Except when members of the public have access to the equipment - if there is no compliance to the CE Marking directives then there are likely to be serious liability issues - we need to see the case law but I would hope that successful prosecutions would be brought against any manufacturer that placed lives at risk by avoiding "due diligence".
Examples I usually give as Equipment under repair and recalibration - in training environments. Anyone visiting the UK Rapier training facilities would remember pieces of the military working in a classroom environment. Try it is not for sale but there is access to non-military and non-technical staff. The rule of thumb Should be .... CE Marking is to protect public safety - use of the procedures can reduce Corporate Liability - avoidance of the procedures will expose Corporations (and the 'Responsible' individuals) to (personal) liability. Gregg Gregg Kervill DipIM, MIMgt, MIEEE VP Engineering Test4Safety.com Inc PO Box 310, Reedville, VA 22539. USA Phone ( 804) 453-3141 Fax (804) 453-9039 http://www.test4safety.com/ -----Original Message----- From: owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org [mailto:owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org]On Behalf Of Speakman, Jim Sent: Friday, November 01, 2002 3:18 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: RE: CE marking/testing of military equipment To add to this discussion, I would point out to you the proposals of the Working Group Low Voltage Directive (LDV Update.2 Working Document), which proposes, within Section 7(2), Quote: ANNEX II EQUIPMENT AND PHENOMENA OUTSIDE TH SCOPE OF THE DIRECTIVE: This directive shall not apply to the following equipment: (a) Electrical equipment specially designed for military or police purposes. (b).....Unquote. If it is assumed that that proposal is accepted, then that will effectively eliminate any requirement to CE Mark military equipment. Regards __________________________ Jim Speakman (Design Safety Representative (Southern Sites)) Thales Defence Ltd Thales Sensors Manor Royal Crawley West Sussex RH10 9PZ > * Tel: +44(0)1293 644911 > * Mob: +44(0)7968 529439 > * Fax : +44(0)1293 644194 > * e-mail jim.speak...@uk.thalesgroup.com > __________________________ This e-mail contains confidential information for the addressee only. If a transmission error has misdirected this e-mail, please notify us on +44(0)1293 644911 and delete it and all copies from your system. You should not use, disclose, distribute or copy this communication if received in error. -----Original Message----- From: John Allen [mailto:ja014d7...@blueyonder.co.uk] Sent: Thursday, October 31, 2002 10:18 PM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Cc: Nick Williams Subject: Re: CE marking/testing of military equipment Hi Folks Sorry the first message today was incomplete - here is the full version: I fully support Nick's observations. In respect of the "comments" made by Gert, I would like to point out that the UK appears to be not the only Member country that has taken advantage of Article 223 , and those countries are "Full members" - not "half-members" - so those comments are unjustiable! Even more to the point, it should be remembered (as I pointed out in my earlier message) that many newer directives include specific exclusions for equipment for military and state security applications - so everyone else now appears to accept and agree that the UK stance and legislation on the EMC Directive is entirely justifiable! Regards John Allen Technical Consultant Electromagnetics, Safety and Reliability Group ERA Technology Ltd Cleeve Rd Leatherhead Surrey KT22 7SA Tel: +44 (0) 1372-367025 (Direct) +44 (0) 1372-367000 (Switchboard) Fax: +44 (0) 1372-367102 (Fax) (but sent from my home email address!) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nick Williams" <nick.willi...@conformance.co.uk> To: <emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org> Sent: Thursday, October 31, 2002 4:30 PM Subject: RE: CE marking/testing of military equipment > > The UK's position is consistent with the provisions of, inter alia, > article 223 of the Treaty of Rome and is therefore entirely legal. > > I shall not dignify the remaining comments by replying to them. They > are unworthy of a forum such as this. > > Regards > > Nick. > > > At 07:23 +0100 31/10/02, Gert Gremmen wrote: > >Hi Patrick, > > > >This text is British law,en the Uk is only a half member of the EC. > >This law is is not backed up by the EMC directive European Text. > >It is therefore contradictory to the EC membership requirements > >and theoretically illegal. > >But who will complain, as it is not creating trade barriers, > >and is limited to pure military equipment. > >As always, the British stand out in Europe, gaining from the profits, > >and not accepting the obligations. > >As Margaret Thatcher already said: Why else did God create the Channel ? > > > > > >Regards, > > > >Gert Gremmen > >ce-test, qualified testing > >Rotterdam, The Netherlands > > > >http://www.ce-test.nl > > > >-----Original Message----- > >From: owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org > >[mailto:owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org]On Behalf Of plaw...@west.net > >Sent: woensdag 30 oktober 2002 23:50 > >To: EMC-PSTC > >Subject: Re: CE marking/testing of military equipment > > > > > > > >Hi Gert: > > > >I made the comment about the UK based on the following information: > >http://www.emctla.org/Tech%20Notes/technical_guidance_note_33.htm > > > >2) I found the standard referred to at: > >http://www.hmso.gov.uk/si/si1992/Uksi_19922372_en_1.htm > >See section 20. > > > >PS: I love the Brits - who else would title the government standards group > >'Her > >Majesty's Stationery Office'! > > > > > >On Wed, 30 Oct 2002 20:48:18 +0100, "Gert Gremmen" <g.grem...