EV Digest 2833
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: battery cooling
by "Christopher Zach" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: Yet Another kind of EV
by Gordon Niessen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Seattle EV Meeting - June 10th - Same Place
by "Steven S. Lough" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) First EV ride from Oz.
by "Chris Crouch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: First EV ride from Oz.
by "Chris Crouch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) NiZn upgrade?
by "Tom Hudson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Scooter project
by Roger Daisley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: equalization on a hybrid
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
9) Re: Status of E-Cycle?
by Rich Rudman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: Vancouver, BC EV Show: Saturday, June 7th!
by Rich Rudman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) RE: Vancouver, BC EV Show: Saturday, June 7th!
by "Roger Stockton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: Vancouver, BC EV Show: Saturday, June 7th!
by Rich Rudman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: Parallel Inverters?
by Ryan Fulcher <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Where is Brian Matheny and his cool MR2?
by Chip Gribben <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: Status of E-Cycle?
by "Philippe Borges" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: Battery pack sizing questions
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: Status of E-Cycle?
by Peter VanDerWal <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: NiZn Algorithm
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Great to see the all-electric Insight in the EValbum
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
20) Re: Status of E-Cycle?
by Gordon Niessen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) AC technology reprsentation (Re: all-electric Insight in the EValbum
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: AC technology reprsentation (Re: all-electric Insight in the EValbum
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) unsubscribe
by "Dave Doering" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) [video link] as a consolation prize..
by "Jon \"Sheer\" Pullen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: [video link] as a consolation prize..
by Bruce EVangel Parmenter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) Re: Semiconductors wear (was: Efficiency numbers)
by Lin Tse Hsu <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) Help needed for VW factory converted Bus
by Electro Automotive <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
28) Re: Semiconductors wear (was: Efficiency numbers)
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
29) Re: First EV ride from Oz.
by Peter VanDerWal <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
30) Re: Where is Brian Matheny and his cool MR2?
by Seth Murray <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
31) Re: electric shredder
by "Christopher Meier" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
32) Re: [video link] as a consolation prize..
by "Joe Smalley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
What you run into is condensation.
Chris
(has a 50 year old Radiant heat system. Copper pipe)
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Coate" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, June 03, 2003 9:27 AM
Subject: Re: battery cooling
> So basically put tubing in the "floor" of the battery compartment just
> like the radiant heating system I'm working on for my house.
>
> However, in reading about radiant heating, everything I've seen says
> that it doesn't work to run cold water through the tubing in the floor
> to cool the house. How well will the heat inside the battery get
> transferred to the liquid in the tubes underneath?
>
> Joe's thought of surrounding the batteries with a liquid sounds much
> more effective, but, umm, messy. To keep the interior batteries equally
> cooled, perhaps could sub divide the box into several compartments each
> with its own fluid pump.
>
>
>
> fred whitridge wrote:
> > I started with routing a channel for 1/4" I.D. Norprene tubing into a
> > piece of plywood that snugly fit the bottom of my rear battery box.
> > That was a failure since the pump I have could only push 1 liter per
> > minute thru the tubing. This from a pump that does 4gpm running
> > unconstricted.
> >
> > The second attempt was much better and was inspired by Roger Stockton,
> > a grid of 1/2" copper pipe. The whole grid is shown being leak tested
> > in the pool with 20psi of air.....and voila no leaks.
> >
> > http://home.ix.netcom.com/~fw/norprene.JPG
> > http://home.ix.netcom.com/~fw/no_bubbles2.JPG
> >
>
>
> Joe Smalley wrote:
> > One idea that was tossed around it to use flooded battery boxes where
> > a cooling fluid bathes the sides and bottom of the batteries in a
> > continuous flow. If the velocity is fast enough, the difference in
> > temperature between the batteries is minimized. The cooling fluid
> > could be either a liquid or a gas. The trick is to control the flow
> > and temperature gradients to get a constant battery temperature.
> >
>
> _________
> Jim Coate
> 1992 Chevy S10
> 1970's Elec-Trak
> http://www.eeevee.com
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Thought of making one for my dad. Doesn't mention anything about reverse
though. That would be a useful feature.
At 02:43 PM 6/2/2003, you wrote:
I just ran into Yet Another kind of home use EV you can buy.
