EV Digest 3847
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) RE: Electric Power Steering (Part Deux)
by "Don Cameron" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: Solution for "Gone Postal's" broken tranny found
by Roderick Wilde <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Electric Brake Booster
by "Don Cameron" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: Solution for "Gone Postal's" broken tranny found
by Tim Clevenger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Dog clutches
by Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: Dog clutches
by Roderick Wilde <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) advanced solar battery
by Lee Dekker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Who handles NEDRA tech questions for new builders????
by "Rick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Woodburn...thanks for the show!!!!!!!!!!
by "Rick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Audi Transaxle in Kit Car photo
by "Brad Ledger" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: Wham, Bam...Thanks, I think
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: Electric Brake Booster
by Otmar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) RE: advanced solar battery
by "Mark Fowler" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: More info RE: actuations of brake/reservoir size
by "Chuck Hursch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: Solution for "Gone Postal's" broken tranny found
by "David Chapman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: Solution for "Gone Postal's" broken tranny found
by Doug Weathers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: Electric Power Steering (Part Deux)
by Evan Tuer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Was: actuations of brake/res; now arc suppr. in vac. sys.
by Bob Bath <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Does cryogenic harding really work ??(was Re: Dog clutches)
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
20) Orange Juice for Sale
by Chip Gribben <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: advanced solar battery
by "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: Who handles NEDRA tech questions for new builders????an' Stuff
by "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: Solution for "Gone Postal's" broken tranny found
by "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: actuations of brake/reservoir size
by "Roland Wiench" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: actuations of brake/reservoir size
by "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
Would the amount of pump pressure need to also consider the speed of the
vehicle? I suppose at forklift speeds they are not so concerned, (unless
they were racing down the interstate...)
Hmmm, forklift drag racing... Another entry for NEDRA
See the New Beetle EV Conversion Web Site at
www.cameronsoftware.com/ev/
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of M.G.
Sent: October 11, 2004 7:43 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Electric Power Steering (Part Deux)
Hyster lift trucks now use a system like this. The motor is a brushless DC
motor with a controller built in. An encoder is on the steering shaft
sensing movement , the more you move the shaft the faster the motor turns.
Mike G.
>
>Something to look at is a 2 speed motor drive using the stock steering
>unit. A pressure switch (or pressure sensor feeding a controller for
>smarter control) on the high pressure line could switch from high to low
>speed as needed. The low speed could be selected such that it could
>handle the minor corrections necessary for straightaway driving while the
>high speed could handle everything else.
>
>Add a little intelligence and a shaft encoder on the steering shaft and
>one could add anticipation to kick the motor to high speed when more than
>a certain wheel rate or excursion was detected. An input from vehicle
>speed could stop the motor when the car was stationary, until the wheel
>was moved, of course.
>
>
>
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Seth, the fact is we have made quite a few high amp launches with
this transaxle and it hasn't broke. I have not even autopsyed it yet.
Third gear might have been weekened when we broke the front axle last
time when we launched in second with the front tires spinning. They
were still boiling when I hit third and it grabbed traction and
twisted off the axle. Taking off in third eliminates the front wheel
spin. Turning up the amps in the rear reduces the duty cycle load on
the front. Like I said, we went from 0 to 80 MPH in the eigth this
way on the first run. Seth, where are you getting all this room to
install the Caddy transaxle that was made for a motor going fore and
aft. This whole bench racing reminds me of all the people who kept
saying to just drop in a nine inch Ford rear end in "Gone Postal" a
while back. There are many pictures of our layout. Please go look at
the pictures and tell me where you are getting your real estate. This
rig only has a 100 inch wheelbase. This rig is tiny and is stuffed
with 40 Exides.
Roderick Wilde
"Suck Amps EV Racing"
www.suckamps.com
Madman is right about the torque breaking the transaxle. And
shifting will be problematic with face dogs. Now if you had a
computer that knew all the gear ratios, the inertias of all the
parts, speed sensors on relevant shafts, estimates of drag and you
had regen, then you could do it in software. Without it, or a way to
retard the input shaft, you might make for some rounded over face
dogs pretty quickly. Eaton can't get shifting right on their
autostick, it isn't a trivial problem.
Go to the Caddy transaxle. With a torque converter and motor advance
you would have a better shot at it.. You would never have to operate
the front motor stalled.
Or calculate the torque at which you broke the VW transaxle and
limit the torque to that value and launch in an appropriate gear.
