EV Digest 3842
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: Amps and torque (was: Woodburn 2004, My response to Rudman)
by "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: wattsinthebox runs on own power
by "Tom Shay" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: etek motor
by David Bettencourt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) RE: Li-Ion Conference - December 06 - Is ANY ONE GOING ??
by "Mark Fowler" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Electric hog motorcycle (Re: wattsinthebox runs on own power)
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) RE: Electric fuel pump control question
by "Erik Hjortshoj" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) RE: Electric fuel pump control question
by "Erik Hjortshoj" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re:New Batteries Needed-long OT
by "Raymond Knight" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: Electric hog motorcycle (Re: wattsinthebox runs on own power)
by "Christopher Robison" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: Electric hog motorcycle (Re: wattsinthebox runs on own power)
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: Electric fuel pump control question
by Martin Klingensmith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) RE: Electric hog motorcycle (Re: wattsinthebox runs on own power)
by "Shawn Waggoner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) RE: Electric hog motorcycle (Re: wattsinthebox runs on own
power)
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
14) RE: Electric hog motorcycle (Re: wattsinthebox runs on own power)
by "Shawn Waggoner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) golf cart mishap
by Rod Hower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) 220/110 input/running AC adapt. to brushless fan issue
by Bob Bath <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: Todd PC30
by "Joe Smalley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Smaller custom-made chopper
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
19) Metal spraying or welding?
by "David Chapman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: Metal spraying or welding?
by richard ball <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: golf cart mishap
by richard ball <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: Metal spraying or welding?
by Evan Tuer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: Metal spraying or welding?
by Seth Allen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: 220/110 input/running AC adapt. to brushless fan issue
by "Roland Wiench" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) RE: Todd PC30
by Steven Tweed <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) Re: Todd PC30
by Jon Glauser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) For those who want to experiment with little batteries
by "John G. Lussmyer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: "Joe Smalley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Rich had a "senior moment" and forgot to set the
> current limit up to 2000 amps for the Woodburn race.
>
Actually it was not a senior moment at all. I just figured that Rod and I
would have some track time
BEFORE Woodburn, and we would get it all sorted out then.
It never happened, THEN I biffed the laptop at Woodburn.
Rod still managed to break GP with my ....."tame Street" settings.
Oh Well....
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The sight of a homemade sidecar makes me uneasy. A
sidecar is dangerous enough when professionally
designed and built with proper attention paid to
details like sidecar wheel lead and toe in. The reason
this rig is hard to turn is probably excessive wheel lead.
Lead is evident from the image linked in Terry's message.
Wheel lead is placement of the sidecar wheel slightly
ahead of the motorcycle's rear wheel and is intended to
improve handling at high speed.
----- Original Message -----
From: "bruce parmenter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "evlist" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, October 07, 2004 6:12 PM
Subject: wattsinthebox runs on own power
Its been a year since I took this image
http://geocities.com/brucedp/images/wattsinthebox030913-10.jpg
Now,
Terry Wilson EAA Historian has driven his EV project,
wattsinthebox, an Electric motorcycle with a sidecar,
on city streets under its own power.
Being a direct drive, the slow acceleration he mentions
is to be expected. Terry is an EV newbie and should be
congratulated! :-)
(send email directly as he is not on the EV List)
The EV will be at the Silicon Valley Rally this Saturday
10am-4pm at Palo Alto High School (Embarcadero and El
Camino Real, Palo Alto, CA)
-[edited]
From: "terry wilson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: wattsinthebox runs
Date: Wed, 6 Oct 2004 18:26:13 -0700
Well, after an initial failure, my
sidehack is running. Turns out the 300 amp, 72
volt Curtis doesn't work. However, the 96 volt
200 amp Curtis does! It's slow acceleration from
dead stop but then picks up quickly! It's hard
to turn but tracks straight nicely.
Bill Palmer is going to trailer "wattsinthebox"
to the Rally
[...]
See you at the Rally Saturday,
T.W.
-
=====
Bruce {EVangel} Parmenter
' ____
~/__|o\__
'@----- @'---(=
. http://geocities.com/brucedp/
. EV List Editor, RE & AFV newswires
. (originator of the above ASCII art)
=====
_______________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today!
http://vote.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Aloha Badfishracing: I have a single ETEK that we mounted with a
variable pitch propeller to test thrust and heating in an untralight
application. We're trying to size the batteries (model airplane nicads
right now) so that we don't require a controller, but this has
complicated the test rig. We require a similar quick burst of power for
15 seconds, followed by the need for about half the max for another 15
seconds, followed by about one quarter for one minute. Any suggestions??