An electric Wheelbarrow. My mom had it in her catalog (Country Home
Products I think).
http://www.easyhauling.com/
--
John G. Lussmyer mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Dragons soar and Tigers prowl while I dream....
http://www.CasaDelGato.Com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
HEADS UP - I know you will all be tired and full from the Vancouver
BC EVent,
but try to make the meeting Tuesday evening. Daylight past 8pm. for
Show-n-Tell
Main EVent to discuss.... Committing to bringing EVs to the VERY LARGE
Custom Car Show on Greenwood Av. in Seattle, Saturday June 28th.
Any SEVA member, or non-member will receive FREE ADMISSION $15) for
committing to attending the VERY WELL attended
rod and custom and antique car show. This is a NATURAL to show your EV
Stuff....
Tens of Thousands of folks stroll the more than mile long show each
year.
So come ready to give us a commitment. We need to purchase the space in
ADVANCE. and
we need to rendezvous, early near Greenwood Av. south end to MOVE IN
together, One car after the other, or E-lawn mower, or scooter, or
E-bike, !
--
Steven S. Lough, Pres.
Seattle EV Association
6021 32nd Ave. N.E.
Seattle, WA 98115-7230
Day: 206 850-8535
Eve: 206 524-1351
e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
web: http://slough1.home.mindspring.com/seva.html ( Find directions
to meeting HERE )
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I have to thank Mike Brandon for my first EV grin. While I was tickled pink
at the sensation of rolling around his little end of town in his Electric
Rabbit.
My wife's first impression was how pleasant of a smooth start the truck
offered, but after that she felt like she was in a dead truck being towed
around the block.
In all my excitement of the moment there were a couple things I wanted to
look at but forgot.
Mike, in order to put some meaning to real numbers. What is the peak
amperage on the emeter when you take off from a complete stop. How many peak
amps can you safely pull from the batteries without doing them harm.
Chris Crouch
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
My last question for the group, the motor on Mikes VW truck is a Prestolite
MTC-4002, how does that compare with 6" or 7" ADC motors?
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Well, the lead-acids in my Solectria E-10 pickup are starting to age -- I
can see that the voltage is sagging more these days. I'm really interested
in the fact that the NiZn modules from Evercel are available, and the
MB80-12's look like they're a group 24 form factor. This is what my truck
has now, and the Evercels should just drop right in. Extra "plus": The
Evercels weigh about 18 pounds less EACH, so with 24 batteries, that's about
450 pounds less!
Anybody have spec sheets on these batteries showing the current draw
limitations, cycle life, etc.? Currently, my truck has two strings in it to
reduce the current draw on the batteries; I'd probably keep this scheme in
place with the NiZn batteries to keep from hammering them too hard.
I'm really curious about the lifespan of these batteries might be in my
application. I don't take the truck on any real long trips normally --
Usually, I drive it less than 10 miles per trip with an occasinal 30-mile
excursion, and you can figure on this drawing about an amp-hour per mile on
each string, so I'm not hitting the batteries too hard.
My only real worry about these batteries is that they're relatively new.
Other people I know who've had new battery technology in their EVs have been
hosed when they have a battery module failure and the company no longer
makes a replacement.
Any input would be appreciated. I've been reading the information about
cooling with interest; I might do something like hook up an active cooling
system utilizing the truck's air conditioner unit...
I did a pretty involved upgrade of my Solectria Force last year, replacing
the lead-acids with water-cooled NiCds; Never a dull moment around here.
-Tom
Thomas Hudson
http://portdistrict5.org -- 5th District Aldermanic Website
http://portev.org -- Electric Vehicles, Solar Power & More
http://portgardenclub.org -- Port Washington Garden Club
http://portlightstation.org -- Light Station Restoration
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
* LP8.2: HTML/Attachments detected, removed from message *
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Would the powercheq modules do the trick or is there something better. we
will be running 396V nominal.
paul
Quoting Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> Alaric G. Weigle wrote:
> >
> > Lee Hart wrote:
> >
> > >What is an Odyssey PC625? What kind of battery?
> > >
> > >
> > A quick Google search reveals it to be a Hawker marine SLA battery
> > designed for jetski watercraft.
>
> Thanks, Alaric. If that's the battery they have, then they can get away
> with no balancing or equalization for a while, but the pack will die an
> early death. Many EVs have tried this, and learned the hard way.
