EV Digest 4701
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: electric motorcycle performance
by David Dymaxion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: What charger to use?
by "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: Tardy but not TOO LATE - a REPEAT
by "Roderick Wilde" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: associated1 on Ebay / IOTA Power supplies
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: Make an Aluminium Flywheel
by David Dymaxion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: Solectria Charger Question
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: 300 MPH Quarter EV Technology
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: associated1 on Ebay / IOTA Power supplies
by <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) DMV purgatory
by "Mark Hanson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) RE: alternator regen -- Re: Shunt motor regen setup
by "Bill Dennis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: Kilovac score on Ebay (and sniping)
by Danny Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) FS: 9 Evercel M100s plus chargers
by Derrick Brashear <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: What charger to use?
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Vas: Re: Vas: Re: Steves Mower, was, 2000 mile range EV?
by Seppo Lindborg <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Help a newbie with EV purchase
by Andrew Sackville-West <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: Make an Aluminium Flywheel
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: 9" motor mount for 1980 Rabbit.
by Electro Automotive <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: 9" motor mount for 1980 Rabbit.
by Electro Automotive <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: 9" motor mount for 1980 Rabbit.
by Electro Automotive <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) RE: Altrax 7245, palm OS porting
by "Paschke, Stephen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: What charger to use?
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: Solectria Charger Question
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: Help a newbie with EV purchase
by Andrew Sackville-West <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: Solectria Charger Question
by "EVdave" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: Altrax 7245, palm OS porting
by "Philippe Borges" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
Land speed racing allows fully faired motorcycles.
--- mreish <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> ...
> Another big problem there is that every race organization that I
> know
> off doesn't allow body work to wrap around or interfere with the
> rider. So there's often a void 'tween the rider and rear
> cowl/fairing.
> ...
__________________________________
Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Roden" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Saturday, September 10, 2005 11:49 PM
Subject: Re: What charger to use?
> On 10 Sep 2005 at 18:10, Rich Rudman wrote:
>
> > A series charger that has a transformer or a
> > voltage regulated source... How do I say this... Can't hold a regulated
> > power or current level. Have substantialy less available power at the
higher
> > voltages. Say you are doing 120 volts, and you have a rectifier, Or any
voltage
> > and a transformer step up/down. At low battery voltages compared to the
peak of
> > the charger, you will have a rally large current flow, and some chargers
will
> > fail trying to make the big amps.
>
> I must be misunderstanding this. It sounds like you are suggesting that a
> transformer isolated charger can't act as a constant voltage, constant
> power, or constant current device.
>
Well nice post...
I think... Clearly your Brusa has a LOT more than a transformer and
a rectifier... It clearly can Buck from 240.
But a 132 volt transformer based...LIKE a ZIVAN.... can't do 156 volt work
and has a low voltage cutout that keeps it from doing less than about 96
volts.
So without getting into a technical Slam bang... David you know darn well
what I was talking about. Why bring it up?
Rich Rudman
Manzanita Micro
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Steve, a minor criticism. You state: "race electric powered Lazy-Boy
Recliners during half time out at Pacific International Race Way, come
September 24th, 05." You do not state the time of the event, the cost if you
are not racing and a link to the tracks website for those who have never
been there. Kind of part of the who, what, when, why, and where.
Roderick Wilde
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steven Lough" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List RCVR" <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, September 12, 2005 8:22 AM
Subject: Tardy but not TOO LATE - a REPEAT
Several folks have chimed in now... ( Thank you.even the critical ones )
But they keep saying I have not given all the details... I read the
original 9/9 post again for the Third Time, and it seems it is all
there. So here it is again....
Copy of the 9/9 Post.....
I’ve been sitting on this story to post for over a month. My apologies…
The World is defiantly accelerating with events. From Friday Night
Drags, NEDRA at Woodburn, And YES Katrina….. It seems like a bunch
of ABSOLUTE GAS HEADS who are into vintage and CanAm style road racing,
which is getting me all amped about a new class of EV Racing… was
ludicrous ! I mean…, After all, there already been shopping kart EV
racing, EV Bar Stool Racing…. Now there is LAZY-BOY Recliner EV CHAIR
RACING!!