Even the latest greatest 6 speed VW transaxle is only rated for 260
ft-lb. That one is rated for more like 200 ft-lb. Figuring on the
torque ripple of a 4 cylinder, call it 400ft-lb, although getting
torque ripple data from an engine manufacturer is nearly impossible,
what little data I have indicates it is in the neighborhood of 1.8X
the mean of the 4 cycles.
If you are running at more than the peak spike of the peak rated
(mean) torque, then I don't think you can do much to keep it from
failing. Other than rebuilding transaxles and swapping them out on a
schedule. If you are actually removing the engagement castellations
on a syncromesh box, the face dogs could help, but there is still
the issue of shifting. If you are spreading the case from torque and
breaking teeth, face dogs won't do a bit of good.
Good luck
Seth
On Oct 11, 2004, at 7:55 PM, Rich Rudman wrote:
And did you tell him we can make 500 ftlbs of torque 0 to 1000 rpm???
Mention that the Armature on a 9 incher is like 50 to 75 lbs, and that's
without a Flywheel.
And we have NO negative torque at all. We have no compression breaking
actions, to spin the motor down When shifting.
If in your clear and sober mind... you think the front drive train can
take a 440 tunnel ram or a 460 with 850CFM and a stout 300deg Cam...Then we
can talk about getting all the front drive is worth,
to the ground.
I don't think the Dog clutches... will work well with the rotational weight
that we have to deal with.
I would certainly like to be wrong on this point.... Bang shifting from a
stout first gear, would be a total blast to drive.
Rod as you know it's not the Hp, it's the torque that We should be worring
about.
And getting that front motor to take 2000 amps without fireballing....
Some say it can't be done without movable brushes.....
And... and and.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Roderick Wilde" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, October 11, 2004 12:15 PM
Subject: Solution for "Gone Postal's" broken tranny found
While looking into options for our broken transaxle on "Gone Postal" I
surfed to find the top FWD VW drag racers and what they run. I also called
one of our sponsors Autotech Sport Tuning www.autotech.com. It turns out
that Quaife makes a rather expensive but effective solution called a six
speed dog set. It includes all new gears except reverse. These gears are
like those on Japanese motorcycles where there are dogs that engage in
slots
in opposing gears to engage the gears. They are 50% stronger than the
stock
set up and 25% stronger than the Quaife synchro gear set. I spoke with
Hodi
of Hodi's Performance who is a mechanic on the worlds quickest and fastest
FWD VW. It has 750 HP and turns 9.69 seconds at 145.16 MPH.
http://www.gtrmotorsports.net/GTR_racing/bios/brianbio.html They just run
the synchro gear set up. They were breaking third gear when they were
running 650 HP but now that they are running 750 HP they are breaking
fourth
gear every ten runs. I asked why they didn't go to the dog set up and he
said it was because of the expense. The dog gear transmission gear set
would
be sponsored to us for $5,500.00 which is and enormous amount of money but
redesigning, adding more weight and building a new transmission is also
expensive. We have no where near the horsepower they are running in their
VW
so I believe the dog gears would be the solution for our project. This
whole
thing just reminds me of how far we still have to go to harness our power
and dial in this monster.
Roderick Wilde
"Suck Amps EV Racing"
www.suckamps.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I am searching the old archives for a note about one of the big 3 who made
brake boosters which were electric, not vacuum. I was unable to find the
info. Can anyone tell me what car they were from?
thanks
Don
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
That's would be a nice choice. I'm on a Caddy list where a guy is running
11's with a souped up 500 and the stock tranny. This in a car that's about
the same weight as GP.
Tim
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, October 11, 2004 1:13 PM
Subject: Re: Solution for "Gone Postal's" broken tranny found
> Maybe a dumb question, but could you use the GM 475 transaxle? I
believe
it
> lived behind 400 HP 455 Oldsmobile and 501 Cadillac engines.
> David C. Wilker Jr.
> USAF (RET)
winner WINNER WINNER...
Yea if we can find one....this would be really nice.
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
now now you two, you are both right.
A standard gearbox retrofitted to have dog clutches requires a
little lift to switch or they will start falling out under load in short
order , but EV throttle lift could be electronic without moving your
foot :-)
A dog box, designed for the simplicity and closeness and lever
throughs ( or sync up-down paddles on a cam, even better---er sounds
like a bike tranny or formula 1)
anyway, these shift so slick that the unload needed is a lot lot
less.
The history of the racing tansaxle takes us from the vw bug through many
incarnations to the indy boxes. But those were all motor to axle
90degrees :-( Lots and Lots of cryogenic and shotpeened after market
gears are avial with oversized shafts and bearings as kits for those
transaxles. Use a VW bus ring and pinion for the added strength.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The advice I received from Autotech was to use a button on the
shifter to blank the pot during shifting. This kit uses much larger
shafts with closer ratio gears. It converts it to a six speed also.
