EV Digest 2681
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: Emergency Tow Service
by "Richard Furniss" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: Corbin Motors (makers of the Sparrow) seems to have gone under
by Sam Harper <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: RAV4 EV gets 104 mpg
by John RA Benson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: Corbin Motors (makers of the Sparrow) seems to have gone
under
by "John G. Lussmyer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: WOT! Monster cars was:( Better range from less weight)
by David Dymaxion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: Evercells versus Yellow tops
by Rich Rudman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: Evercel Capacity
by Rich Rudman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Tranny Removal with Frozen Engine
by David Dymaxion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: WOT! Monster cars was:( Better range from less weight)
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
10) TdS Report #2: 40 Entrants, So Far
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
11) Re: Tranny Removal with Frozen Engine
by Peter VanDerWal <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: Tranny Removal with Frozen Engine
by "garry" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: Tranny Removal with Frozen Engine
by Seth Murray <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) test, please ignore
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
15) Tour de Sol
by Bruce EVangel Parmenter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) RE: Emergency Tow Service
by David Brandt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: Tranny Removal with Frozen Engine
by Otmar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) motor voltage readings
by Jim Coate <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: Tranny Removal with Frozen Engine
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
20) CARB meeting web cast 03/27-28/03 @9AM
by Bruce EVangel Parmenter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: motor voltage readings
by Peter VanDerWal <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Autoette for sale
by "Darryl McMahon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Request for Info re: Electra King
by "Darryl McMahon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: WOT! Monster cars was:( Better range from less weight)
by Peter VanDerWal <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: Tour de Sol
by Jim Coate <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) Re: motor voltage readings
by "garry" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) EPRI EV Study Released Today....
by "Melanie Savage" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
28) Sob... I didn't fry the motor it was the controller..
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
29) EPRI EV Study Link.
by Otmar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
30) AC Sparrow on eBay
by "The Levine Family" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
31) Re: AC Sparrow on eBay
by "Christopher Zach" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
32) Re: motor voltage readings
by Jim Coate <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
33) Re: motor voltage readings
by Peter VanDerWal <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
I also use AAA, one hundred free miles with two people on the plan for about
$20.00 more than what your paying. It has already paid for it's self this
year ;-)
www.lasvegasev.com
Richard Furniss
Las Vegas, NV
1986 Mazda EX-7 192v
1981 Lectra Centauri 108v
3 Wheel Trail Master 12v
Board Member, www.lveva.org
Las Vegas Electric Vehicle Association
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bruce EVangel Parmenter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Wednesday, March 26, 2003 3:21 AM
Subject: Emergency Tow Service
> I have been using AAA membership Emergency Tow Service.
> I am not talking insurance, I am POSTing about Emergency
> Tow Services.
>
> This year's bill will be $78 for a free 100 mile emergency
> service.
>
> I would like to know if other EV drivers have a tow service.
> If so, what company do they use, how much is it per year,
> and what services do they get?
>
> Since no one is hiring, I thought I would see if I could
> $ave on another Emergency Tow Service.
>
> =====
> ' ____
> ~/__|o\__
> '@----- @'---(=
> . http://geocities.com/brucedp/
> . EV List Editor & RE newswires
> . (originator of the above ASCII art)
> =====
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop!
> http://platinum.yahoo.com
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Their phone system picked up for me.
-Sam Harper
On Wednesday, March 26, 2003, at 12:33 PM, John G. Lussmyer wrote:
It's being discussed on the Sparrow list that Corbin Motors seems to
have quietly shutdown.
There have been no cars in the parking lot this week, and they aren't
answering their phones - which were disconnected last week for a while
due to lack of payment.
So, anyone know how to verify the stat of the company?