So let me share A little Recent History on how it is Recliner Racing
came into play. About 2 months ago, a man by the name of
Chuck LaFord called me and asked if our club (SEVA-Seattle EV
Association) members would be interested in joining some of HIS buddies
to race electric powered Lazy-Boy Recliners during half time out at
Pacific International Race Way, come September 24th, 05. At first I
didn’t know what to say, but as our discussion went on it was apparent
that most of these folks had the $$ Capitol, the means and time to build
some powerful chairs and have a blast from green to finish. But what
really interested me is the PR angle. Here are some names that he
dropped as possible guest drivers of Chairs our Club would come up with….
Chip Hanauer, world class Unlimited Hydroplane driver …retired.
Craig Breedlove, world Bonneville Speed Record holder… and others
Yes…. My contact actually is personal friends with almost any one and
everyone in road racing.
(also if you care to Google his NAME, you will see he is world class in
Pond Racing of Airplanes… Not an inexpensive hobby…. By any means….
SO..How could I say NO…. (almost) Any publicity is GOOD Publicity….
RIGHT ?
Now so far… Only a few folks in the immediate North West know about
this. (That is MY fault… ) for coming up with hard and fast RULES about
the vehicles has been the “Bain of my Existence” i.e. No one in their
elite race community wants to Bite the Bullet, and give us a hard and
fast rule book, ala NEDRA, or NHRA, or SCCofAmerica. So the only
parameters I have are as follows:
No wider than 48” No longer than 8 feet. No more batteries than
200 lbs. Some Kind of seat that looks kind-of like a Lazy-Boy Recliner.
( But even that “Rule” has been stretched. One GUY who is using an
Ejection Seat from a Navy Jet !!
- and the Rule-Guys said “ …That sounds just FINE” So what am I
to do….
There are Rules, but then again there ARE NO RULES…. The only thing
they have STRESSED over and over again is SAFETY, Handling, Breaking,
Steering, and SAFETY !! ( Oh.. Yah… some idiot said something about
seat belts….) And many have said…” Hay Motorcycles DON’T have seat
belts !!” And I have to agree…. I think the 5-Point NASCAR Harness
that some are using is more of a joke than a safety item…
I suppose, if you have belts, one would not have to USE them in a short
15 minute race round a Go-Kart type course.. OH PS: There IS a
$1,000. prize Purse !!! Yup ! Plus free admission into Pacific
International Race Way, that day for the Vintage Auto Road Racing… Could
be interesting ???.
I have posted a few pictures of what this chair thing might look
like. One is of me in a Lazy Boy, with NO CHASSIS.
http:/home.comcast.net/~stevenslough/LazyBoyRacer.jpg
The second is a Really superb dual motor, independent rear drive
chassis that Dave Cloud has built.
http:/home.comcast.net/~stevenslough/DavesEChairTWO.JPG
Also there is another dual motor tricycle being built by Don “Father
Time” Crabtree which will be of equal or exceeding quality and SPEED.
AND there are others ….
For those of you in the North West who recognize the name Chip Hanaure….
He was very excited to drive one of our E-Chairs from the very
beginning… He drove Road Racing Cars for Pt. Townsand High School down
in Arizona many years ago… But just days ago, I got an e-mail from him
that stated that
commitments of a humanitarian nature in Louisiana and the Hurricane
Katrina tragedy., will take him away from Washington State for the next
month. Our thoughts and prayers go with him….
--
Steven S. Lough, Pres.
Seattle EV Association
6021 32nd Ave. N.E.
Seattle, WA 98115-7230
Day: 206 850-8535
Eve: 206 524-1351
e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
web: http://www.seattleeva.org
--
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.10.21/96 - Release Date: 9/10/2005
--
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.10.22/97 - Release Date: 9/12/2005
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
My one concern is the seller I used didn't offer insurance. Is the shipper
responsible for damaged goods? LR>.............
----- Original Message -----
From: "Eric Poulsen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, September 12, 2005 7:40 AM
Subject: associated1 on Ebay / IOTA Power supplies
All,
I know some people have been thinking about buying one of the IOTA DLS
series power supplies on Ebay for use as a DC-DC. I recently did so. The
transaction actually was pretty smooth and fast, but the person behind the
email address "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" is (quite frankly) a major jerk.