You mentioned a bus ring and pinion. This is a Corrado FWD transaxle.
We already have the quaife diff installed.
Roderick Wilde
"Suck Amps EV Racing"
www.suckamps.com
now now you two, you are both right.
A standard gearbox retrofitted to have dog clutches requires a
little lift to switch or they will start falling out under load in
short order , but EV throttle lift could be electronic without
moving your foot :-)
A dog box, designed for the simplicity and closeness and lever
throughs ( or sync up-down paddles on a cam, even better---er sounds
like a bike tranny or formula 1)
anyway, these shift so slick that the unload needed is a lot lot less.
The history of the racing tansaxle takes us from the vw bug through
many incarnations to the indy boxes. But those were all motor to
axle 90degrees :-( Lots and Lots of cryogenic and shotpeened after
market gears are avial with oversized shafts and bearings as kits
for those transaxles. Use a VW bus ring and pinion for the added
strength.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hope someone can explain this one.
http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/english/doc/2004-10/11/content_381384.htm
Cars powered by this type of battery can keep running for up to 3,000 kilometers.
_______________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today!
http://vote.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Everyone,
I'm getting into the process of elimination on various project ideas of
late. Who can I direct specific questions to regarding what qualifies a
vehicle to be classed one way or another?
My goal is to build some sort of two-wheeled vehicle that can be safely
riden and raced without getting the black flag during tech inspection at the
first event I show up at.
I also have some questions about specific building techniques and component
placement that I would like some reassurance on before I commit hard earned
time, materials and hours of labor.
Just for those who may be wondering, I'm moving up the food chain from
ebikes. As fun and simple as they are to build and ride, they just won't
smoke the back tire. ;-))
It's all Bob Rice's fault!!!!! He had home movies of Woodburn and allowed me
to make a copy of it while he was here visiting in Phoenix.
Thanks and regards,
Rick Pryor
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello again to All,
I want to express a personal thanks to all of you who made Woodburn the life
altering event that it was for me, even though I only got to see it on tape,
read the post race show here on The List, and sift through hours of great
still photos on the various Sites.
I hope for the speediest (pun intended) and least expensive repairs to
everyone who broke stuff, and speedy recovery from bumps and bruises aquired
at the track. It was a heck-of-a-show!!!!
Regards,
Rick Pryor
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Here's an example of an Audi Transaxle in a GT40 Replica.
Go to Photo Gallery and third row from the bottom under "Silencers"
Would also make a nice EV project!
http://www.roaringforties.com.au/
Brad Ledger
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Michael I'd go back and look at the other drivers view. There might be
misaligned lights. If that is the case the city takes the fall. Lawrence
Rhodes.........
----- Original Message -----
From: "michael bearden" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, October 11, 2004 7:42 PM
Subject: Wham, Bam...Thanks, I think
> Well, my questions about what to do about parts for the next EV got
> answered today when a Toy pig-up turned in front of me at a traffic
> light as I rolled through the intersection inWATTABMR at close to the
> 40mph speed that is posted. It pasted the Toy pretty well, and I won't
> be driving the BMW anywhere again, but no one was hurt. I actually
> didn't feel any real impact, and I know it hit fairly hard. That
> BavarianMotorVerks makes stout cars! No one else stopped, so I don't
> have any witnesses to the fact that I didn't run a red light, ( and the
> other driver claims he had the arrow to turn) so I think the insurance
> companies are going to say "It's on you." My loss is my daily driver
> for now, but looking on the bright side, now I have everything I need to
> make a new EV-batteries, controller, charger, regs, DC/DC and a GE motor
> that is just nicely broken in after the last four years of driving (on
> the 16th of this month).
> Anybody got a VW transaxle adaptor gathering dust?
> Michael B.
>
> >
> >
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 8:17 PM -0700 10-11-04, Don Cameron wrote:
I am searching the old archives for a note about one of the big 3 who made
brake boosters which were electric, not vacuum. I was unable to find the
info. Can anyone tell me what car they were from?
Might be this:
http://www.geocities.com/diels12000/Booster.html
--
-Otmar-
http://www.CafeElectric.com/ Home of the Zilla.
http://www.evcl.com/914 My electric 914
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Here is what Google found about the good professor...
http://www.pv.unsw.edu.au/Staff/jianhuazhao.asp
So, yes, he has legitimate
experience/qualifications/publications/whatever.
