That is a fantastic source of information and clears up several "gray areas" for me as a mod. It makes sense and puts to rest the idea of importing comms wholesale.
Alas, one of the reasons I was so keen on migration is that I don't trust LJ with my content, or the content of the comms I mod. I do backups, yes, but then what? Say the comm gets deleted, then what good is the backup if it is locked on my harddrive forevermore because I can't repost it anywhere? No, not actually looking for an answer, and the legal ramifications are not pretty either, but there you go, my concern in a nutshell. And it remains completely unsolveable -- the solution I THOUGHT was there, DW, isn't. At all. For very valid legal reasons. I can't even import the content much less be worried that it will be safe there or not, so end of the road. It really IS a deal breaker for me. I don't want to "go halfsies" with all my comms on LJ and my personal journals on DW. I'll get a DW account to reserve my usernames in the event that LJ goes "catastrophic failure" but I foresee that will be all. And alas, I think this will severely hamper DW's growth. Once major players realize their comms are not coming over with them, the allure to migrate will evaporate. I can't think of a single user feature that DW could offer me that outweighs the community involvement I have at LJ, and I know a lot of "non-super-users" will feel the same. :( ::::KBS / Mikey ~Always Blameless~ On Thu, Apr 9, 2009 at 9:17 PM, RLS <[email protected]> wrote: > I wanted to chime in on the importing communities debate, but I don't > feel like quoting all the relevant bits (oh, the pains of > digest-mode). So, please forgive me if this is a bit disjointed. > > Speaking (unofficially, of course) from the perspective of a > LiveJournal Abuse Prevention Team member, the core problem with > community imports is that the community maintainer who orders the > import is not requesting their own content to be republished - it's > content that belongs to other people, the users who individually > posted the entries in the community. The LiveJournal TOS is crystal > clear on the matter: section XIV, subsections 1 and 3 unequivocally > state that the content posted to LiveJournal, via any method, remains > the property of its author, and the author retains ALL rights thereto, > including copyright. > > This includes community entries. Community maintainers do NOT have > *any* rights to the content posted in the community other than entries > they write themselves, beyond the ability to delete (or reject, for > moderated comms) the content they don't want to have as a part of the > comm, and the ability to delete/screen/freeze comments anywhere in the > comm. They do not have the right to republish community entries > written by others on another journaling service. > > Yes, the TOS also states that the content posted to LJ may be hosted > in a variety of places, on third party servers, via RSS, etc., but the > author still retains control over the content because they can delete > it if they don't agree with how it's being used. Or, should they lose > posting access to the community or end up deleting/purging their > journal, they can ask the APT or LiveJournal staff, depending on the > situation, to delete it for them, and we will do so, because it is > *their* content. > > The loss of control over the content that has been posted is an > overriding issue, and is honestly much more important than the > maintainer's convenience in moving their community to DW. It's not > just a "domain change", it's republishing it to a place where you as > the original author no longer have control over it - you can't edit > it, you can't delete it, you don't have any control over comments > posted to it, etc. > > If DW were to allow community imports without any further > technological improvements, the maintainer who performs the import is > quite possibly in violation of copyright law by doing so, because they > are causing the original author's content to be reposted in a venue > which they did not originally authorize. (And yes, posting online > meets the definition of publishing under copyright law.) If LJ ever > wrote a journal importer (or implemented the one from the DW code), I > can tell you right now that they would never allow community imports > (at least, not if the APT has any say in the matter), for exactly this > reason - it's a copyright nightmare. According to LiveJournal's > interpretation of the DMCA, the APT would have to suspend any > community entry so imported if and when the author of the entry files > a copyright infringement notice. > > Comments are a gray-enough area as it is, but I think DW management > and the development team have done a great job of trying to give the > comment authors control over their comments. Unfortunately, the same > solution (OpenID attribution) just won't work for community entries > without a great deal of code work. > > --ryan (LJ teshiron) > _______________________________________________ > dw-discuss mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.dwscoalition.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dw-discuss >
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