Mahalo for any answers. David.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Guys,
I'm running two eteks in my 48V drag bike. I've seen 1200 amps across 2 motors in
parallel, so at least 600 amps per. I'll look for some data logs, but I recall about
700 or 800 amps when the motors are in series. Others on the list warn of
demagnetizing the fields at high currents, but I'm definately not losing any torque.
But that's pretty short duration. All this is at 48V. I've heard that 96V is
possible. It's something I want to venture into, but haven't gotten there yet. Once
an etek gets up to speed, they don't draw much for amps. Does the 400 amp Alltrax
have 400 amps constant, or for a few minutes? I'm sure your 400 amp controller won't
stay at 400 amps for very long. As I'm sure you've heard elsewhere, 'SUCK AMPS'
Darin
-------------- Original message from "Brown, Jay" : --------------
Darin,
Hi! This is my first post. I've been lurking for about a month now.
I myself just bought an Etek for a go-cart I'm building and was curious
how many amps you are running to each of your motors? I have a 400amp,
48V Alltrax controller. The motor is rated for [EMAIL PROTECTED] which I
had assumed I could go past as long as it's not for very long. Any idea
what the upper limit for amperage and voltage is on these motors?
Thanks!
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Jay Brown (EV newbie)
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, October 07, 2004 9:26 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: etek motor
Hello and welcome Richard,
I've got twin eteks on my bike. Mounted face to face so they turn in
opposite directions. I've measured current draw on both motors when on
my load bench, and they will pull pretty much the same current when
running either direction. I have adjusted the field timing a tiny bit
to get the motors to share the load equally.
Sorry to make a short story long, but I was hoping others would agree
and not disagree with my observations.
Either direction is fine in my opinion.
Darin
-------------- Original message from richard ball : --------------
hi
i'm new to the group so forgive me if this has been
covered before
i've bought a briggs etek motor for my ev project
the terminals are not marked + or -
does this mean the etek will run in either direction
or is there a rotation direction of preference ?
sorry if this is a daft question but i'm just starting
to learn about evs in general
regards
richard
location uk
___________________________________________________________ALL-NEW
Yahoo!
Messenger - all new features - even more fun!
http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
It certainly looks interesting.
Day 1 seems to be dedicated to small mobile applications - phones, PDAs
and computer type stuff.
Day 2 looks far more interesting from an EV perspective:
Making big batteries safe and give lots of power.
It looks like there are a lot of places looking for solutions to the
problems that the current generation of Li Ion batteries have.
Unfortunately, since the conference is on the other side of the planet,
I won't be attending.
Mark
-----Original Message-----
From: Steven Lough [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Saturday, 9 October 2004 1:52 AM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List RCVR
Subject: Li-Ion Conference - December 04 - Is ANY ONE GOING ??
I have to admit that the reason I posted the facts on this conference,
is curiosity, and jealousy. Curiosity - for I would like to know what
is going on in the industry, and jealousy, for I can not afford to
attend such conferences...my self..
But... I really thought that at least ONE or TWO on the EVDiscussion
list engineer types, would be attending ???
Is there no one ???
Lithium Mobile Power 2004
Advances in Lithium Battery Technologies for MOBILE Applications
Lithium Sulfur . Lithium Ion . Lithium Polymer
December 6-7, 2004 Fontainebleau Hilton . Miami Beach FL
www.knowledgefoundation.com
--
Steven S. Lough, Pres.
Seattle EV Association
6021 32nd Ave. N.E.
Seattle, WA 98115-7230
Day: 206 850-8535
Eve: 206 524-1351
e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
web: http://www.seattleeva.org
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Speaking of EM, I meant to post a few links for a
motorcycle conversion done by one of my customers.
This is stretched version of a Harley bike, perhaps
as heavy as my CRX use to be when it carried ten 27TMH
Trojans. This bile also has 120V system - 10 Trojans
skillfully crammed in it! Built by Carl Vogel and shown
in CA somewhere. He stopped by on the way back home
to New York, and I took these photos which you may find
interesting.