What does the 3,000km bit mean?
It could be a reference to the many solar races across Australia that
universities like UNSW often participate in...
Dunno really :-)
When you consider that the sun supplies about 1kW per square metre, and
that solar cells are about 20% efficient at turning that into
electricity, you need about 50m^2 of cells to supply 10kW (a rough guess
at normal cruising power for a normal type car).
50m^2 is about 1/4 of the floor area of a modern 4 bedroom house.
I don't think the 3,000km refers to a normal car powered only by solar
cells :-)
Mark
-----Original Message-----
From: Lee Dekker [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, 12 October 2004 3:40 PM
To: EV world
Cc: Electrifying Times; EV SJS; [EMAIL PROTECTED];
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: advanced solar battery
Hope someone can explain this one.
http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/english/doc/2004-10/11/content_381384.htm
Cars powered by this type of battery can keep running for up to 3,000
kilometers.
_______________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today!
http://vote.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Bob,
In regards to your ? of how many brake actuations per toggle of
the vacuum pump, here's what my scene is.
I've got a modified VoltsRabbit. I never got the vacuum assist
scene to work on that car (fried relays and it went "blat" every
touch of the pedal). I gave up on that scene and went with no
vacuum assist for several years.
I finally got around to dealing with this situation about a year
ago. I was going to have my vacuum assist working nice, no two
ways about it! I'm still using the VoltsRabbit vacuum reservoir,
although Mike Brown years ago sent me a four-hole one to replace
the two-hole stocker. Now that I had four holes, I had plenty of
places to put in taps and a vacuum gauge, so I can see what's
going on and leak vacuum voluntarily (certainly helps set pump
on/off set points). The big change is going with the KTA
adjustable Square-D switch. It's big. It weighs a bit. It's
expensive ($80). It goes "clack" when it turns off (the loudest
part of the whole vacuum system now). It's reliable - the switch
points are holding up well after a year - I see maybe a little
carbon on them). And, it's adjustable. I have been told that
10" of vacuum is about what I should aim for on the low side. So
that's when the pump turns on as we're leaking vacuum. The
turn-off vacuum is 20". 4 presses of the break pedal to go from
20" to 10" (nice!), unless it's a super-hard stop. The system
will hold vacuum better than 10" for about 15 minutes, so I have
a bit of a leak somewhere, but I will live with it. Pumpdown
time from 0" to 20" is about 17 seconds. Amp draw on the pump
(same one that came with the VoltsRabbit originally) is about
8-9A. I have never fallen behind on pumping down - the pump
builds up plenty of vacuum in a hurry.
I've also got a muffler can ensconced down near the front
crossbeam just behind the front bumper. Any noise that's left
over after the muffler gets emptied into the crossbeam cavity.
Noise is not really an issue anymore. Vibration is still there
from the pump - I might be able to reduce that.
Now I'd like to ask a ? (asked once awhile back, but no one bit).
I avoid turning off the car's key switch when the pump is going -
I want to avoid arcing the main key-switch relay, which is a
chokepoint for turning the car on. What do I need in terms of
cap and resistors to stop the pump without arcing the key-switch
relay? The other issue is the pump is (nearly) always going to
start when I turn on the car, so same kind of ? there. I
remember Mike Brown circuit #1 had a diode in the circuit - maybe
that's all I need. So far the key switch relay is holding up to
all the turn-ons, but I'd like to be able to shut down without
waiting for the pump to pump things down.
Thanks,
Chuck
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Bath" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, October 11, 2004 7:49 PM
Subject: More info RE: actuations of brake/reservoir size
> I'm _certain_ after working with a vac. gauge that I
> don't have a leak.
> What I _am_ thinking, though, is that my vac.
> switch doesn't have a ton of leeway; in other words,
> it cuts in when there is still plenty of vacuum, and
> cuts out when it could pull the Hg down even further.
> I'm wondering if I should just bypass the existing
> switch, and hook up an adjustable one.
>
>
> =====
> '92 Honda Civic sedan, 144V
> ____
> __/__|__\ __
> =D-------/ - - \
> 'O'-----'O'-'
> Would you still drive your car if the tailpipe came out of the
steering wheel? Are you saving any gas for your kids?
>
>
>
> _______________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today!
