When you say that the expression "at that point in time", refers to a spatial reference in Time, I believe that we are tunning a different channel. There are no places or points or any spatial concept in Time, which still needs to be referred to two references. I dont think you are talking like: "Today at 8:00" was a "moment/point/place/anything" in time, are you. Whatever is Time's nature, (not clear to me, btw) has no spatial references, unless you talk about space-time, which is a concept combining space/time, and so a totally different situation.
Also when talking about text/software you made an obscure point, specially expressed for nobody's understanding, even if you work on multidimensional objects, the text itself cannot expand other than two dimensions, what leads me to see that you again did not get the question. Text is not that something you refer to but that you write, and I dont see how you can write in three of more dimensions. Please do not answer this with something like "a point...", also there are no points or places in text, or in Temperature, etc Finally I recommend you to keep it simple, which is always the hardest part On Dec 19, 12:37 pm, LCC <claylon...@comcast.net> wrote: > On Dec 19, 6:33 am, einseele <einse...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > Hi > > > Yes the story is good, and falls into the common situation where there > > is an important obstacle between the "I" part of any equation, and the > > object. > > > In other words, a classic subject-object relationship. In order to > > grip that object we find the something who stop us by definition, we > > ourselves. > > > Under certain point of view, this "we ourselves" is language. > > Undestood as the instance able to uncover the world by blinding those > > who need it as the only ridiculous tool available. > > > In another post you mentioned how a code line in a wrong position > > stopped your program and how difficult was to see a piece of text, of > > your own. Like if you wanted on purpose not to see what you yourself > > knew was there. > > > I'm a linguist and I'm interested in two dimensional objects. I'm > > referring to objects which need by definition two parameters, and two > > only. > > > Time looks like one of those if you think you need always two > > reference points. > > Any reference to time always needs duration, which is made of two > > references. Regardless physics, music, pseudo science, religions, etc, > > and even regardless if it even exists, time cannot be referred by one > > or more axes, but two. > > > Same happens with temperature, and other concepts, and importantly to > > me, text (I'm including here any conventional list of elements which > > only need to be unique and to have a unique position in that list) > > > Will appreciate your point of view as a software engineer, you deal > > with sequences, when you write you need to follow the order needed by > > the application you try to develop. So you are used to a bidimensional > > space as a writer > > > rgd > > > Carlos > > > On Dec 19, 2:25 am, LCC <claylon...@comcast.net> wrote: > > > > No responses? How about a joke... > > Hmm I suspect that English is not your native tongue, so I will try > not to use any ambiguous words. Although time DURATION requires two > points in time to exist, time references can be a single point, as in > "at that point in time, I ..." The statement would be the same > regardless of the time at which it was made, with no second reference > point necessary. As you say, time durations seem to require only two > reference points, however at relativistic speeds particles which decay > in low speed environments have been VERIFIED to decay at new half- > lives dependent upon the relativistic speed of their travel. So no, > the idea that time duration is defined by the two points of reference > is not sufficient, because you also must know AT LEAST the magnitude > of the velocity with respect to the observer of the object under > examination. > > In software there is an enormous freedom to innovate. The simplest > operations which a machine can perform are in the form of an operation > code (opcode) which is the "I" observing, and a source for the > operation to use to alter a machine state, or alternatively, a > destination such as in a clear register operation. Some operations > have implicit sources and destinations buried within the opcode rather > than being explicitly given as an opcode "argument". In such cases the > implicit information takes the form of a machine reference to itself > as in "my" arithmetic results flag register. I have not examined a > machine specific instruction set in the past 20 years, but in the > early 90s a trend was appearing to use what was called at that time > RISC (Reduced instruction set computers). In those architectures, most > of the "my" opcode implicit references were being replaced by explicit > opcode arguments which could take the form of either a constant, a > pointer to the information, a pointer plus offset, or a pointer plus > index and object size plus offset. More recently machine independent > languages have been developed with such names as "J" code which > replace "my" by "some abstract processor's" generally present > functional element, getting away from machine dependent opcodes > entirely. > > In general you are correct that machine operations need to be > performed in a specific order to attain proper function. However, > there has always been a recognition that unless a dependency or > coupling relationship exists between the output of an operation and > the inputs of another operation which occurs later in the code stream, > then the later non-dependent operation can be shifted to an earlier > point in the code stream. An enormous amount of effort was put into > algorithms to detect dependencies and wherever possible to shift > operations to the earliest point in time at which they could be > correctly executed, particularly in the case of operations inside > execution loops. I stopped writing software in 1993, so I cannot > report on the current state of the art, particularly that "object > oriented" philosophy which wants to enforce rigid controls over > information AVAILABILITY within functions. If it had not reared its > ugly head, then there would probably by now be global application > level optimizers which pre-calculate as much information as possible > which is needed within calling functions before function call so that > stack relative operations can be reduced, substituting instead clean > simple pointers to memory. > > The advent of multi-tiered memory structures such as cache on > processor chips introduced a new wrinkle to the optimization game, > namely the desire to use the same memory locations as often as > possible within functional code blocks, and relieved the processor > users of the necessity to generate what is known as "expanded code". > Expanded code is an attempt to reduce execution time by replacing > execution loops with the same statements over and over again, varying > only constants and pointers, while avoiding those time consuming > offsets and indexes. Expanded code was in danger of making recursion > extinct, which was probably why so many people in applications which > lacked time criticality despised it. More recently, we now have multi- > threaded architectures, which take advantage of multiple processors to > concurrently perform machine operations which are known to have no > coupling relationships. > > In summary, I was not aware that any software engineer ever had the > luxury of dealing with just a two dimensional space of neatly ordered > sequences of instructions. A particular processor on a particular > machine does not even have that luxury due to the pipelining of > instructions. Not only is the current instruction being performed, but > also the next instruction to be performed is fetching its arguments so > that it will be immediately ready for execution when its turn comes. > Further along the pipeline looking ahead to future instructions you > have instructions being fetched from cache, or in the worst case from > memory, requiring the cache processor to negotiate with itself over > what gets overwritten as least likely to be called upon soon, and with > memory controllers regarding how big of a chunk of memory the cache > needs to have delivered to it, from what location. Pipeline control is > a topic with which I am somewhat familiar, having worked on > development of instruction test sequences for the SJS version of the > RS6000 chip set in 1989-1990. That task required reading the standard > cell code being written to generate the chip architecture, locating > vulnerabilities and oversights in the design, and coming up with > opcode sequences to demonstrate the defects so that the chip designers > could develop a defect free chip design. > > Lonnie Courtney Clay -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Epistemology" group. To post to this group, send email to epistemol...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to epistemology+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/epistemology?hl=en.