Carl has really cool Siemens system now and 110 50Ah
LiIon cells for either upgrading this bike or building a
new one , but so far as I understand hasn't have a chance
to do it yet.
http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1425.jpg
http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1424.jpg
http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1426.jpg
http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1427.jpg
http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1428.jpg
http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1429.jpg
http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1430.jpg
http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1431.jpg
http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1432.jpg
http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1433.jpg
bruce parmenter wrote:
Its been a year since I took this image
http://geocities.com/brucedp/images/wattsinthebox030913-10.jpg
Now,
Terry Wilson EAA Historian has driven his EV project,
wattsinthebox, an Electric motorcycle with a sidecar,
on city streets under its own power.
...
--
Victor
'91 ACRX - something different
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Modified ICE street cars w/ 350-400+ HP can pull in excess of 1
gal/minute, at wide-open-throttle, but don't require a fuel pump like
anything that.
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Lee Hart
Sent: Thursday, October 07, 2004 3:04 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Electric fuel pump control question
Raymond Knight wrote:
> ... a race fuel pump from Weiand... rated at 18amps @ 12volt...
> $1000... duty cycle is only 15 minutes...
12v at 18 amps? That's around 1/4 horsepower, which is crazy for a fuel
pump! It sounds like mindless stupid overkill, to con the gullible out
of their money.
Am I missing something? Is he really trying to deliver many gallons per
minute at high pressures?
--
"Never doubt that the work of a small group of thoughtful, committed
citizens can change the world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever
has!" -- Margaret Mead
--
Lee A. Hart 814 8th Ave N Sartell MN 56377 leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I do believe race cars pull a couple of gallons per minute at wide open
throttle - maybe not many.
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Lee Hart
Sent: Thursday, October 07, 2004 3:04 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Electric fuel pump control question
Raymond Knight wrote:
> ... a race fuel pump from Weiand... rated at 18amps @ 12volt...
> $1000... duty cycle is only 15 minutes...
12v at 18 amps? That's around 1/4 horsepower, which is crazy for a fuel
pump! It sounds like mindless stupid overkill, to con the gullible out
of their money.
Am I missing something? Is he really trying to deliver many gallons per
minute at high pressures?
--
"Never doubt that the work of a small group of thoughtful, committed
citizens can change the world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever
has!" -- Margaret Mead
--
Lee A. Hart 814 8th Ave N Sartell MN 56377 leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I will take this all form my product specification books, the list price
quoted is from the respective company's price (in Canadian dollars), not my
list or selling price. As I have said before I will give anyone on the list
a heavy discount where I can.
Note amp hour ratings are 20hr/5hr
Model AMPS L W H
List
Trojan T-105 225/171 62lbs 10 3/8 x 7 1/8 x 10 7/8 $158.16
Deka PS2200 225 62lbs same
$141.99
Trojan T-125 235/192 66lbs same
$181.36
Deka PS125 235 66lbs same
$166.99
Trojan T-145 244/209 72lbs same
$242.20
Deka PS145 244 72lbs same
$288.99
Deka 9C11 250/210 72lbs 11 3/4 x 7 x 11 1/2
$230.99
Deka 8C6V 330/270 98lbs 11 3/4 x 7 x 14 3/8 $279.99
Deka 8L16 370/295 113lbs 11 3/4 x 7 x 16 1/2
$314.99
Deka 8GGC2 180 ??? 10 1/4 x 7 1/8 x 10 3/4 $303.70
(gel cell, not AGM)
Hope the little chart works. The pricing is all over for these types of
batteries, so what they will cost depends greatly on where you live and who
you are talking to. I am a dealer for both brands, but the T-105's are
cheaper at a local golf cart dealer, he retails for below my cost ($90Can).
I just sold a set of 8 of the 8C6V for $200 each and a set of 6 PS2200 for
$95 each, so list prices are almost meaningless.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Holy shunt -- that's a massive bike! I guess if you accidentally put this
one over, it's best to just leave it where it lies, rather than risk a
hernia... and hope the acid spilling out of the tilted floodies hasn't
soaked through your pantleg.
Am I exaggerating the problem here -- are floodeds a popular choice with
EM conversions? Do the caps tend to stay on well enough to minimize the
spillage if the bike goes down?
--c.r.