> http://vote.yahoo.com
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Gee Rich, kinda unobservant of you when you were here last huh? Actually
probably just so focused on the task at hand that you weren't really
listening. And it WAS kinda hot. Your motor generator was parked literally
right in front of an 85 Toronado (the gold one with the sunroof) that I
mentioned I was parting out. It has the complete front wheel drive setup
that I felt would be the trick setup for a direct drive HP FWD EV. Tranny
was basically a Turbo 400 with the bellhousing cut off, turned 180 deg and
run via large link belt type chain. This was probably not the tranny you
would want anyway as it was the 4 spd OD model, has an extra planetary or
something, makes them weaker. Guy bought mine just to get the planetary and
some other critical core parts. You can get the same setup out of Caddy
Eldorados and Olds Toronados made up to `85. The Eldos made up to 76 had
500's, later 472s and the similar year Toros had 455's. I gotta believe you
could find a rustbucket with a good 3 spd trans up your way with a little
sniffing around, or if Rod decides to run direct drive this ones still
available (for a week or so). Shipping would be expensive tho. TTYL, David
Chapman.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, October 11, 2004 4:56 PM
Subject: Re: Solution for "Gone Postal's" broken tranny found
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Dave" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Monday, October 11, 2004 1:13 PM
> Subject: Re: Solution for "Gone Postal's" broken tranny found
>
>
> > Maybe a dumb question, but could you use the GM 475 transaxle? I believe
> it
> > lived behind 400 HP 455 Oldsmobile and 501 Cadillac engines.
> > David C. Wilker Jr.
> > USAF (RET)
>
> winner WINNER WINNER...
>
> Yea if we can find one....this would be really nice.
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Monday, October 11, 2004, at 06:58 PM, Roderick Wilde wrote:
I eventually would like to have the same fiber optic system that Bob
Schneiveis had on the four 8 inch motored Tarus that allowed you to
look at each motor's com. Come to think of it small remote cameras
might just be the trick.
Do a web search on "lipstick camera". For example, here's a page with
a variety of small video cameras on it.
http://www.cctvwholesalers.com/customer/home.php?cat=255
Never used any of 'em myself, so good luck :)
Roderick Wilde
"Suck Amps EV Racing"
www.suckamps.com
--
Doug Weathers
Bend, OR, USA
http://learn-something.blogsite.org
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Sat, 9 Oct 2004 15:55:59 -0700, Don Cameron <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I am putting a Toyota MR2 Electric Hydraulic Power Steering pump in my New
> Beetle (I know I can do without PS, but I would like to have it). This pump
> operates off of 12volts and I intend to power it from the accessory battery
> via the DC-DC converter integrated into the Siemens inverter. I know this
> setup will work, as Jon Pullen is running a similar setup in his EV.
>
> In order to keep power down, Sheer put an optical encoder on the steering
> column connected to a Big Honking Relay (tm - Sheer Pullen) to switch the PS
> pump on only when a person is actually turning.
I sometimes drive a GM Corsa with EPS (electric power steering) - it
looks like this:
http://www.bba-reman.com/vauxhall_corsa_power_steering.htm
It only draws current when it's doing something. It's probably not
suitable for you if your car had hydraulic PS in the first place but I
just thought I'd mention it.
> I was thinking, instead of a encoder setup, what if I had a high pressure
> reservoir, with a pressure sensor? Similar to a vacuum reservoir, when the
> pressure gets too low, the pump would kick in.
>
> Is this a silly idea? Is there even such a thing as a pressure vessel for
> hydraulic fluid? Any other ideas?
There is, but as others have pointed out, it won't do much for an open
spool system.
I would say stick with your hydraulic pump. If it's overloading the
12V system, run it off a small PWM controller with a current limit
that is suitable, and have a switch on the dashboard to change the
motor between "normal driving" and "parking mode", i.e. switch in
different resistances to the throttle input. Or use the encoder to do
that..
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I still say that adjustability in the square D switch
is the big kahuna here.
Amazing; I'm scouting for the info on that dang
diode setup to prevent arcing (because I need to
install it too), and can't find it anywhere! You are
correct. There are two diodes involved in the system.
Let's see if by re-labeling the send, we can get Lee
or someone to remind us...
--- Chuck Hursch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi Bob,
>
> In regards to your ? of how many brake actuations
> per toggle of
> the vacuum pump, here's what my scene is.
>
> I've got a modified VoltsRabbit. I never got the
> vacuum assist
> scene to work on that car (fried relays and it went
> "blat" every
> touch of the pedal). I gave up on that scene and
> went with no
> vacuum assist for several years.