--
John G. Lussmyer mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Dragons soar and Tigers prowl while I
dream.... http://www.CasaDelGato.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
It is rather misleading that they don't state "Petroleum-Equivalent Fuel
Economy". This is probably the source of their calculations:
http://frwebgate5.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/waisgate.cgi?WAISdocID=70149925280+
16+0+0&WAISaction=retrieve
10CFR474.5 - sample calculation:
" Example 1: An electric vehicle is tested in accordance with
Environmental Protection Agency procedures and is found to have an Urban
Dynamometer Driving Schedule energy consumption value of 265 Watt-hours
per mile and a Highway Fuel Economy Driving Schedule energy consumption
value of 220 Watt-hours per mile. The vehicle is not equipped with any
petroleum-powered accessories. The combined electrical energy
consumption value is determined by averaging the Urban Dynamometer
Driving Schedule energy consumption value and the Highway Fuel Economy
Driving Schedule energy consumption value using weighting factors of 55
percent urban, and 45 percent highway:
combined electrical energy consumption value = (0.55 * urban) + (0.45 *
highway) = (0.55 * 265) + (0.45 * 220) = 244.75 Wh/mile
Since the vehicle does not have any petroleum-powered accessories
installed, the value of the petroleum equivalency factor is 82,049 Watt-
hours per gallon, and the petroleum-equivalent fuel economy is:
(82,049 Wh/gal) (244.75 Wh/mile) = 335.24 mpg"
jrab
On 3/25/03 9:55 PM, "Bruce EVangel Parmenter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I was looking at the numbers for the cost of fuel
> and electricity on that page
> http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/noframes/16424.shtml
>
> I did not see where they got the mpg figure.
> I would have wanted their equation of where the came
> up with that mpg.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 12:54 PM 3/26/2003 -0500, Sam Harper wrote:
Their phone system picked up for me.
Yeah, a couple people have mentioned that. It's just that you never get
ahold of anybody - of course that's no real indicator as you generally
never did get ahold of anybody.
Not having cars in the parking lot anymore seems to be a fair indicator
that they may have gone under though.
--
John G. Lussmyer mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Dragons soar and Tigers prowl while I dream.... http://www.CasaDelGato.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
http://www.usbody.com
Disclaimer: No connection to this company. They make fiberglass
bodies and body parts. One of their suggestions is to put the bodies
on S10 Chassis, looks like alot of work. Some of their bodies go
right on the original frames, like the full sized Blazer.
They claim to take 1500 lbs off a full size chevy truck by going to a
fiberglass body and bed. They also make fiberglass front ends for S10
trucks, might be a way for Bruce to lighten his EV.
--- Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> ...
> However, it's the concept I find interesting. Start with a truck
> frame
> that already has the wheels, brakes, springs, suspension, and
> weight
> carrying capacity. Place a small light streamlined car body on it.
> Use
> the weight savings to add more batteries than could have been
> safely
> carried by the original car or truck.
> ...
=====
__________________________________________________
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Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop!
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Gordon Niessen wrote:
>
> I had the impression that the NiZN did not like the beefy current levels
> that most EV's pull. Isn't its internal resistance much higher? Which,
> when in a 13-18 battery string in compounded. Can you even draw the 200+
> amps from a NiZN?
>
> At 05:37 PM 3/24/2003, you wrote:
Most certainly I have drawn over 500 amps from the M100 after a couple
of commisioning cycles.
The new MB100s are rated to 400 amps, up from 250 on the M100. So....
using Madmans logic we should be able to get 800 amps for brief pulls.
This is now up in the AGM Optima level.
So... they are looking ever better. Expect to have some real data soon.
I wish Sheer would get his Honda running and some real cycle data on it.
It runs, I know, but he doesn't run it every day.
--
Rich Rudman
Manzanita Micro
www.manzanitamicro.com
1-360-297-7383,Cell 1-360-620-6266
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
fred whitridge wrote:
>
> The other day Joe Smalley questioned Billg about where he came up with the capacity
> of an
> Evercel MB80 as being 64Ahr. I think he found it in the specs on their website at:
>
> http://www.evercel.com/manufacturing.html
>
> That's whats so interesting about your life cycle testing on a damaged battery
> which, last
> time i looked, still had capacities above this. These guys must not know that there
> are
> "Liars, damn liars, and battery manufacturers" in that order.
OH they do know about the black brush of the "Battery Manufacturer"
That's why they don't claim the long life that we should get, and what
less than %100 DOD does for long life.
They know that if they claim too much they will get ignored.
If we don't get 1000s of cycles I will be surprised.
Though it's not clear that this EV community knows of every way to Kill
a Evercell, we will know a LOT more in the coming months. It looks very
good.
By the way MB80s are NOT Optima drop ins. Un fortuneatly
--
Rich Rudman
Manzanita Micro
www.manzanitamicro.com
1-360-297-7383,Cell 1-360-620-6266
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I want to separate the transmission from the motor on my 1977 Porsche
911S. My manual says to put bolts in three spots on the flywheel,
through the starter hole, to relieve tension. You need to turn the
motor to get to each of the three spots. Then you are supposed to
turn the throwout bearing, so the release fork can clear. Then,
finally, you can loosen the transmission to engine bolts and separate
the two.