> --
> Lee A. Hart Ring the bells that still can ring
> 814 8th Ave. N. Forget your perfect offering
> Sartell, MN 56377 USA There is a crack in everything
> leeahart_at_earthlink.net That's how the light gets in - Leonard Cohen
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Sherri J Hower wrote:
>
> I sent one of my BLDC controls to Jan who
> purchased an Ecycle motor but is still waiting
> for the control (it's been over a year).
> He could not get my control to work properly with
> the Ecycle motor. My control works with 100% of the
> 3-phase BLDC Y connected motors I've tried it with,
> even the real low resistance and inductance high
> current motors.
> Jan was supposed to visit Ecycle and pick up some
> more motors and send one to me for testing.
> If he does this I will report my findings back to the
> list.
> P.S. I'm not at all convinced Ecycles control
> method makes any sense. They are using a buck
> converter on the front end and a 3-phase trapezoid
> control on the motor (PWMing the front end, not
> the 3-phase bridge).
> It's described here;
> http://www.ecycle.com/brushless_motor_controllers.htm
> or
> http://www.ecycle.com/two%20stage%20explained.htm#Two-stage%20power%20conversion%20explained
>
> --- Philippe Borges <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
> > I know they have BIG problems to make working their
> > controller and motor
> > together.
> > They don't deliver controler advertised even when
> > you have pay for it !
> > instead you receive another mark controller...which
> > again doesn't work with
> > this strange motor.(strange 40/60 duty cycle for the
> > hall sensor,
> > problematic tiny inductance...)
> > Imho the ecycle will not be here for a while.
> >
>
I just laugh.
I have the prototype BLDC motor that E Cycle " Swiped" from a client of
mine.
I have a few controls that drive it. Not a issue.
I have one that makes 250 amps per phase at 60 volt, and was intened to
make 250 amps at 156. I did have to make all the electronics. So It
works.
Ecycle seams to have no real clue how to make a BLDC power stage that
is current limited. Kinda a basic DC control concept.
My first BLDC stages were 6 DCP raptor circuits on little test cards.
Then I stuffed them onto a PCB, and that worked at 48 volts. I don't
trust them at over 60 volts. And have since designed better.
Now this Gate drive is on the PFC chargers, and does 240 VAC and 480 DC
gate control. So doing a current limited 3phase BLDC drive with 400 volt
peaks should be pretty basic.
There are about a Dozzen folks here on the EVlist that could Dash out a
BLDC power stage for Ecycle. That would work very well. I still can't
believe that they used a Curtis to feed a inverter, and claimed they had
the most advanced BLDC drive. You can do this now with single chips, no
great amount of Data or CPU needed. The shots they had of thier power
stage was mind boggling complex. Multi QFP chips and control.
The logic is they do a current Source feed to thier inverter stage, OLD
stuff, say pre WW1 contol strategy. Now you can do it with PWM control
of the same transistors that do the phase inversion work.
Pretty motor... No cooling. and that's another story.
The Mini bike from hell has all this stuff on it and it is now a 5 year
old project.
--
Rich Rudman
Manzanita Micro
www.manzanitamicro.com
1-360-297-7383,Cell 1-360-620-6266
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Roger Stockton wrote:
>
> Hi All,
>
> Just a quick reminder to everyone that the annual EV show and ride
> event, REV!2003, is happening this Saturday, June 7th, in Vancouver, BC.
>
> Same location as last year (and the year before that...): 1601 Ontario
> Street, on part of the Molson Indy course just a short walk South of
> Science World.
>
> Same general schedule as years past:
>
> - exhibitors arrive/register/setup bright and early (8:00-9:30-ish)
> - student Electrathon race from about 10:00-11:00
> - EV parade, power demos, tractor pull etc.
> - open Electrathon race from about 3:00-4:00
> - award presentation & E-bike raffle draw
>
> As usual, a BBQ follows for exhibitors and volunteers.
>
> I believe that an email reminder (or two) have already been sent to our
> regular guests by the event organisers, however, if you haven't yet
> received an invite/reminder, please consider this to be one!
>
> The forecast seems to be for warm, sunny weather, so come equipped with
> sun protection!
>
> For more info, please see the Vancouver Electric Vehicle Association
> website:
>
> <http://www.veva.bc.ca>
>
> or email me for more details or to confirm your intent to attend as an
> exhibitor or competitor.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Roger.
Sorry!!! I won't make it with Goldie for the first time in about 5
years.
I will be at my daughter's graduation. DARN!!