>
> I finally got around to dealing with this situation
> about a year
> ago. I was going to have my vacuum assist working
> nice, no two
> ways about it! I'm still using the VoltsRabbit
> vacuum reservoir,
> although Mike Brown years ago sent me a four-hole
> one to replace
> the two-hole stocker. Now that I had four holes, I
> had plenty of
> places to put in taps and a vacuum gauge, so I can
> see what's
> going on and leak vacuum voluntarily (certainly
> helps set pump
> on/off set points). The big change is going with
> the KTA
> adjustable Square-D switch. It's big. It weighs a
> bit. It's
> expensive ($80). It goes "clack" when it turns off
> (the loudest
> part of the whole vacuum system now). It's reliable
> - the switch
> points are holding up well after a year - I see
> maybe a little
> carbon on them). And, it's adjustable. I have been
> told that
> 10" of vacuum is about what I should aim for on the
> low side. So
> that's when the pump turns on as we're leaking
> vacuum. The
> turn-off vacuum is 20". 4 presses of the break
> pedal to go from
> 20" to 10" (nice!), unless it's a super-hard stop.
> The system
> will hold vacuum better than 10" for about 15
> minutes, so I have
> a bit of a leak somewhere, but I will live with it.
> Pumpdown
> time from 0" to 20" is about 17 seconds. Amp draw
> on the pump
> (same one that came with the VoltsRabbit originally)
> is about
> 8-9A. I have never fallen behind on pumping down -
> the pump
> builds up plenty of vacuum in a hurry.
>
> I've also got a muffler can ensconced down near the
> front
> crossbeam just behind the front bumper. Any noise
> that's left
> over after the muffler gets emptied into the
> crossbeam cavity.
> Noise is not really an issue anymore. Vibration is
> still there
> from the pump - I might be able to reduce that.
>
> Now I'd like to ask a ? (asked once awhile back, but
> no one bit).
> I avoid turning off the car's key switch when the
> pump is going -
> I want to avoid arcing the main key-switch relay,
> which is a
> chokepoint for turning the car on. What do I need
> in terms of
> cap and resistors to stop the pump without arcing
> the key-switch
> relay? The other issue is the pump is (nearly)
> always going to
> start when I turn on the car, so same kind of ?
> there. I
> remember Mike Brown circuit #1 had a diode in the
> circuit - maybe
> that's all I need. So far the key switch relay is
> holding up to
> all the turn-ons, but I'd like to be able to shut
> down without
> waiting for the pump to pump things down.
>
> Thanks,
> Chuck
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bob Bath" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Monday, October 11, 2004 7:49 PM
> Subject: More info RE: actuations of brake/reservoir
> size
>
>
> > I'm _certain_ after working with a vac. gauge that
> I
> > don't have a leak.
> > What I _am_ thinking, though, is that my vac.
> > switch doesn't have a ton of leeway; in other
> words,
> > it cuts in when there is still plenty of vacuum,
> and
> > cuts out when it could pull the Hg down even
> further.
> > I'm wondering if I should just bypass the existing
> > switch, and hook up an adjustable one.
> >
> >
> > =====
> > '92 Honda Civic sedan, 144V
> > ____
> > __/__|__\ __
> > =D-------/ - - \
> > 'O'-----'O'-'
> > Would you still drive your car if the tailpipe
> came out of the
> steering wheel? Are you saving any gas for your
> kids?
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today!
> > http://vote.yahoo.com
> >
>
>
=====
'92 Honda Civic sedan, 144V
____
__/__|__\ __
=D-------/ - - \
'O'-----'O'-'
Would you still drive your car if the tailpipe came out of the steering wheel? Are you
saving any gas for your kids?
_______________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today!
http://vote.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I was told by a driveline shop to get my gears cryo'd after
I went dropped by third transmission.
Does cryogenic harding really work ??
Robert Salem
> now now you two, you are both right.
> A standard gearbox retrofitted to have dog clutches requires a
> little lift to switch or they will start falling out under load in short
> order , but EV throttle lift could be electronic without moving your
> foot :-)
> A dog box, designed for the simplicity and closeness and lever
> throughs ( or sync up-down paddles on a cam, even better---er sounds
> like a bike tranny or formula 1)
> anyway, these shift so slick that the unload needed is a lot lot
> less.
>
> The history of the racing tansaxle takes us from the vw bug through many
> incarnations to the indy boxes. But those were all motor to axle
> 90degrees :-( Lots and Lots of cryogenic and shotpeened after market
>
gears are avial with oversized shafts and bearings as kits for those
> transaxles. Use a VW bus ring and pinion for the added strength.
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The fastest electric dragster east of the Arizona is up for sale on Ebay
Orange Juice is listed as eBay item 2493994880
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2493994880
Shawn Lawless, of Lawless Industries in Ohio, says he needs more floor space
for his bigger EV projects, which includes electric powered parade floats.