Victor Tikhonov said:
> Speaking of EM, I meant to post a few links for a
> motorcycle conversion done by one of my customers.
> This is stretched version of a Harley bike, perhaps
> as heavy as my CRX use to be when it carried ten 27TMH
> Trojans. This bile also has 120V system - 10 Trojans
> skillfully crammed in it! Built by Carl Vogel and shown
> in CA somewhere. He stopped by on the way back home
> to New York, and I took these photos which you may find
> interesting.
>
> Carl has really cool Siemens system now and 110 50Ah
> LiIon cells for either upgrading this bike or building a
> new one , but so far as I understand hasn't have a chance
> to do it yet.
>
> http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1425.jpg
> http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1424.jpg
> http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1426.jpg
> http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1427.jpg
> http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1428.jpg
> http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1429.jpg
> http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1430.jpg
> http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1431.jpg
> http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1432.jpg
> http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1433.jpg
>
>
> bruce parmenter wrote:
>> Its been a year since I took this image
>> http://geocities.com/brucedp/images/wattsinthebox030913-10.jpg
>>
>> Now,
>> Terry Wilson EAA Historian has driven his EV project,
>> wattsinthebox, an Electric motorcycle with a sidecar,
>> on city streets under its own power.
> ...
> --
> Victor
> '91 ACRX - something different
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I have no idea as never owned (or even sat on) a bike,
electric or otherwise. Perhaps Bill can comment on
how you'd get fallen bike like this back upright.
You really better never fall with it, especially if yo also
carry a passenger.
Whole thing must weigh about 500 kg (1000 lbs) my guess...
BTW, Carl has a web site about his projects (with movies etc.):
http://www.vogelbilt.com/
Victor
Christopher Robison wrote:
Holy shunt -- that's a massive bike! I guess if you accidentally put this
one over, it's best to just leave it where it lies, rather than risk a
hernia... and hope the acid spilling out of the tilted floodies hasn't
soaked through your pantleg.
Am I exaggerating the problem here -- are floodeds a popular choice with
EM conversions? Do the caps tend to stay on well enough to minimize the
spillage if the bike goes down?
...
http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1425.jpg
http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1424.jpg
http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1426.jpg
http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1427.jpg
http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1428.jpg
http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1429.jpg
http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1430.jpg
http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1431.jpg
http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1432.jpg
http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1433.jpg
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
12v at 18 amps? That's around 1/4 horsepower, which is crazy for a fuel
pump! It sounds like mindless stupid overkill, to con the gullible out
of their money.
Am I missing something? Is he really trying to deliver many gallons per
minute at high pressures?
--
"Never doubt that the work of a small group of thoughtful, committed
citizens can change the world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever
has!" -- Margaret Mead
--
Lee A. Hart 814 8th Ave N Sartell MN 56377 leeahart_at_earthlink.net
Fuel pumps are very inefficient, the motor being liquid immersed and
whatnot.
--
--
Martin Klingensmith
http://infoarchive.net/
http://nnytech.net/
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I got to see Carl's bike while it was in FL with the EcoTrekker crew.
First, it is a great bike, nicely done! The bike weighs close to 1100lbs
though! A Harley Sportster or equiv. bike might weigh in around
550-650lbs. If you drop it, you get a few friends to help. But remember,
on a bike, you're not lifting all the weight straight up. It does pivot
on the wheels, but 1100lbs is really heavy!
I really liked the mounting and use of the tranny on the bike. I think
this gives the performance a great flexibility. My current electric bike
project uses a direct drive. I have a shaft drive Honda Shadow frame I
modified and will run at 72V with Exide Orbital Blue Tops. I am coupling
the ADC motor with the shaft where the original tranny used to be. (More
details to follow...have been set back due to the ::many:: hurricanes
down here.)
Shawn M. Waggoner
<Wind Blown and wet> Florida EAA
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Victor Tikhonov
Sent: Friday, October 08, 2004 17:36
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Electric hog motorcycle (Re: wattsinthebox runs on own
power)
I have no idea as never owned (or even sat on) a bike,
electric or otherwise. Perhaps Bill can comment on
how you'd get fallen bike like this back upright.
You really better never fall with it, especially if yo also
carry a passenger.
Whole thing must weigh about 500 kg (1000 lbs) my guess...