I won't go into the gory details; email me off-list and I'll send you the
email conversation, and you can decide for yourself.
I'd recommend buying from another seller if you're interested in this
item.
-- Eric
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
If you made your own flywheel I would be sure to encase it with a
scattershield. Land speed rules are that it has to be 1/4 inch steel.
Also, if you race, you'll likely need to have either the stock
flywheel or an SFI rated one. Getting a custom built flywheel rated
would probably be difficult.
--- Don Cameron <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Has anyone made an aluminium flywheel for their car? I figure I
> can lathe &
> mill 6061 T6 or 2024 T3 to the appropriate shape and then install
> a surface
> ring of 1060 high strength carbon steel for a clutch face. The
> face would
> be held on with high shear load aircraft bolts. Not sure what
> fastener
> adhesive I would use on the bolts.
______________________________________________________
Yahoo! for Good
Donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.
http://store.yahoo.com/redcross-donate3/
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
If you're talking about BRUSA NLG4 relabeled by
Solectria to BC330 (make sure that's the case),
it will take 110 or 220 or anything
in between. At 110V its output power will be reduced,
but no harm to the charger which looks after itself.
Rex Allison wrote:
I have a question about the Solectria Charger BC3300.
The marking on the Solectria Force says 220VAC only
but the charging cable has an adapter for 110VAC. My
question is if it is a universal input, does it hurt
(shorten the life of) the charger or the batteries to
use 110VAC for charging all the time or is it just
slower. It is easier for me to access 110VAC outside
than it is to find 220VAC.
Thank you,
Rex Allison
--
Victor
'91 ACRX - something different
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Myles Twete wrote:
...
2)5% more efficient than the AC motor systems
That statement alone raises flaf that this is marketing type of claims.
Try to make a homopolar mothor 5% more efficient than
already 96-97% efficient AC motor (not *that* rare these days).
'course if they compare to 60% efficient alternators,
the claim may be true, but this is what's called clever marketing...
-Myles Twete, Portland
--
Victor
'91 ACRX - something different
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I guess my question on these, even though they look impressive is if anyone has
tested or looked at the circuitry to see if the input directly from 144,156v
etc DC will run the switch mode supply adequately?
I am pretty familiar with switchmode supplies, (to the extent I may be willing
to design my own battery charger at this point...)particularly in regard to
pcs. Usually off the bridge rectifier you have a filter cap boosting the DC up
to a couple of hundred volts or so before it goes to the input. This of course
is working because the cap is boosting the output of the rectifier towards the
peaks of the rectified sine wave.
Bypassing the AC rectifier ciruit would place a constant dc (of course dropping
as the battery pack decreases), so this will need to be adequate to keep the
supply running. In a higher voltage pack this would probably pose no problem.
Most may run off as little as 90vac input and still deliver adequate power, but
again, this is not the 'average" input to the switching transistor.
So, that said has anyone taken one of these apart, run it with a variable power
supply and measured the outputs?
I would certainly buy one instead of a pricey DC-DC if it would work.
Just my 3 cents worth.
Mark Ward
St. Charles, MO
95 Saab 900SE "Saabrina"
www.saabrina.blogspot.com
>
> From: Eric Poulsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Date: 2005/09/12 Mon AM 09:40:03 EST
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: associated1 on Ebay / IOTA Power supplies
>
> All,
>
> I know some people have been thinking about buying one of the IOTA DLS
> series power supplies on Ebay for use as a DC-DC. I recently did so.
> The transaction actually was pretty smooth and fast, but the person
> behind the email address "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" is (quite frankly) a
> major jerk. I won't go into the gory details; email me off-list and
> I'll send you the email conversation, and you can decide for yourself.
>
> I'd recommend buying from another seller if you're interested in this item.
>
> -- Eric
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi,
I did my daily lunchtime DMV trip today and got my "ELEC CAR" tags transfered
from my E-jeep which I sold on Ebay to the Bombardier in my quest for a 250Wh
per mile vehicle. The registration has body type as "low speed" which from
what I can tell they don't have on their radar screen in Virginia, she thought
that meant non-highway use below 45. (The federal 97' restriction is 25mph for
nev) So it has normal tags but when I get pulled over which happens
periodically, the low speed thing seams subject to interpretation. The guys at
the inspection station know my EV's over the years so hopefully they shouldn't
be too weirded out.