--
Rich Rudman
Manzanita Micro
www.manzanitamicro.com
1-360-297-7383,Cell 1-360-620-6266
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Rich Rudman wrote:
> > Just a quick reminder to everyone that the annual EV show
> > and ride event, REV!2003, is happening this Saturday,
> > June 7th, in Vancouver, BC.
[snip]
> Sorry!!! I won't make it with Goldie for the first time in
> about 5 years. I will be at my daughter's graduation. DARN!!
Sorry to hear that Rich; you, Goldie, and the usual tire smoke will be
sorely missed.
Cheers,
Roger.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Roger Stockton wrote:
>
> Rich Rudman wrote:
>
> > > Just a quick reminder to everyone that the annual EV show
> > > and ride event, REV!2003, is happening this Saturday,
> > > June 7th, in Vancouver, BC.
>
> [snip]
>
> > Sorry!!! I won't make it with Goldie for the first time in
> > about 5 years. I will be at my daughter's graduation. DARN!!
>
> Sorry to hear that Rich; you, Goldie, and the usual tire smoke will be
> sorely missed.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Roger.
Yea I will miss it also. It's a really fun time. I of course would have
brought a PFC20, and a 50 and charged all comers.
--
Rich Rudman
Manzanita Micro
www.manzanitamicro.com
1-360-297-7383,Cell 1-360-620-6266
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
ThanX, as I suspected.
Would the inverters "naturally" sync their output
sine waves, or blow each other to kindom come.
The latter!
Why not split your load into 400w size pieces? Each circuit has a
separate inverter.
I had thought about this, however my "Large" loads are my electric heaters,
they are 500Watts, and the 400Watt inverters won't support them. Most of
the rest of the outlets would be fine with 400W.
I do have one 500W inverter which I have yet to test with these big loads,
perhaps it will support them and I'll just have to use the heaters on only
the particular "high capacity outlets"?
I'm just trying to determin the cheapest way to disconnect my boat from
the grid or shore power as it were. Though I don't want to go so cheap
that nothing will work.
Anyway, thanX for the feedback.
L8r
Ryan
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello,
Does anyone know where Brain Matheny is?
I'm hoping to get information to him about our upcoming Power of DC Race.
He's been to our first two races and we'd like to invite him back to our
third on June 29, but I can't seem to locate him. Bob Rice said he moved to
Vermont. People can email off list.
Thanks,
Chip Gribben
2003 NEDRA Power of DC Racing Coordiantor
http://www.powerofdc.com
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
301-490-0657
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
ok Rich, a company i help have this motor and no working controller.
Friend need 300VDC 2/3kw, simple but robust, inverter (chain saw
application) and a motor that suit, he doesn't want another e-cycle
experience ...
20 motor/controller units to start.
contact me off list please
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Philippe
Et si le pot d'�chappement sortait au centre du volant ?
quel carburant choisiriez-vous ?
http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, June 03, 2003 7:47 PM
Subject: Re: Status of E-Cycle?
> I just laugh.
> I have the prototype BLDC motor that E Cycle " Swiped" from a client of
> mine.
> I have a few controls that drive it. Not a issue.
> I have one that makes 250 amps per phase at 60 volt, and was intened to
> make 250 amps at 156. I did have to make all the electronics. So It
> works.
> Ecycle seams to have no real clue how to make a BLDC power stage that
> is current limited. Kinda a basic DC control concept.
> My first BLDC stages were 6 DCP raptor circuits on little test cards.
> Then I stuffed them onto a PCB, and that worked at 48 volts. I don't
> trust them at over 60 volts. And have since designed better.
> Now this Gate drive is on the PFC chargers, and does 240 VAC and 480 DC
> gate control. So doing a current limited 3phase BLDC drive with 400 volt
> peaks should be pretty basic.
>
> There are about a Dozzen folks here on the EVlist that could Dash out a
> BLDC power stage for Ecycle. That would work very well. I still can't
> believe that they used a Curtis to feed a inverter, and claimed they had
> the most advanced BLDC drive. You can do this now with single chips, no
> great amount of Data or CPU needed. The shots they had of thier power
> stage was mind boggling complex. Multi QFP chips and control.
> The logic is they do a current Source feed to thier inverter stage, OLD
> stuff, say pre WW1 contol strategy. Now you can do it with PWM control
> of the same transistors that do the phase inversion work.
> Pretty motor... No cooling. and that's another story.