My problem is my motor is seized up solid, so I can't turn it. If I
just loosen the motor to tranmission bolts, is that OK? Or is there a
gotcha by doing that? Thanks for the advice.
=====
__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop!
http://platinum.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
* LP8.2: HTML/Attachments detected, removed from message *
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
TdS Report #2: 40 Entrants, So Far
Who will be in the 2003 Tour de Sol? The March 21st edition of
http://www.nesea.org/transportation/tour/2003entrants.html
tells us that there are forty vehicles signed up so far.
Those who have followed the Tour in years past will notice some old friends in
the field. New Hampshire Technical Institute's "Sungo" returns for the
umpteenth time. As does Cato-Meridian High School's "SunPacer". It will be
interesting to see what has changed and what remains the same. Some of the
original ideas have stood the tests of time. For instance "Sungo" has had a
pair of separately controlled motors for the rear wheels since at least 1993,
but the motor drivers and linkages from those motors to the wheels have changed
several times.
And there will be old friends with new wheels. For one, the UEHS (Union-
Endicott High School) Solar/Electric Car Team intends to bring two cars we have
not seen before.
We'll see 1-person motor cycles and a hybrid-electric bus.
We'll see "traditional" home-built EVs and Detroit's vision of the future.
We'll see grid-charged-electrics, solar-electrics, and hybrid electrics.
We'll see bio-fueled vehicles.
The message? That there are many ways to build vehicles that are more earth-
friendly and sustainable.
So make your plans to visit one of the Festival locations. Ooogle the cars,
trucks, bikes, and buses. Chat up the teams. Find out what they are doing and
why.
- - - - - - - - -
From
http://www.nesea.org/transportation/tour/2003entrants.html
2003 Tour de Sol
The Great American Green Transportation Festival
Entrants
VEHICLES PARTICIPATING in the 2003 Tour de Sol (as of March 21, 2003)
VEHICLES BUILT BY MANUFACTURERS: 12 entrants
CC Probester
(2003 Civic Hybrid: Hybrid: Gas-electric)
Concord Consortium
Grafton, MA
DaimlerChrysler
(2002 GEM: Electric neighborhood vehicle)
Auburn Hills, MI
DaimlerChrysler TBA
(TBA)
Auburn Hills, MI
Allison parallel hybrid electric drive bus
(Orion VII: Hybrid: Diesel-electric)
Allison Transmission
Roxbury, CT
http://www.allisontransmission.com/
GM TBA
(TBA)
General Motors
Warren, MI
GM Hy-Wire
(Prototype fuel cell vehicle)
General Motors
Warren, MI
(Washington, DC only)
http://www.gm.com/company/gmability/environment/products/fuel_cells/hywire_081402.html
Honda Insight
(2001 Honda Insight: Hybrid: Gas-electric)
Will Nixon
Accord, NY
TBA
(TBA)
China, Amtech
Whitby, ON
Toyota Prius
(2001 Toyota Prius: Hybrid: Gas-electric)
S&S Auto Sport
Tulsa, OK
Toyota Prius
(2002 Toyota Prius: Hybrid: Gas-electric)
Toyota Motor Sales, USA
Torrance, CA
http://www.toyota.com/html/shop/vehicles/prius/index.html
VW TBA VW TBA
(1996 VW Passat: Biodiesel)
TDIclub.com/BiodieselNow.Com
Sterling, MA
http://www.tdiclub.com/
http://www.biodieselnow.com/
VW TBA
(1985 VW Golf: Biodiesel)
Tornado Fuel Masters
Hamilton, NJ
ONE-OF-A-KIND VEHICLES: 28 entrants
HYBRID AND ALTERNATIVE FUELED VEHICLES: 10 entrants
Kineticar III
(1989 Chevy S-10 pick-up: Hybrid: LPG + PbA)
Kinetica
Thomaston, CT
High Voltage
(Purpose-built: Hybrid: E85 + PbA)
Northern Lights Hybrid - Minnasota State
Mankato, MN
http://www.solarteam.mnsu.edu/
Veggie Golf
(VW Golf: Veggie oil in diesel engine)
NFA Technologies
Randolph, VT
http://www.nfatech.com/
TBA
(2002 Ford Explorer: Hybrid: Biodiesel + PbA)
Ohio State University
Future Truck
Columbus, OH
http://turbo.eng.ohio-state.edu/~future/
Proxima
(2003 Purpose-built prototype: Hybrid: Gasoline + Hawker, PbA)
University of Tulsa
Tulsa, OK
Eskimobile
(1997 Chevy Malibu: E85)
University of Waterloo
Waterloo Ontario Canada
http://www.eng.uwaterloo.ca/~uw_aft
Al C. O'holic
(1999 Chevy Silverado: E85 + LPG)
University of Waterloo
Waterloo, ON
http://www.eng.uwaterloo.ca/~uw_aft
Hybrid Hippo
(1995 Jeep Wrangler: Hybrid: Biodiesel + PbA)
W. Philadelphia High School
Philadelphia, PA
Viking 23
(03'Purpose-built prototype: Hybrid: Biodiesel + Unique Mobility, NiCad)
Western Washington University
Bellingham, WA
http://dot.etec.wwu.edu/viking23/home.htm
BATTERY-ELECTRIC VEHICLES: 12 entrants
SEVRX
(1986 Honda CRX: Advanced batteries)
Clarkson Solar Knights
Potsdam, NY
http://www.clarkson.edu/~solarcar
TBA
(VW van: PbA)
Lake Region High School
Glover, VT
The Lomax
(2000 Purpose-built: PbA)
Methacton H.S.