If you've ever had a Bombardier product, Sea-Doo etc., you may notice that they
mass produce the prototype with fundemental "industrial strength stupid"
woopses. This was typical (like a Sea-Doo jet-boat I had that the block
cracked etc.). They sealed the batteries (which look like short lived
automotive 12V) inside the fiberglass tunnel and under the seats with 72V
charger & aux tractor batt. I had to remove the bottom belly pan to get the
batteries to drop down (crash) from underneath. So the vehicle was driven 577
miles back in 99' by Georgia Power & Light and then parked when it pooped out.
The Saft-Nife charger is set to a fixed 86V (should be 93V finish if I goto
floodies) with NO indication of when it starts or finishes running and the
batteries were way out of balance 2V diff from min to max. The muffin fan is
wired across the AC line so it runs all the time. The DC converter (get this)
is 3amps. No that's not a typo, three amps. Needless to say the aux bat!
tery is flat as a flounder. Anyway, I'll probably have to cut out access to
install the batteries, probably 9ea 8V floodies or if I can find 12V with
decent range (present is 20 miles, need 30). I'll probably remount my
ferro-resonant charger with uP control as Saft & Bombardier say they do not
support this vehicle or it's components. The rear brakes were *not* installed
on the US models (just regen), only the Euro models because they were required
to stop in Europe I suppose. I'll need to figure out how to reinforce the body
as there is no chassis just a fiberglass *bathtub* like construction with the
wheels & motor pop-rivited to the fiberglass. Probably have to brace with
aluminum angle underneath for reinforcement. Has anyone fixed up a Bombardier
to make it operational? It looks like if I cut the tunnel open the vehicle
will fall in half. Then I guess I'd have two motorcycles :-)
Have a renewable energy day, Mark
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Lee Hart wrote:
>> Doesn't the alternator just produce AC, and there is a regulator that
>> changes it to DC?
> Correct. It's a "rectifier" that converts AC into DC. There are six diodes
> inside the alternator to do this.
So is an ICE car's SLI battery being charged with a rectified sine wave
rather than filtered, regulated DC?
A related question: what would an ADC electric motor do if you fed it just
a rectified sine wave instead of PWM?
Thanks.
Bill Dennis
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Sniping yourself is hardly difficult. http://www.esnipe.com/ costs 1%,
min $0.25, IF you win. If you don't win, eSnipe doesn't charge
anything. I use it all the time and it's great. Very reliable, more so
than installing auto-bidding software on your machine.
Sniping is just turning eBay's proxy bidding system into "silent bid by
proxy". Remember what silent auctions mean? Nobody can see anyone
else's bids, the highest bid wins and the bid is paid at face value.
Sniped eBay auctions are just like that except you only have to pay
enough to beat out the second highest bidder instead of your top bid.
I'm curious why eBay doesn't do the bid extension system. They're
hardly unaware of it, it's by choice. Perhaps someone has a well
defended patent out on it. Or they may not want to deal with auctions
with potentially endless end times. People would still use the sniping
software to bid-up by the minimum amount at the end of every minute and
it could potentially go on for hours or days. They are sure to have
done serious evaluations of the psychological impact and simply not
knowing when the auction ends for real might have been worse than sniping.
Danny
Mike Barber wrote:
His point is still valid, though. If you put your maximum bid in as $100,
and someone else bids $101, then both parties should be satisfied. If you
really would have paid $110, then your original bid should have been $110,
not $100. Auctions are geared toward hype - influencing the perceived value
of something by bidding activity. When you bid on something, you're giving
it value by asserting that you think it has worth. This can affect how
others value it, and then the price goes higher than if you hadn't bid on
it. Sniping is a solution to this problem.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I have 9 Evercel M100s which I was going to install into my car, but
have
not, and probably would not in the near future. I also have 5 spare
cells
in the event you develop a bad cell. I'd like to get $1750 for the lot,
but I am willing to entertain offers. The only catch is if you want it
shipped I'm going to have to solicit ideas from the list for shipping
them. These are just over 50 pounds per battery, 12v, 84ah.
