And you have written some great books too!
This is a very special group.
John
Sent from my iPhone
On Sep 6, 2010, at 5:19 PM, [email protected] wrote:
I, too, am a practicing lawyer, primarily on the defense side in
aviation litigation. I totally agree with Mr. Burwells' comments.
One of the members of this group is a sitting United States District
Court judge. He is an active pilot whom I've for decades.
I seriously doubt that many of us are "sue happy".
Jerry Eichenberger
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
From: <[email protected]>
Sender: [email protected]
Date: Mon, 6 Sep 2010 17:52:48 -0400
To: <[email protected]>
ReplyTo: [email protected]
Subject: RE: [ercoupe-tech] Re: mechanical research [was re: fuel
pump bolt tor que]
First let me say that I own and fly an Ercoupe. I have been a
lawyer for 50 years. Although I am still licensed to practice, I am
now basically retired. I don’t have some big pile of money that I g
ot by exploiting or stealing from other people or by pursuing spurio
us, non meritorious lawsuits so as to harass or just to extort money
out of people because of my own greed.
I also served my country. I was a jet fighter pilot in the U.S. Air
Force and retired out of the Reserves at the rank of Lt. Col. I’m a
80 year old widower and live in a 1,000 sq. foot condominium unit o
n Social Security and a small Air Force pension just like most other
elderly do. I consider myself lucky that I can barely afford to ow
n, maintain and occasionally fly my Ercoupe.
Now I can laugh at a good lawyer joke just as well as the next guy,
but I notice people are quick (but usually not quick enough) to seek
out a lawyer when they are in some sort of personal, financial, or
legal jeopardy. I do acknowledge that there are some lawyers who
engage in sharp practice, and/or whose ethics are at best,
questionable.
Yes, anyone with the price of a lawsuit can sue anyone for anything
but in most, if not all states a lawyer who should have known his/
her lawsuit had no merit can be fined in money damages and
sanctioned with other penalties and costs. In some state, the loser
pays all.
I hasten to say that I have not read all of the string of comments
being made about the feared legal liability for sharing, or perhaps
placing for sale in commerce this so called “contra-band” or fear
about possible “criminal” penalties for copyright infringement,
fraudulent registration, fraudulent claims, or misuse of copyright,
perhaps trademark or patent infringement.
One more thing I should mention: Copyright, Trademark and Patent law
is not my area of expertise. That said, I’m trying to ascertain pre
cisely what this material is that everyone is talking about. Is it t
he index that William R. Bayne has compiled over a number of years,
it being his own work product to reference various source materials,
manuals, AD’s, etc., that would be beneficial for other members of
the Forum to share?
If he intends to sell his index; i. e., place it in interstate
commerce and it is entirely his own work product in my opinion he
can copyright it himself without legal exposure even though it might
make reference to documents that are themselves copyrighted or
already in the public domain. If he intends to quote verbatim
material authored and copyrighted by others he may need their
permission and have to include that permission by reference to the
copyrighted source. His own copyright will be protected as long as
this index is his own creation and he is therefore the first to put
it into commerce.
Certainly he would be wise to get advice from a patent lawyer on the
subject. But, as far as Ercoupe owners who are lawyer predators who
are by the way probably going to benefit by being able to share the
information compiled by him just waiting to pounce on their fellow
Ercoupe owners with frivolous lawsuits, please give me a break!
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:ercoupe-
[email protected]] On Behalf Of William R. Bayne
Sent: Monday, September 06, 2010 5:32 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [ercoupe-tech] Re: mechanical research [was re: fuel
pump bolt tor que]
All,
I think Dave carefully read my concern(s) and had a bit of fun with
"tongue in cheek". The "legal perspective" of almost anything is
one or more "bubbles off" from the world in which most of us live.
Unfortunately, Dave is 100% right when he cautions any and all to
"look down the road" in neighborhoods would likely not choose to
travel lest we be dragged down an alley and assaulted. I welcome
his comments and am attempting give each due consideration.
Human beings tend to generally separate into two "camps". By far
the largest is those who focus on what can't be done. The distinct
minority are those who pay only sufficient attention to how
something can't be done so as to avoid the potholes that have
adversely affected others whose common goal is one or more ways it
CAN be done (and preferably at some profit at some stage by someone).
I believe I can gather and publish with minimum risk a Personal
Ercoupe Technical Bibliography (Annotated). This would be, by
definition, my personal index of subjects cross-referenced to
sources that, in my sole opinion, constitute the best information
available of use to those who own and/or maintain Ercoupe, Forney
and Alon aircraft. It would be clearly identified as the product of
a layman NOT professionally trained or certified in aviation
maintenance in any specialty other than by dedicated and reasonably
thorough reading.
Accordingly, I should not be "accountable" to any professional
standard as to the perfection or completeness of my personal
observations, offered exclusively (as a "premium", like the cups, T-
shirts, CDs and DVDs on Public Television) to those willing to
contribute at a certain "level" (or more) to the ongoing operational
expenses of the Texas Ercoupe Museum, soon to be incorporated as a
501(c)(3) educational non-profit organization. Several years ago I
attempted to set up a committee that might perpetuate such efforts
(I just turned seventy). From that experience I can personally
confirm that such a committee becomes a cul-de-sac into which good
ideas are diverted and then quietly strangled by competing egos.
The Ercoupe Parts Manual, Service Manual and Bulletins and Memoranda
are generally information that has been available publicly before
1950 and respective copyrights of this early material not timely
renewed by the succession of owners. That is how one can buy the
original versions from Wag-Aero and Essco, among other sources.
CAA/FAA publications would seem to be in the public domain being a
work product represented and disseminated in the public interest by
persons whose salaries are paid by all taxpayers.
As to individual Service Bulletins, etc., Manuals and the like from
Forney, Alon and Mooney, it is my understanding that facts cannot be
copyrighted. Only a specific presentation is subject to copyright.
All "FAA Approved Flight Manuals" are similar (for clarity) between
aircraft and manufacturers (just as are, today, certain instrument
and control layouts). Such publications are, by definition
educational in nature. The "educational exemption" to strict
author's rights of reproduction would seem appropriate for any judge
and/or jury to accord any good-faith attempt at wider and clearer
dissemination of information important to the safe operation of
aircraft (whether specific or or in general).
Such efforts, so long as they are not hopelessly incompetent or
motivated by personal greed, should improve the preexisting level of
compliance with authoritative maintenance and operational
information sources. It would seem appropriate to claim such
publication (clearly credited as to source) could reasonably be
expected to improve the awareness of both owners and mechanics such
that "safety of flight" is increased in the overall. I would,
therefore, expect such publication to be deemed more "in the public
interest" than any author's rights as would pertain to brief
references to and from a given original publication.
At the end of the day, the Texas Ercoupe Museum will never have the
"deep pockets" to attract the professional attention of an ambitious
attorney ;<)
Regards,
William R. Bayne
.____|-(o)-}____.
(Copyright 2010)
--
On Sep 6, 2010, at 11:47, Ed Burkhead wrote:
David,
Correct me if I'm wrong, please.
I think it is safe to publish an index saying WHERE to find
information provided that you write it in your own words. Would
this not be legal and safe?
What is the legality of posting an actual copy of public government
documents, i.e. TCDS A-787?
Ed
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