Jeffersonville, PA
Patriot
(1993 Ford Probe GT: PbA)
Miramar High School EV Team
Pembroke Pines, FL
Sungo
(Purpose-built: Ovonic NiMH)
NHTI SEV Club
Concord, NH
http://nhtisev.tripod.com/
REVolutionride.org
(1986 VW Van: Trojan PbA)
North Haven Community School
North Haven, ME
http://www.revolutionride.org/
Electric Panther
(1996 GMC Sierra: Trojan PbA)
Panther Electric Vehicle Team
Pittsburgh, PA
http://www.pitt.edu/~elv
TBA
(1983 Ford Ranger pick-up: PbA)
Panther SPEED
Jefferson, GA
The Olympian
(1986 Ford Escort: GNB, PbA)
Pirates
Cinnaminson, NJ
Woodstock
(1994 Ford Ranger: Trojan, PbA)
St. Mark's School
Southborough, MA
http://www.stmarksschool.org/
Whitelightning
(1984 Pontiac Fiero: Trojan PbA)
UEHS Solar/Electric
Car Team
Endicott, NY
http://www.uetigertech.com/
Electro
(1994 Geo Metro: Exide & GNB, PbA)
UEHS Solar/Electric Car Team
Endicott, NY
http://www.uetigertech.com/
SOLAR-ELECTRIC VEHICLES - One and Two Person: 3 entrants
SunPacer
(Purpose-built, one-person commuter: Ovonic NMH)
Cato-Meridian HS Tech Team
Cato, NY
http://www.cmhstech.org/
Zodiac
(Purpose-built, one-person commuter: Trojan, PbA)
IHS Tech Team
Rochester, NY
http://www.ihstechteam.com/
Solar Black Bear
(Chevy S-10 pick-up: PbA)
UMaine Solar Vehicle Team
Orono, ME
http://www.ume.maine.edu/solar
ONE-PERSON VEHICLES (all technologies except solar): 3 entrants
TROUTev
(Purpose-built: PbA)
EMRT
Millersville, PA
http://muweb.millersville.edu/~jwright/
eGO XR
(2002 eGo XR: Modular Energy Devices, Lithium Ion)
ModEnergy/Ego Vehicles
Charlestown, RI
Electric Hog
(2002 Pre-production motorcycle: Lithium Ion)
Vogelbilt Corp.
Corlandt Manor, NY
http://www.vogelbilt.com/
- - - -
The complete set of Tour de Sol Reports for 2003 can be found at:
http://www.AutoAuditorium.com/TdS_Reports_2003
The complete set of past Tour de Sol Reports can be found at:
http://www.FovealSystems.com/Tour_de_Sol_Reports.html
- - - -
The above is Copyright 2003 by Michael H. Bianchi.
Permission to copy is granted provided the entire article is presented
without modification and this notice remains attached.
For other arrangements, contact me at +1-973-822-2085 .
- - - -
For more on the NESEA Tour de Sol, see the web page at
http://www.TourdeSol.org
- - - -
Official NESEA Tour de Sol information is available from the sponsor,
the Northeast Sustainable Energy Association (NESEA) at
413 774-6051 , and 50 Miles Street, Greenfield, MA 01301 , and
[EMAIL PROTECTED] . All media enquiries should be addressed to ...