BTW, Carl has a web site about his projects (with movies etc.):
http://www.vogelbilt.com/
Victor
Christopher Robison wrote:
> Holy shunt -- that's a massive bike! I guess if you accidentally put
this
> one over, it's best to just leave it where it lies, rather than risk a
> hernia... and hope the acid spilling out of the tilted floodies
hasn't
> soaked through your pantleg.
>
> Am I exaggerating the problem here -- are floodeds a popular choice
with
> EM conversions? Do the caps tend to stay on well enough to minimize
the
> spillage if the bike goes down?
...
>>
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1425.jpg
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1424.jpg
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1426.jpg
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1427.jpg
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1428.jpg
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1429.jpg
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1430.jpg
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1431.jpg
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1432.jpg
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1433.jpg
>>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
You may not be too far off. Most decent sized motorcycles ( greater than 250
cc) are going to weigh in at around 400 lbs. Honda Reflex 250 cc scooter 375
lbs, Suzuki Burgmann 400 cc scooter 405 lbs, Honda Silverwing 650 cc over
500 lbs. If that beast is packing 10 Group 27 batteries, probably 50 lbs
each, and depending on what model Harley he converted, it could be well in
excess of 1000 lbs.
-----Original Message-----
From: Victor Tikhonov [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, October 08, 2004 5:36 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Electric hog motorcycle (Re: wattsinthebox runs on own power)
I have no idea as never owned (or even sat on) a bike,
electric or otherwise. Perhaps Bill can comment on
how you'd get fallen bike like this back upright.
You really better never fall with it, especially if yo also carry a
passenger. Whole thing must weigh about 500 kg (1000 lbs) my guess...
BTW, Carl has a web site about his projects (with movies etc.):
http://www.vogelbilt.com/
Victor
Christopher Robison wrote:
> Holy shunt -- that's a massive bike! I guess if you accidentally put
> this one over, it's best to just leave it where it lies, rather than
> risk a hernia... and hope the acid spilling out of the tilted
> floodies hasn't soaked through your pantleg.
>
> Am I exaggerating the problem here -- are floodeds a popular choice
> with EM conversions? Do the caps tend to stay on well enough to
> minimize the spillage if the bike goes down?
...
>>
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1425.jpg
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1424.jpg
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1426.jpg
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1427.jpg
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1428.jpg
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1429.jpg
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1430.jpg
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1431.jpg
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1432.jpg
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1433.jpg
>>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
According to the info on Ken trough's site on the Electra Cruiser, the
bike weighs in at 1200lbs. http://visforvoltage.com/vol2iss1/vogel.html
(Turn to page three or four).
Shawn
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, October 08, 2004 19:50
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: Electric hog motorcycle (Re: wattsinthebox runs on own
power)
You may not be too far off. Most decent sized motorcycles ( greater than
250
cc) are going to weigh in at around 400 lbs. Honda Reflex 250 cc scooter
375
lbs, Suzuki Burgmann 400 cc scooter 405 lbs, Honda Silverwing 650 cc
over
500 lbs. If that beast is packing 10 Group 27 batteries, probably 50 lbs
each, and depending on what model Harley he converted, it could be well
in
excess of 1000 lbs.
-----Original Message-----
From: Victor Tikhonov [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, October 08, 2004 5:36 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Electric hog motorcycle (Re: wattsinthebox runs on own
power)
I have no idea as never owned (or even sat on) a bike,
electric or otherwise. Perhaps Bill can comment on
how you'd get fallen bike like this back upright.
You really better never fall with it, especially if yo also carry a
passenger. Whole thing must weigh about 500 kg (1000 lbs) my guess...
BTW, Carl has a web site about his projects (with movies etc.):
http://www.vogelbilt.com/
Victor
Christopher Robison wrote:
> Holy shunt -- that's a massive bike! I guess if you accidentally put
> this one over, it's best to just leave it where it lies, rather than
> risk a hernia... and hope the acid spilling out of the tilted
> floodies hasn't soaked through your pantleg.
>
> Am I exaggerating the problem here -- are floodeds a popular choice
> with EM conversions? Do the caps tend to stay on well enough to
> minimize the spillage if the bike goes down?
...
