] bollini: bradmc: ok [4:39pm] tdonohue: stuartlewis: +1 [4:39pm] tdonohue: bradmc: +1 [4:39pm] stuartlewis: My plan is to try and distribute DSpace LiveCDs (1.6 RC) at the DSUG and perhaps hold an informal testathon there. [4:39pm] rrodgers: bradmc: +1 [4:39pm] mhwood: bradmc: +1 [4:40pm] stuartlewis: Great - thanks. [4:40pm] bradmc: I think that's all the topics thrown out at the top; anyone care to add any? [4:40pm] stuartlewis: PMC? [4:41pm] bradmc: Sure, although I always find it a little weird having discussions without their proponent present. [4:41pm] stuartlewis: True. Maybe best leave it a week or two. [4:41pm] bradmc: Or do it now, and then again then [4:42pm] stuartlewis: My own worry is it adds another level of perceived hierarchy. [4:43pm] stuartlewis: And presumably we want to be flattening the hierarchies, and enabling more involvement from community members? [4:44pm] tdonohue: stuartlewis: i'd definitely agree to avoid a hierarchy and keep things flat to encourage involvement [4:44pm] mhwood: (From the proposal) "My idea is to see this entity be separate and orthogonal conceptually from those developers who have commit rights...." [4:45pm] stuartlewis: It will be interesting to see the community reaction to 1.6 - see whether they remember the fact that they had a voice in its development aims when they either talk/blog about loving it or hating it. [4:46pm] tdonohue: though to me, i wasn't thinking of the PMC as adding a hierarchy....just trying to gather together folks who have a current commitment to be active developers, and plan/manage releases over time as a group [4:46pm] stuartlewis: Because one of the main arguments has been the direction of the platform - being set by devs not users / librarians. [4:46pm] mhwood: I'm not entirely clear on its purpose, but it seems to me to be a group charged with making sure that important things happen, not as a checkpoint of any sort. [4:46pm] tdonohue: but, i can definitely agree, if done incorrectly, it could be perceived as a hierarchy [4:46pm] stuartlewis: Yes - I'm the same. It sounds a good idea, but I have worries about it. [4:47pm] bradmc: I read it similarly to tdonohue, although it's not clear to be whether it's a private club for developers, or if it's open to any community member willing to put the time in. [4:47pm] stuartlewis: I assumed it was for anyone? Not just devs. [4:48pm] mhwood: (From the proposal) "This committee would be comprised of a subset of the developers with commit rights on the DSpace SVN repository...." [4:48pm] tdonohue: stuartlewis: i see the PMC as helping that problem....it should involve both devs and non-devs.. My hope is that PMC could help ensure the direction is not being set *just* by devs [4:49pm] mhwood: Perhaps that's just to start? [4:49pm] bradmc: If it's the former, I think it assumes an ideal separation of developers vs. users vs. managers which doesn't map well to the practical world. If it's the latter, I think it needs to be immediately discussed in that context, including some of the thought leaders from the users side. [4:51pm] bradmc: Most DSpace developers are beholden to a particular set (or sets) of users and institutions, and thus have their agenda set in that fashion. A PMC for DSpace would seem to me best structured to explicitly acknowledge and use those agendas, as opposed to some separate developer only viewpoint. [4:51pm] stuartlewis: Agreed. [4:53pm] mhwood: I think such a PMC needs both folks who know what it will cost to develop something and those who are keenly aware of what it costs *not* to develop that. [4:53pm] bradmc: yes. [4:54pm] stuartlewis: Should we try and talk about this face2face (with IRC for those not present) at the DSUG (Friday afternoon - separate to a committers meeting, and open to anyone) and work out a way forward for post-1.6? [4:54pm] stuartlewis: (or Skype conf call etc) [4:54pm] bollini: I'm agree... we need no-dev folks involved in project management... I have proposed a no-devel people for the committer group some time ago [4:55pm] mhwood: I know that, without explicit user requirements, I tend to create stuff that is more interesting than useful. [4:55pm] bradmc: stuartlewis: +1 [4:56pm] tdonohue: stuartlewis: +1 [4:56pm] bollini: stuartlewis: +1 [4:56pm] stuartlewis: Maybe it would be good to try and find some new roles in the community - we have been lucky to have Jeff volunteer to look at the documentation - a job he is excellent at. Perhaps we need to do the same with project management etc? Maybe release co-ordinator should be a split job with a committer and a dedicated non-dev project manager etc? [4:57pm] bollini: goooood! [4:57pm] mhwood: A good idea. [4:58pm] bollini: we need a QA [4:58pm] bradmc: Interesting idea. It may also be that we just need to focus on the pre-conditions that enable that to emerge. Which is to say, make it possible for someone to self-nominate in the fashion that Jeff did. [4:59pm] bollini: we have already some name that jump to the eyes... see the testhaton partecipation [4:59pm] bradmc: One step in that direction may be how and where we call for the next release coordinator. [4:59pm] bradmc: That could happen out at -general, as an extreme change from -committ [5:00pm] tdonohue: as a small side note...We should make sure to really highlight what Jeff's done, when 1.6 is released (i.e. in the 1.6 announcements) [5:01pm] stuartlewis: Radical idea? Perhaps have a PMC in overall charge, scrap the committers group, and have 'developers' (who have svn commit perms), documenters, dedicated support people, project management people, graphic design / UI people - play to people's strengths, and let them be acknowledged for those strengths. Lower the bar for active participation and recognition. [5:02pm] bradmc: tdonohue: Definitely. He's already in a mention in the next newsletter. [5:02pm] stuartlewis: tdonohue: YES! (And everyone else too - there has been a lot of great work put in by a lot of individuals, and sometime we're not good at giving recognition where it is due). [5:02pm] tdonohue: yea...not only the newsletter though (though that's also due)...I was talking about highlighting some key people in the 1.6 release announcement [5:02pm] bradmc: stuartlewis: Now there's some fodder for that discussion at DSUG! [5:03pm] bradmc: tdononue: Oh, I agree, early and often was where I was going with that. [5:03pm] bradmc: We are at the nominal one hour mark. Close to wrapping up? [5:04pm] tdonohue: stuartlewis: yea, I'd actual be interested in considering the radical idea as well... [5:04pm] stuartlewis: tdonohue: Yes - we'll make sure that is done in all the announcements etc. [5:04pm] bollini: yes, I need to go in 5 minutes... [5:04pm] mhwood: Unless there are other topics, I think we've wound down to "these are all good ideas". (And they are.) [5:05pm] stuartlewis: Ok - I'll write the email about the JIRA event now (do we have a funky name for it?) - if you could all reply within 12 hours, I'll get it posted in 12 hours time so as to give maximum notice. [5:06pm] mhwood: It sounds like Minute Madness again.... [5:06pm] bollini: stuartlewis: ok [5:06pm] bradmc: Will do. [5:06pm] mhwood: Yes, will look at it tonight. [5:06pm] bradmc: See you folks on Tuesday. Thanks all! [5:07pm] tdonohue: bye all...good discussion [5:07pm] bollini: bye [5:07pm] mhwood: 'bye all [5:07pm] rrodgers: bye all thanks [5:07pm] rrodgers left the chat room. [5:07pm] mhwood left the chat room. [5:07pm] stuartlewis: Bye! ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Let Crystal Reports handle the reporting - Free Crystal Reports 2008 30-Day trial. Simplify your report design, integration and deployment - and focus on what you do best, core application coding. 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