Jack Groh
Tour de Sol Communications Director
P.O. Box 6044
Warwick, RI 02887-6044
401 732-1551
401 732-0547 fax
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Is it a manual or automatic? If it's a manual just undo the four bolts
holding the engine to the tranny and pull them apart, you might have to
wiggle the motor back and forth a little bit.
If it's an automatic, I haven't got a clue, never worked on one.
On Wed, 2003-03-26 at 11:28, David Dymaxion wrote:
> I want to separate the transmission from the motor on my 1977 Porsche
> 911S. My manual says to put bolts in three spots on the flywheel,
> through the starter hole, to relieve tension. You need to turn the
> motor to get to each of the three spots. Then you are supposed to
> turn the throwout bearing, so the release fork can clear. Then,
> finally, you can loosen the transmission to engine bolts and separate
> the two.
>
> My problem is my motor is seized up solid, so I can't turn it. If I
> just loosen the motor to tranmission bolts, is that OK? Or is there a
> gotcha by doing that? Thanks for the advice.
>
>
> =====
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop!
> http://platinum.yahoo.com
>
--
EVDL
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi David,
3 or 4 bolts to remove through the starter hole would indicate an auto to
me.
You can remove this the same as a manual without undoing these bolts, but
you need to be a bit careful taking it out or you will damage the pump
drive.
You will also spill a lot more oil this way as the torque converter will be
coming out with the motor, instead of staying put in the bell housing if you
could undo the bolts.
Garry Stanley
Cable.net.nz
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Wednesday, March 26, 2003, at 02:39 PM, Peter VanDerWal wrote:
Is it a manual or automatic?
On Wed, 2003-03-26 at 11:28, David Dymaxion wrote:
Then you are supposed to
turn the throwout bearing, so the release fork can clear.
sounds like a standard to me
seth
--
QUESTION INTERNAL COMBUSTION
http://users.wpi.edu/~sethm/
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/387.html
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
test
--
__________________________________________________________
Sign-up for your own FREE Personalized E-mail at Mail.com
http://www.mail.com/?sr=signup
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
[ref
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/EVList/message/37938 ]
Every year Jack does great coverage of this EVent.
Newbies can expect more if his daily Tour de Sol reports to
come through on the EV List. Look for them.
...
If you look at the list of vehicles, I was at first,
getting worried as more and more fuel vehicles were at
the top, when I saw the High School EVs and the nEVs.
An interesting mix of different battery chemistries
being used.
I did not see Hiebao listed, even though David Li POSTed
they would be there(?).
If there are List'rs going to this EVent, if you could do
some fill of the points that Jack would not be normally
covering. Like:
Where are the EV charging?
How are they arranging the charging?
Are all EVs charging at the same points in a coordinated
effort?
Is the media giving the EVs coverage or are they passing
over them to cover the fuel vehicles?
Can someone look and make contact with the Heibao EV team?
Perhaps they can do a test drive and report back to us(?)
Some pictures (front drivers side, rear passenger side,
interior, and drivers cluster) would be great!
: Wishing I was there :
=====
' ____
~/__|o\__
'@----- @'---(=
. http://geocities.com/brucedp/
. EV List Editor & RE newswires
. (originator of the above ASCII art)
=====
__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop!
http://platinum.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
We also use AAA plus. I think our bill is similar. You also get free
tourbooks, etc with a membership. I'm pleased with them.
Funny, though, that we use up all our tows for when the ICE's break down,
and the EV never has...
Actually, my wife did hit a big bump one time, which caused a motor cable to
impact and deactivate the main circuit breaker, and she was towed home, but
that was really not a malfunction.
-----Original Message-----
From: Bruce EVangel Parmenter [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, March 26, 2003 5:21 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Emergency Tow Service
I have been using AAA membership Emergency Tow Service.
I am not talking insurance, I am POSTing about Emergency
Tow Services.
This year's bill will be $78 for a free 100 mile emergency
service.
I would like to know if other EV drivers have a tow service.
If so, what company do they use, how much is it per year,
and what services do they get?
Since no one is hiring, I thought I would see if I could
$ave on another Emergency Tow Service.
=====
' ____
~/__|o\__
'@----- @'---(=
. http://geocities.com/brucedp/
. EV List Editor & RE newswires
. (originator of the above ASCII art)
=====
__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop!
http://platinum.yahoo.com
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--- Begin Message ---
On Wednesday, March 26, 2003, at 02:39 PM, Peter VanDerWal wrote:
Is it a manual or automatic?