>>
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1425.jpg
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1424.jpg
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1426.jpg
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1427.jpg
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1428.jpg
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1429.jpg
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1430.jpg
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1431.jpg
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1432.jpg
>>http://www.metricmind.com/misc/dscn1433.jpg
>>
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The golf cart let out the smoke today.
I have a 1995 Club Car with a Curtis 400A control.
It was hissing and spitting when the kids were driving
for about an hour. I let is sit for an hour and
decided to try and drive it back to the garage. I
went about 30 feet and it shorted full on!!!!
Hit the key switch and the main contactor dropped out
and the joy ride was over.
So, more repairs (does it ever end?)
I can only imagine John W's thrill when a high powered
Datsun doing 100MPH shorts! I was on a golf cart and
the adrenilin was pumping, I don't want to to even be
in John's position. Make your backup safety systems
work, or you will be a splattered EV'r!!!
Rod
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Obviously my PFC-20 has that wonderful 110 or 220
input. And I'm driving a 12V brushless DC motor to
vent H2 gas but connecting it to a 110 in, 12V out
"wall wart" (adapter).
To make this happen, right now I have to tie one
line of the adapter to hot, and the other to gnd. If
I tie it to neutral, then it gets 220V RMS when I
charge via 220V input, right? Or am I missing
something?
The goal is to get the fan to come on whether or
not I'm charging 110 or 220 input.
I'd like to be able to have a space heater in the
car to supplement the existing heater unit. (I'd be
able to plug it in and have it on before I hop in the
car). But by tying it to ground, and not neutral, I'm
a bit on the nervous side...
Thanks,
=====
'92 Honda Civic sedan, 144V
____
__/__|__\ __
=D-------/ - - \
'O'-----'O'-'
Would you still drive your car if the tailpipe came out of the steering wheel? Are you
saving any gas for your kids?
_______________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today!
http://vote.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Internal or external wiring?
Joe Smalley
Rural Kitsap County WA
Fiesta 48 volts
NEDRA 48 volt street conversion record holder
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steven Tweed" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, October 08, 2004 9:01 AM
Subject: Todd PC30
> Does anyone have a wiring diagram or manual for a Todd PC30 DC/DC
converter?
>
> Thanks
> Steve
>
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Was this made by anyone on the list? It as way cool!
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7106390636
(Too bad I don't live in SoCal or I'd bid)
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I have a # of really powerful small series wound motors that would be very
useful except for the splined output shaft. In the past we have had good
luck grinding the splines off and turning to a nominal .500 for use on a 3
wheel bike and a gokart, but I am looking for a beefier stronger solution
without breaking the bank. BTW, have tried and tried to find a spline
pattern that fits and I have had no luck finding one off the shelf, I am
beginning to think this is not a spline but a gear cut. Anyway, what about
disassembling the motor and welding up the splines and recutting them? I
could weld with the arm immersed in water and then do some crude re-heat
treating in-shop. The other idea I have toyed with is having the end of the
arm metal sprayed (havn't checked the cost of this lately, could be
prohibitive) to build up the shaft and then recut on my lathe. Either way,
this would net us a slightly over .625 shaft to give a little more
material/support for the keyway. Or option #4, am I just being over
cautious. These develop 4 hp, int duty and for what I have in mind they
might do a bit more. Comments or input? David Chapman.
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you could build the surface up with hard weld then grind back to whatever size you want
metal spray is a bit of fuss and not as good as weld
you can get hard facing rods for a normal arc welder very cheap
if the motors only make 5hp max the cheapest thing would be to grind the shaft down to
a smaller size and cross pin the drive sprocket or pulley on
David Chapman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
I have a # of really powerful small series wound motors that would be very
useful except for the splined output shaft. In the past we have had good
luck grinding the splines off and turning to a nominal .500 for use on a 3
wheel bike and a gokart, but I am looking for a beefier stronger solution
without breaking the bank. BTW, have tried and tried to find a spline
pattern that fits and I have had no luck finding one off the shelf, I am
beginning to think this is not a spline but a gear cut. Anyway, what about
disassembling the motor and welding up the splines and recutting them? I
could weld with the arm immersed in water and then do some crude re-heat
treating in-shop. The other idea I have toyed with is having the end of the
arm metal sprayed (havn't checked the cost of this lately, could be
prohibitive) to build up the shaft and then recut on my lathe. Either way,
this would net us a slightly over .625 shaft to give a little more
material/support for the keyway. Or option #4, am I just being over
cautious. These develop 4 hp, int duty and for what I have in mind they
might do a bit more. Comments or input? David Chapman.