He still plans to continue drag racing EVs and plans to race at our next
Power of DC race in June 2005. Hopefully the new owner will be there with
Orange Juice as well.
Here are the specs:
*500 Horsepower, 240 Volt, 3000 Amp Electric Dragster
*Own the Fastest and Quickest EV east of Arizona !!!
*Best time last season of 10.8 seconds at 119.50!
*Fastest 240 volt dragster in the world and only .25 seconds off the world
record 1/4 mile time of 10.55 seconds!
*This is one of the world's premier racing EV's. It has been professionally
built and maintained by an industrial EV manufacturer in Northeast Ohio.
*As seen in a recent issue of Drag News.
*260" Wheelbase (former NHRA alky chassis).
*80 pcs. of SVR 12 volt -14 amp-hr batteries.
*Heavy-Duty custom built multi-speed motor control system.
*2pcs. GE Series wound motors.
*Powerglide 2 speed transmission w/ 3500 stall converter.
*9" rear w/ 3 sets of gears (3.23, 4.11, 5.14).
*New Goodyear slicks size 33.5x15.
*Variac charger with 30 channel Rudman Regulator board and harness.
AUCTION ENDS OCTOBER 18
As seen on the NEDRA and Power of DC sites
http://www.nedra.com
http://www.powerofdc.com
Let's wish Shawn luck on finding a good home for Orange Juice!!
Chip Gribben
NEDRA Webmaster
http://www.nedra.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lee Dekker" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "EV world" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: "Electrifying Times" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; "EV SJS"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>;
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2004 1:39 AM
Subject: advanced solar battery
> Hope someone can explain this one.
>
>
> http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/english/doc/2004-10/11/content_381384.htm
>
>
> Cars powered by this type of battery can keep running for up to 3,000
kilometers.
>
> Hi All;
I'm baaaack! I' ll comment on that one. Maybe the battery will LAST
before replacement, 3000km<g>!But they are working on it. We laughed at the
Toyota Toyopets and VW Bugs that first hit these shores, too.When China gets
her act together, we may see something in EV's yet?
BTW I got back Mon to CT after a great trip,albiet a LONG time on the
road. More to follow on that, stay tuned. The Prius ran FLAWLESSLY! Just
turn the key, and enjoy the miricle of hybrid technology wought for me by
the Good Folks at Toyota. It never missed a beat, flowing up hills at
alditude that had my poor older Nissan Sentra gasping for breath. Must be
the computer stuff aboard, but when it craps out I wouldn't know what to dio
to fix it! Maybe a Prius would make a good glider for a REAL ev? they are
only 2500 lbs as a hybrid, without my RR bag and toolbox aboard.Oh yeah, I
did anywhere from 42 to 50 MPG depending on how fast I went. 75-80mph knocks
the hell out of the miliage, but if you don't want to be run over by the
trucks out there you hafta go passenger train speeds, I go back here.
Seeya on the train
Bob
>
> _______________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today!
> http://vote.yahoo.com
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2004 1:51 AM
Subject: Who handles NEDRA tech questions for new builders????
> Hi Everyone,
>
> I'm getting into the process of elimination on various project ideas of
> late. Who can I direct specific questions to regarding what qualifies a
> vehicle to be classed one way or another?
>
> My goal is to build some sort of two-wheeled vehicle that can be safely
> riden and raced without getting the black flag during tech inspection at
the
> first event I show up at.
>
> I also have some questions about specific building techniques and
component
> placement that I would like some reassurance on before I commit hard
earned
> time, materials and hours of labor.
>
> Just for those who may be wondering, I'm moving up the food chain from
> ebikes. As fun and simple as they are to build and ride, they just won't
> smoke the back tire. ;-))
> It's all Bob Rice's fault!!!!! He had home movies of Woodburn and allowed
me
> to make a copy of it while he was here visiting in Phoenix.
>
> Thanks and regards,
> Rick Pryor
> Hi Rick;
Got back Mon to the Land of Autumm, CT ,Mon. OK Many thanks for the
stay! Was great seeing you guyz, Tom an' Dave, too ! You were willing to sit
through hours of my firehose theory of cinamatography, what ever quirky
stuff I shot, Trolleys.trains, coalmines, wind turbines Queen Mary ,Etc ,
an' Rabbits, and that was just this trip!Big Country! I take the blame.
MORE EV's on the road, There is more interest, then EVer! A guy called me
last nite on the landline, got me off the EEE New England website, wants to
go EV, I sent him, I hope to the EV Album, to sniff around tio see what
EVerybody else is doing, the EV tradin' post and whatnot. I think he should
just BUY a built EV and go from there, after all, they retain trheir value,
if it isn't for him, he can download it and get his money back, at least
most of it. Not very many hobbies offer that feature.