On Wed, 2003-03-26 at 11:28, David Dymaxion wrote:
Then you are supposed to
turn the throwout bearing, so the release fork can clear.
sounds like a standard to me
seth
These have a "pull type" clutch throw out bearing. I've never pulled
one apart, but have a clutch here. I don't know what to do for a
frozen engine, but worst case you might pull the studs out of the
case and then rotate the whole engine to get access.
-Otmar-
http://www.CafeElectric.com
Mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
With all the talk of having instruments that read real numbers... I put
a voltmeter across the motor in my truck and found that most driving was
at no more than 50-60 volts and rarely got up around 80-90 volts.
Is this accurate? It was lower than I expected. The meter is a Fluke
85III "True RMS multimeter", and the truck has an ADC 9" on a DCP
controller with 166 volt pack.
_________
Jim Coate
1992 Chevy S10
1970's Elec-Trak
http://www.eeevee.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: Otmar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 13:11:47 -0800
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Tranny Removal with Frozen Engine
> >On Wednesday, March 26, 2003, at 02:39 PM, Peter VanDerWal wrote:
> >
> >>Is it a manual or automatic?
> >
> >On Wed, 2003-03-26 at 11:28, David Dymaxion wrote:
> >>>Then you are supposed to
> >>>turn the throwout bearing, so the release fork can clear.
> >
> >sounds like a standard to me
> >
> >seth
>
> These have a "pull type" clutch throw out bearing. I've never pulled
> one apart, but have a clutch here. I don't know what to do for a
> frozen engine, but worst case you might pull the studs out of the
> case and then rotate the whole engine to get access.
>
> -Otmar-
> http://www.CafeElectric.com
> Mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
I'll admit, I don't know anything about Porsche's. But, do the engine and transmission
mate with flush, flat surfaces or is there "locating pins". If so, these may make it
difficult to rotate the engine/transmission.
Can you get to the connecting rods and main journals. Disconnect them and you may be
able to rotate the crankshaft. Of course if it's frozen solid the crank is probably
welded to the block.
Stay Charged!
Hump
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See
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/think_ev/message/2255
The direct link is an asx which means you need to have
MS windows media player.
The CARB meeting we want is tomorrow
March 27-28, 2003 @9:00 AM
If you click on it now, you get some 1970's beatle music (?)
My guess is the AV department is using the music for testing
purposes. That or the AV department is full of old hippies
from the 70's (like me).
=====
' ____
~/__|o\__
'@----- @'---(=
. http://geocities.com/brucedp/
. EV List Editor & RE newswires
. (originator of the above ASCII art)
=====
__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop!
http://platinum.yahoo.com
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Sounds about right. I have a analog movement volt meter permanently
connected across my motor and I usually see about the same numbers.
On the freeway I can sometimes get the bypass contactor to pull in
(happens at about 90-100V) but I think the flywheel is out of balance,
or something, because I can feel a vibration when the motor spins up
that fast.
On Wed, 2003-03-26 at 14:24, Jim Coate wrote:
> With all the talk of having instruments that read real numbers... I put
> a voltmeter across the motor in my truck and found that most driving was
> at no more than 50-60 volts and rarely got up around 80-90 volts.
>
> Is this accurate? It was lower than I expected. The meter is a Fluke
> 85III "True RMS multimeter", and the truck has an ADC 9" on a DCP
> controller with 166 volt pack.
>
>
> _________
> Jim Coate
> 1992 Chevy S10
> 1970's Elec-Trak
> http://www.eeevee.com
>
--
EVDL
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This came into the website. If interested, please contact Morris directly.
The picture he attached could not be opened.
Darryl
=====================================================
From: "morris mofarrah" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
i havea n early autoette (1963) for sale please contact me if u know
anyone interested
Darryl McMahon 48 Tarquin Crescent,
Econogics, Inc. Nepean, Ontario K2H 8J8
It's your planet. Voice: (613)784-0655
If you won't look Fax: (613)828-3199
after it, who will? http://www.econogics.com/
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This came into the website (econogics.com).
If any of you can help Scott out, please reply directly (I expect he
is not on the list). If you have a wiring diagram, and want to send
me a copy, I will add it to the EV History site.
Darryl
> My name is Scott and I live in Templeton, California. I have recently
> purchased a late 50's B & Z Electra King. Do you know of any source of
> information that might have a wiring diagram for this electric car?