---------------------------------
ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger - all new features - even more fun!
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i hope this never hapens to my EV bike on the road
i'm going in the garage to check my main switch works !
Rod Hower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
The golf cart let out the smoke today.
I have a 1995 Club Car with a Curtis 400A control.
It was hissing and spitting when the kids were driving
for about an hour. I let is sit for an hour and
decided to try and drive it back to the garage. I
went about 30 feet and it shorted full on!!!!
Hit the key switch and the main contactor dropped out
and the joy ride was over.
So, more repairs (does it ever end?)
I can only imagine John W's thrill when a high powered
Datsun doing 100MPH shorts! I was on a golf cart and
the adrenilin was pumping, I don't want to to even be
in John's position. Make your backup safety systems
work, or you will be a splattered EV'r!!!
Rod
---------------------------------
ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger - all new features - even more fun!
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--- Begin Message ---
Yeah I'd probably go down to a smaller size and then weld the sprocket
on.. OK, that's probably bad but it works :)
On Sat, 9 Oct 2004 08:31:00 +0100 (BST), richard ball
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> you could build the surface up with hard weld then grind back to whatever size you
> want
> metal spray is a bit of fuss and not as good as weld
> you can get hard facing rods for a normal arc welder very cheap
> if the motors only make 5hp max the cheapest thing would be to grind the shaft down
> to a smaller size and cross pin the drive sprocket or pulley on
>
>
>
> David Chapman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I have a # of really powerful small series wound motors that would be very
> useful except for the splined output shaft. In the past we have had good
> luck grinding the splines off and turning to a nominal .500 for use on a 3
> wheel bike and a gokart, but I am looking for a beefier stronger solution
> without breaking the bank. BTW, have tried and tried to find a spline
> pattern that fits and I have had no luck finding one off the shelf, I am
> beginning to think this is not a spline but a gear cut. Anyway, what about
> disassembling the motor and welding up the splines and recutting them? I
> could weld with the arm immersed in water and then do some crude re-heat
> treating in-shop. The other idea I have toyed with is having the end of the
> arm metal sprayed (havn't checked the cost of this lately, could be
> prohibitive) to build up the shaft and then recut on my lathe. Either way,
> this would net us a slightly over .625 shaft to give a little more
> material/support for the keyway. Or option #4, am I just being over
> cautious. These develop 4 hp, int duty and for what I have in mind they
> might do a bit more. Comments or input? David Chapman.
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger - all new features - even more fun!
>
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Involute splines look like gear teeth. It is a bit of a pain
identifying them, but they are easily cut. If you can give # of
splines, OD and ID, then someone can probably look it up (maybe even
me). F ailing that, cutting the splines off and using shaft retaining
compound to bond on a sleeve or the gear directly should work. It puts
less stress into a shaft than a pin drive. And it works. And if you
forget to clean the surfaces before you bond, it comes apart
non-destructively. I have used it in drivetrains before using just
loctite 620 and a smooth shaft and bore and it works well. About 500
Solectria Force pinion gears are retained this way.
Seth
On Oct 9, 2004, at 2:26 AM, David Chapman wrote:
I have a # of really powerful small series wound motors that would be
very
useful except for the splined output shaft. In the past we have had
good
luck grinding the splines off and turning to a nominal .500 for use on
a 3
wheel bike and a gokart, but I am looking for a beefier stronger
solution
without breaking the bank. BTW, have tried and tried to find a spline
pattern that fits and I have had no luck finding one off the shelf, I
am
beginning to think this is not a spline but a gear cut. Anyway, what
about
disassembling the motor and welding up the splines and recutting them?
I
could weld with the arm immersed in water and then do some crude
re-heat
treating in-shop. The other idea I have toyed with is having the end
of the
arm metal sprayed (havn't checked the cost of this lately, could be
prohibitive) to build up the shaft and then recut on my lathe. Either
way,
this would net us a slightly over .625 shaft to give a little more
material/support for the keyway. Or option #4, am I just being over
cautious. These develop 4 hp, int duty and for what I have in mind they
might do a bit more. Comments or input? David Chapman.
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On a 4 wire system, 240-120 VAC, Line 1, Line 2, Neutral and ground, the
ground has the same reference as the neutral.