> The Mini bike from hell has all this stuff on it and it is now a 5 year
> old project.
>
>
>
> --
> Rich Rudman
> Manzanita Micro
> www.manzanitamicro.com
> 1-360-297-7383,Cell 1-360-620-6266
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I have a suspicion that 90Ah cells was an attempt to modify
100Ah cells to increase energy density - 10$ less Ah but 15% less
weight. So they might of overestimated this capability.
This is speculation, I don't know for sure.
If the cells will end up being 75Ah...80Ah I'll consider it good,
everything else is a bonus. Not that I like it, but not too
surprising.
Victor
Gary Graunke wrote:
>
> Cliff Rassweiler writes:
> > Don't forget to hit F5 when you are in the parameters page to save the
> > changes to the inverter's EPROM. F2 will save your changes on the
> computer.
>
> > Cliff
>
> Thanks for the reminder--I'll get up to speed eventually! It's great to have
> a motor controller that lets you control all these things, has selectable
> displays, and the statistics as well!
>
> Victor Tikhonov writes:
> (I'll also try to actually look at the setting prior to posting to the list!
> (It was 280A, not 200A as I thought)).
>
> > Note, the motor current displayed is peak (inverter limits it to
> > 400A, or 280A rms).
> >
> > Inverter reduces battery voltage, so motor voltage is less and
> > motor current is more than battery voltage and current respectively
>
> > > (I'd really like to limit the battery current, so I'll have
> > > to look at all the cryptic parameters to see if there is such a limit).
>
> > They are not too cryptic - Ibat_pos is positive (out of battery,
> > i.e. driving) battery current, Ibat_neg is negative (into the battery
> > i.e. regen) battery current.
>
> I had the right parameters after all--I just need to hit F5!
>
> > > I plan to use a LiIon pack of 86 cells for 309V nominal. These seem to
> > > have high internal resistance and the temperature increases with current
> due
> > > to the exothermic reactions as well as the cell resistance. The
> manufacturer
> > > has only published up to 1.5C constant current curves.
>
> > > This also suggests recording the volts and amps during normal driving
> > > so that we have an idea of the proper real-life mix of current draws.
> Victor
> > > had a small amount of data on this for his first two cells.
>
> > Yes, here:
>
> > Raw unprocessed: http://www.metricmind.com/misc/acrx4a.gif
> > plotted with excel: http://www.metricmind.com/misc/current_voltage.gif
>
> > Victor
>
> It looks like your max draw was about 150A, exactly 1.5C of the two 100AH
> LiIon cells you were using in series with your high voltage optima pack
> (>300V, if I recall correctly). I also recall that you live in an area with
> substantial hills.
>
> So it looks like a 1.5C limit might work well with a high voltage (>300V)
> 90AH pack of LiIon in a small car.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Gary
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
> The logic is they do a current Source feed to thier inverter stage, OLD
> stuff, say pre WW1 contol strategy. Now you can do it with PWM control
> of the same transistors that do the phase inversion work.
Hi Rich.
They were claiming that by separating the PWM and the three phase
inverter that you keep PWM out of the motor and this improves motor
efficiency.
What are your thoughts on this?
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Fred and all,
Please keep in mind, what Elio from Evercel told me (CC/CC charging)
cannot be done with current PFC chargers as they are today (without
additional external control circuit). It won't be difficult to modify
the charger to do that, but as they are at the moment, they don't
support timed multistep CC/CC method Elio suggested.
Rich, if what he told is how you suppose to charge NiZn, you need
to upgrade PFCs to do that.
Victor
fred whitridge wrote:
>
> Joe:
> You asked what sort of charger I have.....I have a Brusa on the way from
> Victor, NLG511TA. There may be a Manzanita PFC in my future however. I
> like the sound of DC powering them and can think of some uses.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/461.html
Now we can catch up on the cutting (hopefully not bleading) edge of EV
conversions.
Gary has a truely fine vehicle - the way Honda should have made it.
Also noticed Mike's Citroen (http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/423.html) and
Al's Porsche 928 (http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/455.html). Victor's
influence for going AC is taking hold.
BR,
Ed Thorpe
catching up on the latest entries into the EValbum (great work Mike!)
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
That is all well and good for an electronics guru like you to say. But
point me to one person or company that can give me a BLDC motor and
controller in the 4-8kw range. Or send me your design and I'll build and
test it. But I'm a digital guy and try not to warp my brain trying to
design analog circuits.
