The question I would like answered is does Tormack make PathPilot an open source project or is it a proprietary wrapper on Linuxcnc? Murray
On Wed, 25 Jan 2023 at 16:35, Linden via Emc-users < emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net> wrote: > Well said. I see the same both in Europe and North America in all the > various fields of industry I deal with. > > On January 25, 2023 2:11:20 p.m. PST, Chris Albertson < > albertson.ch...@gmail.com> wrote: > >The root of the issue here is that LCNC is not a product. It is a > >development environment where a person can, with some effort, develop a > >product. > > > >Then the problem is that as a group, machinists tend not to have computer > >skills or much interest in learning computer skills. What we see on this > >email list is the one-in-the-thousand exception. Most machinists just > want > >to make parts and not futz with the tools, especially if the tools involve > >computers. > > > >We are still in a transition period. Today most machinists are older men > >who actually hate and resent CNC. They spent a lifetime learning to turn > >handwheels and now some voodoo-magic boxes they don't understand > completely > >outclasses their hard-won skill. The new class of machinist are > >different. They are more like engineers then blue color factory > >machinists. These new guys see g-code as the product and parts as the > >byproduct and most of this new generation is not used to making anything > by > >hand. > > > >We are still in the transitional period where we see a mix of the old guys > >who have adapted to new ways, new people who have never made anything by > >hand and the few of us on this list who actualy like to mess with tools. > > > >Torrmach did a good thing by turning LCNC into a marketable product. > > > >On Wed, Jan 25, 2023 at 1:30 PM John Dammeyer <jo...@autoartisans.com> > >wrote: > > > >> Hi Todd, > >> First of all that LCNC can run 8 head/spindle gang... machine has > nothing > >> to do with the subject line. > >> > >> And the grumble I often hear from people who have attempted or looked > into > >> LinuxCNC for their system is nicely summarized by your statement: > >> > >> " Linuxcnc isn't for everyone. The companies willing to support and > hold > >> the hand of a green noob who isn't interested in learning anything, > charge > >> accordingly." > >> > >> Or as generally interpreted by most: "F Off if you are a green noob and > >> can't figure out LCNC or Linux" > >> > >> Personally I think the theme of the original post and conversation was > how > >> easy is it to create a turnkey system that runs Path Pilot on non > Tormach > >> Hardware. > >> > >> IMHO, a lot more people would be interested in LCNC if there was a > simple > >> easy to follow, step by step method of setting up a 4 axis mill. The > >> menu's for setting up motors etc. in AXIS either for the parallel port > >> (almost extinct) or the MESA boards is really good but doesn't go far > >> enough. > >> > >> There are a few youtube videos out there that show how to select motors > >> based on mass of the system and acme or ball screw or belt reduction. > But > >> the learning curve is steep and is just easier with systems that are not > >> LCNC. > >> > >> John > >> > >> > -----Original Message----- > >> > From: Todd Zuercher [mailto:to...@pgrahamdunn.com] > >> > Sent: January-24-23 11:45 AM > >> > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) > >> > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Running PathPilot on non-Tormach Machines > >> > > >> > I'd like see the retrofit CNC package on the market (other than > >> Linuxcnc) that can run an 8 head/spindle gang > >> > router, with individual Z axis and VFD control for each spindle. I'm > >> sorry but freedom of customization comes > >> > at the cost of complexity. If you want the freedom to be able to > >> use/run almost anything, you're going to > >> > have to know something about both the hardware and software. You want > >> simple buy some simple 4 axis all > >> > in one stepper box and plug it in. > >> > > >> > Linuxcnc isn't for everyone. The companies willing to support and > hold > >> the hand of a green noob who isn't > >> > interested in learning anything, charge accordingly. > >> > > >> > Todd Zuercher > >> > P. Graham Dunn Inc. > >> > 630 Henry Street > >> > Dalton, Ohio 44618 > >> > Phone: (330)828-2105ext. 2031 > >> > > >> > -----Original Message----- > >> > From: John Dammeyer <jo...@autoartisans.com> > >> > Sent: Tuesday, January 24, 2023 1:39 PM > >> > To: 'Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)' < > emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net > >> > > >> > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Running PathPilot on non-Tormach Machines > >> > > >> > [EXTERNAL EMAIL] Be sure links are safe. > >> > > >> > > From: Andy Pugh [mailto:bodge...@gmail.com] > >> > > > On 24 Jan 2023, at 15:38, ken.stra...