>
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> (805) 610-3310
>
Darryl McMahon 48 Tarquin Crescent,
Econogics, Inc. Nepean, Ontario K2H 8J8
It's your planet. Voice: (613)784-0655
If you won't look Fax: (613)828-3199
after it, who will? http://www.econogics.com/
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That's their "racing" body and they have this to say about it:
"These bodies are designed for competition use only. "
They also mention:
"IMPORTANT - Please specify the type of racing that the unit will be
used for, so we may build and reinforce your unit accordingly. Units
manufactured for "Street Racing" have a heavier roving on all edges to
reduce the chance of tearing (under to stress of impact) and usually
weigh 10 - 15# more than a Drag Racing unit. "
These bodies are not intended for everyday use, unless you like
replacing parts once or twice a season (can get a little expensive)
> They claim to take 1500 lbs off a full size chevy truck by going to a
> fiberglass body and bed. They also make fiberglass front ends for S10
> trucks, might be a way for Bruce to lighten his EV.
>
> --- Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > ...
> > However, it's the concept I find interesting. Start with a truck
> > frame
> > that already has the wheels, brakes, springs, suspension, and
> > weight
> > carrying capacity. Place a small light streamlined car body on it.
> > Use
> > the weight savings to add more batteries than could have been
> > safely
> > carried by the original car or truck.
> > ...
>
> =====
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop!
> http://platinum.yahoo.com
>
--
EVDL
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They have distinctly branched out in the types of vehicles involved. Of
the 12 battery electrics, 10 are PbA, one is NiMH, and one is
"advanced". However as the rules they published a while back stated the
goal was only two electric cars with advanced (non-PbA) batteries, this
isn't too surprising an outcome.
Happily a couple of LiIon vehicles (motorcycle) are in the "everything
else" category and a small NiCad pack in one of the solar cars.
Bruce EVangel Parmenter wrote:
If you look at the list of vehicles, I was at first,
getting worried as more and more fuel vehicles were at
the top, when I saw the High School EVs and the nEVs.
An interesting mix of different battery chemistries
being used.
_________
Jim Coate
1992 Chevy S10
1970's Elec-Trak
http://www.eeevee.com
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Hi Jim,
This is almost frightening when you first see it ...and you have to ask
yourself, if my motor only gets 90 volts why am I carrying around another 76
volts of battery pack ( that's probably 350 kg ) that doesn't appear to be
useful at the motor.
This is "back emf", it is the difference between the input voltage from your
pack and the amount of voltage being generated in your motor at a given
speed.
If it wasn't for your controller you would see the whole 166 volts when you
start off and then it would taper back to the lower level you are seeing as
the motor increases in speed.
It was this reading from the motor that lead me to ask the question " How
can this motor possibly be efficient if it cant use the voltage I am
supplying it ?"
Garry Stanley
Cable.net.nz
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Hi Bruce:
Melanie Savage here, on behalf of EPRI. I'm sending you a release and
executive summary of a study put out today that shows that EVs are
competitive with gasoline cars.
The study analyzes battery and components costs and lifetimes, and
concludes that electric vehicle costs are coming down and will soon
approach competitiveness with gasoline cars.
I couldn't be sure if you were aware of this information, but I do know
you're paying attention to the CARB hearing tomorrow. I thought,
perhaps, the EV list group would like to be aware of this study as well,
some additional "ammo" as it were to use at the hearing for those who
are planning to attend.
EPRI's Christine Hopf-Lovette (650-855-2733) can link you directly with
the researchers, or I would be happy to help you with that.
Melanie Savage
Associate
The Ardent Group
(626) 296-6453-phone
(626) 399-6630-cell
(626) 296-6311-fax
* LP8.2: HTML/Attachments detected, removed from message *
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Took out the 1221C and the end cover came off in my hand as I rocked it back
and forth hearing something rattle around. I put the end cover down and out
popped a rather large resistor. Gold then red, green and brown on the other
end. Measures around 14.9k. Connectors completely melted off. Just nubs
to measure the resistance. Have a new controller will install tomorrow.
Thought some of you would like to know what happens when abusing a
controller. It was pushing 3900 pounds up a steep hill in San Francisco.
Lawrence Rhodes....
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Hello All,
Since the EV list removes attachments, I've posted the study in the
original zipped format on my site at this location:
http://www.cafeelectric.com/info/EPRI/
I also posted unzipped versions of the PDF and Word file here:
http://www.cafeelectric.com/info/EPRI/unziped/
Have fun!