If someone helped eCycle deliver on what they are promising, they could do
a lot of good and make money doing it.
At 12:47 PM 6/3/2003, you wrote:
I just laugh.
I have the prototype BLDC motor that E Cycle " Swiped" from a
client of
mine.
I have a few controls that drive it. Not a issue.
I have one that makes 250 amps per phase at 60 volt, and was intened to
make 250 amps at 156. I did have to make all the electronics. So It
works.
Ecycle seams to have no real clue how to make a BLDC power stage that
is current limited. Kinda a basic DC control concept.
My first BLDC stages were 6 DCP raptor circuits on little test cards.
Then I stuffed them onto a PCB, and that worked at 48 volts. I don't
trust them at over 60 volts. And have since designed better.
Now this Gate drive is on the PFC chargers, and does 240 VAC and
480 DC
gate control. So doing a current limited 3phase BLDC drive with 400 volt
peaks should be pretty basic.
There are about a Dozzen folks here on the EVlist that could Dash out a
BLDC power stage for Ecycle. That would work very well. I still can't
believe that they used a Curtis to feed a inverter, and claimed they had
the most advanced BLDC drive. You can do this now with single chips, no
great amount of Data or CPU needed. The shots they had of thier power
stage was mind boggling complex. Multi QFP chips and control.
The logic is they do a current Source feed to thier inverter
stage, OLD
stuff, say pre WW1 contol strategy. Now you can do it with PWM control
of the same transistors that do the phase inversion work.
Pretty motor... No cooling. and that's another story.
The Mini bike from hell has all this stuff on it and it is now a 5 year
old project.
--
Rich Rudman
Manzanita Micro
www.manzanitamicro.com
1-360-297-7383,Cell 1-360-620-6266
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[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/461.html
>
> Now we can catch up on the cutting (hopefully not bleading) edge of EV
> conversions.
> Gary has a truely fine vehicle - the way Honda should have made it.
>
> Also noticed Mike's Citroen (http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/423.html) and
> Al's Porsche 928 (http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/455.html). Victor's
> influence for going AC is taking hold.
Talking about AC, less than half of people I know have done (or
currently doing) it, submitted anything.
At the moment, in 2.5 years of availability,
Siemens AC systems equipped EVs are:
Gary: http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/461.html
Al: http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/455.html
Bryan: http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/260.html
Sheer: http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/338.html
Jim: http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/326a.jpg
Eddy: http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/160.html (OEM)
myself: http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/194.html
Wating for Cliff :-)
Did I miss any?
Other people (9 or 10 more) aren't on the list.
> BR,
> Ed Thorpe
> catching up on the latest entries into the EValbum (great work Mike!)
Yes, we have great album!
Victor
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Whoops, correction for Jim Fell's URL:
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/326.html
Victor
Victor Tikhonov wrote:
>
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> >
> > http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/461.html
> >
> > Now we can catch up on the cutting (hopefully not bleading) edge of EV
> > conversions.
> > Gary has a truely fine vehicle - the way Honda should have made it.
> >
> > Also noticed Mike's Citroen (http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/423.html) and
> > Al's Porsche 928 (http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/455.html). Victor's
> > influence for going AC is taking hold.
>
> Talking about AC, less than half of people I know have done (or
> currently doing) it, submitted anything.
>
> At the moment, in 2.5 years of availability,
> Siemens AC systems equipped EVs are:
>
> Gary: http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/461.html
> Al: http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/455.html
> Bryan: http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/260.html
> Sheer: http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/338.html
> Jim: http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/326a.jpg
> Eddy: http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/160.html (OEM)
> myself: http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/194.html
>
> Wating for Cliff :-)
>
> Did I miss any?
>
> Other people (9 or 10 more) aren't on the list.
>
> > BR,
> > Ed Thorpe
> > catching up on the latest entries into the EValbum (great work Mike!)
>
> Yes, we have great album!
>
> Victor
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unsubsribe
----- Original Message -----
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, June 03, 2003 12:40 PM
Subject: Re: equalization on a hybrid
> Would the powercheq modules do the trick or is there something better. we
> will be running 396V nominal.
>
> paul
>
>
> Quoting Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>
> > Alaric G. Weigle wrote:
> > >
> > > Lee Hart wrote:
> > >
> > > >What is an Odyssey PC625? What kind of battery?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > A quick Google search reveals it to be a Hawker marine SLA battery
> > > designed for jetski watercraft.