Seeya
Bob
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tim Clevenger" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, October 11, 2004 11:20 PM
Subject: Re: Solution for "Gone Postal's" broken tranny found
> That's would be a nice choice. I'm on a Caddy list where a guy is running
> 11's with a souped up 500 and the stock tranny. This in a car that's
about
> the same weight as GP.
>
> Tim
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Dave" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Monday, October 11, 2004 1:13 PM
> Subject: Re: Solution for "Gone Postal's" broken tranny found
>
>
> > Maybe a dumb question, but could you use the GM 475 transaxle? I
> believe
> it
> > lived behind 400 HP 455 Oldsmobile and 501 Cadillac engines.
> > David C. Wilker Jr.
> > USAF (RET)
>
> winner WINNER WINNER...
>
> Yea if we can find one....this would be really nice.
>
> OK Rich, I'll sniff around here in CT , if one lays, unloved in a local
junkyard.Or the Bargain News Auto parts dept.
Bob
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
To measure the number of brake actuations, I getting with my vacuum system,
I have to the car not running and everything shut down.
I have a GMC vacuum pump that is normally used on a GMC diesel engine, that
run continuously which is belted off the accessories drive unit.
Running the vacuum pump to a 4 by 8 inch reservoir and than directly to the
brake vacuum booster, cause the vacuum drop from 22 in.hg to below 10 in.hg
on every brake actuations.
Got worst when I tapped of this line to run other vacuum accessories.
So I added a vacuum check value (the same type as on the brake booster) on
the outlet of the vacuum reservoir and another one on this line to another
vacuum reservoir (the existing one used for the car vacuum accessories which
also has a built in check value.
I also replace the check value on the brake booster to a new one.
Test Results:
Starting up the accessorie drive to run the vacuum pump, vacuum came up to
22 in.hg.
Shut down the pump and test for leaks, vacuum is holding at 21 to 22 in.hg.
(a little bounce back).
Depress the brakes and vacuum drops about 4 in.hg. at a time. So I get about
3 to 4 brake actuations while the pump is not running after I did this mod.
Roland
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Bath" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, October 11, 2004 6:11 PM
Subject: actuations of brake/reservoir size
> Okay EVers; how many brake actuations are you getting
> per pull on the vac. pump?
> I'm getting ONE! It's a Randy Holmquist pump with a
> KTA reservoir (about 18" long x 3" dia). It just
> seems like I got more with the setup Mike Brown had on
> the Rabbit. I've replaced the vac. booster, and maybe
> I'll have more actuations after I bleed the line, but
> right now it looks like still one brake actuation per
> pump pull. (This model is non-adjustable).
> Thanks,
>
> =====
> '92 Honda Civic sedan, 144V
> ____
> __/__|__\ __
> =D-------/ - - \
> 'O'-----'O'-'
> Would you still drive your car if the tailpipe came out of the steering
> wheel? Are you saving any gas for your kids?
>
>
>
> _______________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today!
> http://vote.yahoo.com
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Bath" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, October 11, 2004 8:11 PM
Subject: actuations of brake/reservoir size
> Okay EVers; how many brake actuations are you getting
> per pull on the vac. pump?
> I'm getting ONE! It's a Randy Holmquist pump with a
> KTA reservoir (about 18" long x 3" dia). It just
> seems like I got more with the setup Mike Brown had on
> the Rabbit. I've replaced the vac. booster, and maybe
> I'll have more actuations after I bleed the line, but
> right now it looks like still one brake actuation per
> pump pull. (This model is non-adjustable).
> Thanks,
>
> =====
> '92 Honda Civic sedan, 144V
> Hi All;
You can go cheep an' dirty, works for me, take the origional VW Diseasel
vacuum pump, belt drive it off the motor front end, car is already used to
that pump, anyhow<g>!Did have lube problems at first, as it is splaslh lubed
off the Diseasel, so retrofitted it with a greese fitting on thoe housing
cover plate, when it goes dry, don't worry it will let you know! A few shots
of greese quiets it right down.
Other ideas.
Seeya
Bob, about 2500 messages behind!____
> __/__|__\ __
> =D-------/ - - \
> 'O'-----'O'-'
> Would you still drive your car if the tailpipe came out of the steering
wheel? Are you saving any gas for your kids?
>
>
>
> _______________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today!
> http://vote.yahoo.com
>
--- End Message ---