In a service entrance to a building, it is normally a 3 wire service from
the transformer, with a grounded neutral at the transformer.
At the first service panel, the neutral is again grounded to earth by a
ground rod and a ground conductor is developed from this point.
The reason for this type of connection, is when you have 120 volt circuit,
the neutral which is a now a current conductor, does not have a continous
current flow over a chassic or equipment, which was cause by grounding the
neutral at the load device.
You can tap a three wire circuit, a line one conductor and a neutral
conductor for 120 volts from a 240 volts Line one, Line 2, and neutral.
This is what is being done at a service panel which has 240/120 volt lines.
You have 240 volt and 120 circuit breakers off the main lugs.
The only problem with 120 volt tap off at the load, such as running a 240
contactor with a 120 volt coil using one tap off the feed connection to the
contactor, and that feed voltage on that line to the contactor is loss, but
still is connected to a load, you will get a feed back through the 240 load
from Line 2 to Line 1 which will still run the coil.
This is why we used coils at the same voltage of the line, or used a small
240/120 volt transformer tapping of the line.
Of course this could happen with you house, You can lose the neutral
connection back at the transformer, and some 240 volt device you are running
is developing 120 volts that may be running a 120 volt circuit.
In my EV, I have a 4 wire plug in connector, which is rated at 50 amps
240/120 VAC, that connects to chassic type mount circuit breaker panel, that
has both 240 and 120 volt circuit breakers like you would have in a house.
So there is no problem in multiple voltages off a service entrance.
Roland
EV Systems
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Bath" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, October 08, 2004 10:21 PM
Subject: 220/110 input/running AC adapt. to brushless fan issue
> Obviously my PFC-20 has that wonderful 110 or 220
> input. And I'm driving a 12V brushless DC motor to
> vent H2 gas but connecting it to a 110 in, 12V out
> "wall wart" (adapter).
> To make this happen, right now I have to tie one
> line of the adapter to hot, and the other to gnd. If
> I tie it to neutral, then it gets 220V RMS when I
> charge via 220V input, right? Or am I missing
> something?
> The goal is to get the fan to come on whether or
> not I'm charging 110 or 220 input.
> I'd like to be able to have a space heater in the
> car to supplement the existing heater unit. (I'd be
> able to plug it in and have it on before I hop in the
> car). But by tying it to ground, and not neutral, I'm
> a bit on the nervous side...
> Thanks,
>
> =====
> '92 Honda Civic sedan, 144V
> ____
> __/__|__\ __
> =D-------/ - - \
> 'O'-----'O'-'
> Would you still drive your car if the tailpipe came out of the steering
> wheel? Are you saving any gas for your kids?
>
>
>
> _______________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today!
> http://vote.yahoo.com
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Internal wiring, my unit has a short somewhere in the high side power input
area. Before I tore into in I was looking for a diagram or manual, since it
didn't come with one and I can't locate one for download anywhere.
Thanks
-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Smalley
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 10/8/2004 9:23 PM
Subject: Re: Todd PC30
Internal or external wiring?
Joe Smalley
Rural Kitsap County WA
Fiesta 48 volts
NEDRA 48 volt street conversion record holder
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steven Tweed" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, October 08, 2004 9:01 AM
Subject: Todd PC30
> Does anyone have a wiring diagram or manual for a Todd PC30 DC/DC
converter?
>
> Thanks
> Steve
>
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I have a manual, but it's at school, I can get it monday. What is your
question? there are only 4 connections: HV (something like 60V - 140V)
in, 12V out.. that jumper thing selects something like 13.2V (off) and
13.8V (on).. Thats all I can remember off the top of my head.
-Jon Glauser
http://jon.silvercheetah.net/bsuev/
Does anyone have a wiring diagram or manual for a Todd PC30 DC/DC converter?
Thanks
Steve
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From another list.
Those of us using NiMH rechargables should check out
www.batteryspace.com. They have some nice looking discounts on larger
quantities. A 24-pack of 2250mAh NiMH AA's for $30 with free shipping is
one, A bundle of a 2/4 cell smart charger and 12 2250mAh AA's for $25 is
another.
--
John G. Lussmyer mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Dragons soar and Tigers prowl while I dream.... http://www.CasaDelGato.com
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