> >
> > Thanks, Alaric. If that's the battery they have, then they can get away
> > with no balancing or equalization for a while, but the pack will die an
> > early death. Many EVs have tried this, and learned the hard way.
> > --
> > Lee A. Hart Ring the bells that still can ring
> > 814 8th Ave. N. Forget your perfect offering
> > Sartell, MN 56377 USA There is a crack in everything
> > leeahart_at_earthlink.net That's how the light gets in - Leonard Cohen
> >
>
>
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Since Rich won't be able to make it with Goldie, I thought I'd post these
links to a videotape taken 'in the cockpit' of Goldie at one of the Woodburn
2002 drags. If you look closely on the high bandwidth one, you can actually
see smoke coming up through the floorboards..
Low bandwidth: http://qm.sheer.us/pics/tiresmoke_lowbw.wmv
High bandwidth: http://qm.sheer.us/pics/tiresmoke.wmv
Enjoy! ;-)
S.
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The .wmv format is a download-able file, which
I think is easier to use and a more portable
format than streaming file format.
The 340k low bandwidth file was a good
compression; Quick and fast.
The hi-res file took 16 mins to download over a
skinny modem. It s was cleaner on full screen
than the low-res file but I did not see the
smoke previously mentioned.
I used windows media player 9 to view both of
them.
Maybe just as well. I was told the idea is to
keep the smoke 'in' the EV components, and not
to let the smoke out :-)
...
If you have not been to a http://nedra.com
Electric drag race yet, I recommend that you do.
It is an all day fun experience at a low co$t.
Woodburn, OR is South of Portland and North of
Salem. There are accommodations to fit most needs.
The Woodburn track http://woodburndragstrip.com
http://www.rpmnet.com/trackcenter/Track.cfm?trackID=2360
is a couple miles West of the Woodburn exit
off Hwy 5.
http://maps.yahoo.com/py/maps.py?&addr=&csz=woodburn%2C+or
If you are not racing, bring your Ebike, Escoot
or any other small Electric wheels. It is not
only a great way to get around the strip, and
run back and forth from the drag lights to the
parking lot, but having all these 'Electrics'
zipping around, helps turn some ICE heads around.
...
Wouldn't it be cool to have a camera that could
easily be put in a racing EV. Then each run
could be recorded?
I suppose to get the whole experience, the camera
would need to be mounting in a light weight crash
dummy that could be strapped into the passenger
seat.
If there were stereo audio so we could hear not
only the dumb things the track announcer usually
says about Electrics, but also the driver swearing
and smell of the excitement :-o
=====
' ____
~/__|o\__
'@----- @'---(=
. http://geocities.com/brucedp/
. EV List Editor & RE newswires
. (originator of the above ASCII art)
=====
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Calendar - Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM).
http://calendar.yahoo.com
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I hate to say it, but Victor is right. Wasn't there a
nice analysis of Auburn controller lifetime that
someone did in response to
company-out-of-business-situation that was of concern?
It should be in the archives.
Victor Tikhonov" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Semiconductors wear (was:
Efficiency numbers)
Lee Hart wrote:
>
> Electronic controllers don't
wear out; they just work until
> you exceed some rating and
they "snap" (over-voltage, over-current,
> over-temperature, or some
other rating exceeded).
Lee, I wish this was true, but
this is wrong statement.
Electronic components do wear
out and have predictable life time.
Mechanisms are well known and
the life of the semiconductor
parts even within specifications
cannot be expected indefinite.
They can be built for long life
(like satellite parts), but makes
no sense to built a 100 year
lasting part for a gadget no one wants
10 years later. We're talking
computers, cell phones, CD players
and things like that.
Industrial grate parts are
better, but still fixed life time.
Minimum 10-30 years though for
typical parts you get from digikey
or mouser, far longer than
mechanical wear of ICE.
I do life tests and failure
analysis of ICs for living.
Victor
__________________________________
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Yahoo! Calendar - Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM).
http://calendar.yahoo.com
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I am posting this for a person not on the list. If you can help, please
respond directly to Mike Story at [EMAIL PROTECTED], with a cc: to me
off-list. Thanks.
He has just bought a 1979 VW Bus that was converted by the VW factory for
testing by the Tennessee Valley Authority. He got pretty complete
documentation, but has some holes that need filling in. Primarily, what
type of batteries were used. (It has none at the moment, not even dead
ones.)