@cetest.nl> > >wrote: > >>There is no ground to beieve that military equiment is to be excluded > >>in any country in Europe. This is definitely not the case in the > >>Netherlands. > >> > >>Regards, > >> > >>Gert Gremmen > >>ce-test, qualified testing > >>Rotterdam, The Netherlands > >> > >>http://www.ce-test.nl > >> > >> > >>-----Original Message----- > >>From: owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org > >>[mailto:owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org]On Behalf Of plaw...@west.net > >>Sent: woensdag 30 oktober 2002 18:49 > >>To: EMC-PSTC > >>Subject: CE marking/testing of military equipment > >> > >> > >> > >>I have a customer asking for CISPR 22 test results on a commercial power > >>supply > >>intended for use in military equipment in Europe. > >> > >>I've heard the UK excludes military equipment from CE marking. Do other > >>countries also exclude military equipment from the EMC Directive? > >> > >>If CISPR standards are not used for European military equipment, would > >>MIL-STD-461 be used? > >>---- > >>Patrick Lawler > >>plaw...@west.net > >> > >>------------------------------------------- > >>This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety > >>Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. > >> > >>Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ > >> > >>To cancel your subscription, send mail to: > >> majord...@ieee.org > >>with the single line: > >> unsubscribe emc-pstc > >> > >>For help, send mail to the list administrators: > >> Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com > >> Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com > >> > >>For policy questions, send mail to: > >> Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org > >> Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org > >> > >>All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: > >> http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ > >> Click on "browse" and then "emc-pstc mailing list" > >> > >> > >> > >> > >>------------------------------------------- > >>This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety > >>Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. > >> > >>Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ > >> > >>To cancel your subscription, send mail to: > >> majord...@ieee.org > >>with the single line: > >> unsubscribe emc-pstc > >> > >>For help, send mail to the list administrators: > >> Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com > >> Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com > >> > >>For policy questions, send mail to: > >> Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org > >> Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org > > > > >>All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: > >> http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ > >> Click on "browse" and then "emc-pstc mailing list" > > > >---- > >Patrick Lawler > >plaw...@west.net > > > >------------------------------------------- > >This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety > >Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. > > > >Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ > > > >To cancel your subscription, send mail to: > > majord...@ieee.org > >with the single line: > > unsubscribe emc-pstc > > > >For help, send mail to the list administrators: > > Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com > > Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com > > > >For policy questions, send mail to: > > Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org > > Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org > > > >All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: > > http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ > > Click on "browse" and then "emc-pstc mailing list" > > > > > > > > > >------------------------------------------- > >This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety > >Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. > > > >Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ > > > >To cancel your subscription, send mail to: > > majord...@ieee.org > >with the single line: > > unsubscribe emc-pstc > > > >For help, send mail to the list administrators: > > Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com > > Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com > > > >For policy questions, send mail to: > > Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org > > Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org > > > >All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: > > http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ > > Click on "browse" and then "emc-pstc mailing list" > > > ------------------------------------------- > This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety > Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. > > Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ > > To cancel your subscription, send mail to: > majord...@ieee.org > with the single line: > unsubscribe emc-pstc > > For help, send mail to the list administrators: > Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com > Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com > > For policy questions, send mail to: > Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org > Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org > > All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: > http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ > Click on "browse" and then "emc-pstc mailing list" ------------------------------------------- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on "browse" and then "emc-pstc mailing list" ------------------------------------------- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Ron Pickard: emc-p...@hypercom.com Dave Heald: davehe...@attbi.com For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://ieeepstc.mindcruiser.com/ Click on "browse" and then "emc-pstc mailing list" ------------------------------------------- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. 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