@sympatico.ca wrote: > >> > > > > >> > > > But seriously, in my opinion a major impediment to the widescale > >> > > > adoption of LinuxCNC is the lack of an appealing and intuitive UI. > >> > > > >> > > There are around 12 user interfaces. Are you saying that they are > >> _all_ terrible? > >> > > > >> > > >> > I'll jump in on this one. They are _all_ great and they are _all_ > >> terrible. > >> > > >> > Imagine your average home shop machinist. His kids are finally out > the > >> door and he's at an income level > >> > where he's got his lathe with a DRO and he just bought a small mill. > He > >> starts looking at CNC. > >> > > >> > At work and at home he uses Windows. And he's bought into the free > >> Fusion 360 con job for CAD/CAM and is > >> > now looking at how to add CNC to his mill. > >> > > >> > OMG. What a hodge podge of systems. > >> > > >> > So he starts on the various groups looking for what is available > >> including even AliExpress which has CNC boxes > >> > for $300. > >> > > >> > Not having used CNC before and not knowing anyone local the youtube > >> videos become his other source of > >> > information and education. The most interesting ones appear to be > ones > >> with 10's of thousands of > >> > subscribers that in fact are really long mostly to have multiple > >> advertisers. But at the time he's not aware that > >> > the videos are short on information, long on con for supporting lots > of > >> advertising. > >> > > >> > IMHO, the more advertisements in really long videos the more likely > the > >> poster is there to monetize than to > >> > actually provide useful help. How interesting to watch a milling > >> cutter for 2 minutes go back and forth > >> > making chips. Oh, and now another advertisement. > >> > > >> > So someone on a forum recommends MESA. > >> > > >> > https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fstore.mesanet.com%2Findex.php%3F > >> > > >> > route%3Dproduct%2Fproduct%26path%3D83_84%26product_id%3D215&data=05%7C01%7Ctoddz%40pgra > >> > hamdunn.com > >> > %7C040364ad9343477cf2fb08dafe3a6977%7C5758544c573f47cebee96c3e0806fb43%7C0% > >> > > >> > 7C0%7C638101824085494729%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiL > >> > > >> > CJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=QsuaNDdgukaAklsVBzraskOqkJrgDYP%2B7 > >> > e9BcWa62nI%3D&reserved=0 > >> > Hmm. Out of stock. And even if it were, there's no diagram like the > >> ACORN one. So no idea where to start... > >> > > >> > Oh but then someone suggests > >> > > >> > https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fstore.mesanet.com%2Findex.php%3F > >> > > >> > route%3Dproduct%2Fproduct%26product_id%3D381%26search%3D7i92&data=05%7C01%7Ctoddz%40pgra > >> > hamdunn.com > >> > %7C040364ad9343477cf2fb08dafe3a6977%7C5758544c573f47cebee96c3e0806fb43%7C0% > >> > > >> > 7C0%7C638101824085494729%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiL > >> > > >> > CJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=lNSWiCwuqqIMsYjHAEfR9JqJAjsWNK9DeF > >> > 9GsKztVJg%3D&reserved=0 > >> > > >> > Now I need to wire to it. A suggestion comes up for two of these and > >> cheap too. > >> > > >> > https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.aliexpress.com%2Fitem%2F33 > >> > 015669728.html&data=05%7C01%7Ctoddz%40pgrahamdunn.com > >> %7C040364ad9343477cf2fb08dafe3a697 > >> > > >> > 7%7C5758544c573f47cebee96c3e0806fb43%7C0%7C0%7C638101824085494729%7CUnknown%7CTWFpb > >> > > >> > GZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7 > >> > C&sdata=LclFcxiqe05h7ZMNmrFS3%2Fri1wQ7cRfBl1KFG0z51OQ%3D&reserved=0 > >> > > >> > Next motors and power supplies. What to buy? People rave about these > >> new step-servos. One brand in > >> > particular. But what size? Direct coupled or with belts and pulleys? > >> > > >> > So back to the internet and youtube. Ah, this guy has a mill like > >> mine. He used the Leadshine step servos and > >> > ACORN. Ordered, installed as per the youtube video. Making chips. > >> > > >> > And he doesn't have to wade through deciding which of _all_ 12 or so > >> LCNC user interfaces to use. > >> > > >> > The above is I think the typical thought processes. > >> > > >> > I'm still using AXIS. Can't be bothered to spend the time trying to > >> figure out whether I should spend $400 for a > >> > touch screen HDMI 21" screen or some other user interface. Really > miss > >> the MACROs from MACH3 though. I > >> > think that's what's called the conversational interface on Tormach? > >> > > >> > John > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > _______________________________________________ > >> > Emc-users mailing list > >> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net > >> > > >> > https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.sourceforge.net%2Flists%2Flistin > >> > fo%2Femc- > >> > users&data=05%7C01%7Ctoddz%40pgrahamdunn.com > >> %7C040364ad9343477cf2fb08dafe3a6977%7C57585 > >> > > >> > 44c573f47cebee96c3e0806fb43%7C0%7C0%7C638101824085494729%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJ > >> > > >> > WIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=R3 > >> > B7SVuYgzAgLRBVbhziV0q1g1QJi0lI1vbmlsoWvsA%3D&reserved=0 > >> > > >> > > >> > _______________________________________________ > >> > Emc-users mailing list > >> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net > >> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users > >> > >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Emc-users mailing list > >> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net > >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users > >> > > > > > >-- > > > >Chris Albertson > >Redondo Beach, California > > > >_______________________________________________ > >Emc-users mailing list > >Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net > >https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users > > _______________________________________________ > Emc-users mailing list > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users > _______________________________________________ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