Thanks for any help.
Mike Brown
Electro Automotive POB 1113 Felton CA 95018-1113 Telephone 831-429-1989
http://www.electroauto.com [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Electric Car Conversion Kits * Components * Books * Videos * Since 1979
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Lin Tse Hsu wrote:
>
> I hate to say it, but Victor is right. Wasn't there a
> nice analysis of Auburn controller lifetime that
> someone did in response to
> company-out-of-business-situation that was of concern?
How am I suppose to read this? Do you hate that Auburn died
or you hate when I'm right???
Last one would be sad :-(
Victor
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On Tue, 2003-06-03 at 08:15, Chris Crouch wrote:
> My last question for the group, the motor on Mikes VW truck is a Prestolite
> MTC-4002, how does that compare with 6" or 7" ADC motors?
I'm not sure about the 4002 but the 4001 is better than most than most
6.7" ADCs, almost as good as an 8" ADC.
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Hi Chip,
Brian did move, I'm not sure he went as far as vermont though... last
time I checked, his email was [EMAIL PROTECTED] although it may of
changed after he moved. I'm not sure if the MR2 is running now or not.
Good luck
Seth
On Tuesday, June 3, 2003, at 03:35 PM, Chip Gribben wrote:
Hello,
Does anyone know where Brain Matheny is?
I'm hoping to get information to him about our upcoming Power of DC
Race.
He's been to our first two races and we'd like to invite him back to
our
third on June 29, but I can't seem to locate him. Bob Rice said he
moved to
Vermont. People can email off list.
Thanks,
Chip Gribben
2003 NEDRA Power of DC Racing Coordiantor
http://www.powerofdc.com
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
301-490-0657
--
QUESTION INTERNAL COMBUSTION
http://users.wpi.edu/~sethm/
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/387.html
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--- Begin Message ---
opinions:
http://forums2.gardenweb.com/forums/load/tools/msg0823221317947.html
pic: http://www.composters.com/docs/acc.html
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ben Bennett" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, June 02, 2003 2:29 PM
Subject: electric shredder
> I got a Harbor Freight sale catalog today and a couple of
> things caught my eye. The first was a chipper shedder, 2HP,
> 115 volt, 60 HZ. $120 bucks. Page 3, lot # 41098. Wasn't
> someone on the list looking for one? The second was a
> cordless circular saw. 18 Volts. $60 bucks. Page 16, lot#
> 37412. That looks like it would be perfect for one of those
> bicycle motors.
> --
> Always remember you're unique. Just like everyone else.
> Ben Bennett
> http://home.earthlink.net/~greyhawk200/
>
>
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Lowe's was selling some wireless B/W video systems for under $100. I picked
one up for a baby monitor and docking camera for my trailer. I have not
checked the range but I have had the idea of mounting one on the to of an RC
car to check out the range and shoot some wild video. The camera runs off 8
AA cells and the receiver has a monitor with audio and video outputs to go
to a video recorder. The color systems cost a little more. The link to the
equipment is
http://www.lowes.com/lkn?action=productList&catalogId=ALARM_SURVEILLANCE
The unit I bought is no longer listed but is similar to the first one
listed. Mine has four channels like the second one with four channels. If
four people bought systems, each receiver could be switched to whomever is
in the staging lane and then record the entire start line sequence as the
cars come to the start line.
Joe Smalley
Rural Kitsap County WA
Fiesta 48 volts
NEDRA 48 volt street conversion record holder
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bruce EVangel Parmenter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, June 03, 2003 4:52 PM
Subject: Re: [video link] as a consolation prize..
> ...
> Wouldn't it be cool to have a camera that could
> easily be put in a racing EV. Then each run
> could be recorded?
>
> I suppose to get the whole experience, the camera
> would need to be mounting in a light weight crash
> dummy that could be strapped into the passenger
> seat.
>
> If there were stereo audio so we could hear not
> only the dumb things the track announcer usually
> says about Electrics, but also the driver swearing
> and smell of the excitement :-o
>
>
>
> =====
> ' ____
> ~/__|o\__
> '@----- @'---(=
> . http://geocities.com/brucedp/
> . EV List Editor & RE newswires
> . (originator of the above ASCII art)
> =====
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Calendar - Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM).
> http://calendar.yahoo.com
>
--- End Message ---