-Otmar-
http://www.CafeElectric.com/ New Zilla controllers, now available.
http://www.evcl.com/914 My electric 914
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Item # 2408860037 on eBay is a Corbin Sparrow with an AC system but a
*non-working AC motor*! Anyone heard tell of this drive being used or was it
a prototype that got dropped?
p.s.- same seller (repooutlet) has item # 2408855976 that looks very
familiar...
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It says this was a demo model with no motor. I'd guess no controller, no
wiring harness, no......
As to the wording, sounds like it was lifted from the Corbin prototype site.
I really doubt that a prototype would be on Ebay from someone who doesn't
seem to know much about it period.
Buyer beware...
Chris
----- Original Message -----
From: "The Levine Family" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Wednesday, March 26, 2003 7:10 PM
Subject: AC Sparrow on eBay
> Item # 2408860037 on eBay is a Corbin Sparrow with an AC system but a
> *non-working AC motor*! Anyone heard tell of this drive being used or was
it
> a prototype that got dropped?
>
> p.s.- same seller (repooutlet) has item # 2408855976 that looks very
> familiar...
>
>
>
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garry wrote:
> This is almost frightening when you first see it ...and you have to
> ask yourself, if my motor only gets 90 volts why am I carrying
> around another 76 volts of battery pack ( that's probably 350 kg )
> that doesn't appear to be useful at the motor.
I wasn't worried anything was being wasted, in terms of total power.
Since the controller acts as a "dc transformer", the relatively high
voltage, low current going in shows up at the motor as low voltage, high
current. If I lived in a more open area, I could get to a steady speed
and the total power in (battery voltage x battery current) and power at
the motor (motor voltage x motor current) would be about equal, as the
controller is rather efficient. But... I can't play in Boston traffic
and watch four meters to verify my voltage readings without hitting
something (but officer, I was doing scientific research...)
What I was surprised by was the voltage I was reading versus the 144
volts the motor is rated for. This means that probably 99% of the time
I'm not really pushing it that much and would be fine with a lower
voltage battery pack (120 - 132 volts) which means 6-volters instead of
8-volters which could be cheaper to purchase. And the rare occasions
where I did use the extra power of the higher voltage I'll live without
in exchange for longer battery life.
I had upgraded to a higher voltage pack and to a good controller at the
same time. I'm now thinking that a high-current controller to get the
beast moving with a 120 volt pack might be an OK combination. (and save
the higher voltages for when I have a different battery chemistry that
lets me have some real fun...)
_________
Jim Coate
1992 Chevy S10
1970's Elec-Trak
http://www.eeevee.com
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<sigh-not again> The difference between motor voltage and pack voltage
is due to the controller bucking the voltage down and is NOT back EMF,
it has nothing to do with Back EMF. NOTHING, NADA, ZIP.
Back EMF is going to be somewhat lower than the voltage measured across
the motor.
> This is almost frightening when you first see it ...and you have to ask
> yourself, if my motor only gets 90 volts why am I carrying around another 76
> volts of battery pack ( that's probably 350 kg ) that doesn't appear to be
> useful at the motor.
>
> This is "back emf", it is the difference between the input voltage from your
> pack and the amount of voltage being generated in your motor at a given
> speed.
>
> If it wasn't for your controller you would see the whole 166 volts when you
> start off and then it would taper back to the lower level you are seeing as
> the motor increases in speed.
>
If there wasn't a controller (motor directly connected to pack) then the
voltage measured across the motor would equal pack voltage AT ALL
TIMES!!! (minus a tiny bit for drop in the cables)
> It was this reading from the motor that lead me to ask the question " How
> can this motor possibly be efficient if it cant use the voltage I am
> supplying it ?"
Since it's you asking this doesn't surprise me. Once again you don't
understand what is happening.
The reason the voltage on the motor and the pack voltage is different is
because a PWM motor controller and the inductance of the motor form what
is called a "DC to DC Buck converter"
This reduces the pack voltage and at the same time increases the
current.
SO the pack voltage might be 156V and the pack current might be 100
amps, but the motor voltage might be 77V and the motor current would be
200 amps.
Voltage, by it's self, tells you NOTHING about efficiency. You need to
know POWER. Efficiency = Power out / Power in.
You can't tell ANYTHING about a motors efficiency just be measuring it's
voltage. NADA, ZIP, NOTHING.
To find out a motors efficiency you need to measure the electrical power
in (Typically measured in watts) and the mechanical power out.
This has been explained to you before, but naturally you didn't pay
attention.
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