They include the Evercel-provided single battery chargers.
Also, I have 10 Rudman MK2b regulators which if the buyer wishes to pick
them up, I will part with for $42.50 each. These are new, fully
assembled and never installed.
If you have questions, please let me know
Derrick
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Michaela,
If you prefer isolated OEM grade charger, BRUSA NLG5 is one
of the fine choices. It is expensive charger because can be set
up to do anything (set up to plug and forget) and it can be done
for yor you before charger is shipped to you, so you don't have
to do it. I can do that, I only need to know what type of
battery you're using.
PROs:
-isolated
-programmable and never "forgets" the program
-works from 110V (reduced power) or 220V (240V).
-has mains limiter which can be set to limit power
drawn from the outlet, this can be used to prevent
tripping circuit breaker when charged from 110VAC.
CONs:
-cost more per kW output than most chargers out there
-requires a computer to change its settings
It will take care of your pack in "plug-and-play" fashion,
but like any other charger, will NOT know anything about
individual batteries. This is not a bid issue for lead
acid bateries, especially flooded ones. If you can charge
overnight (e.g. gently) and use equalizing overchange,
you will be fine.
As for any other charger I know of, there is no flip
switch "car 1" / "car 2". IT will have to be reprogrammed
every time you want to charge different pack, since meant
to be on-board charger permanently wired in the car.
Note: this is very high quality top of the line charger
and if you don't care about its flexibility and features,
it may not be a right choice for you - you will be paying
for some features you won't take advantage of.
See http://www.metricmind.com/charger.htm
NLG4 (predecessor of NLG5) chargers are used in OEM EVs
Solectria Force (US). NLG5 is improved version of NLG4.
Victor
Michaela Merz wrote:
Rich:
I don't want to in any way question the capabilities of your charger. I am
sure it is a great system. But I think I would like to see a charger that
doesn't need tuning, maybe senses the necessary data itself. That maybe
has two voltage presets and can be used even in the dark (and after a few
beers). Your product seems to be perfect for the ev tinkerer and I think I
would be able to 'handle' it, but I don't want to train my spouse or my
kid on how to charge the car.
And while it most certainly makes sense to not use transformers, I
wouldn't mind some losses in order to have an insulated system. And why do
I need a timer to shut the charger off? Isn't there a way to sense the
cutoff voltage and turn off by itself (maybe after some time to allow for
equalization)?
mm.
HunnH?
Just plug it in and tune the voltage. That simple.
The complete saftey check out is only needed when you think you hurt it.
It's a non isolated charger... no transformer. Less losses and a MUCH
wider
voltage range.
The timer is so it shuts off.
The Zivan is a single voltage product. Get one for each voltage you need.
PFC chargers can be used on all voltage EVs from 12 volts to 450. So yes
you have to adjust them for each appliaction.
ONE if you can't deal with a voltage meter on your EV and read the voltage
as you are tuning the charger...maybe you need to stick to plug and play
chargers.
Two....a jewlers screw driver and a DVM and about 30 seconds of time... is
cheap compared to 2 complete chargers.
And I am going to have Joe NUKE The instructions that take you all through
the "Precharge" nightmare, it's totally over kill safety.
You will find that Zivan Plug and play chargers work just that way. Life
is
good until the battery string dies early and you have no clue why.
All packs need some adjustments for age and weather changes. Assuming all
the varibles are engineered out is rather foolish.
Also the reason you are looking for a new charger is one primary reason I
am
in business. Zivans fail often and have a rather limited feature set.
Rich Rudman
Manzanita Micro
----- Original Message -----
From: "Michaela Merz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Saturday, September 10, 2005 4:49 PM
Subject: Re: What charger to use?
Hello Rich and others:
Thanks for all the information. I still have some questions in regard to
your charger and my old Zivan:
I read your installation instructions and quite frankly, they sound a
little complicated. All that tuning and checking .. I understand that
this
is not a bug but a feature. But - I would have to get an amp-meter,
solder
some 110 V lights, rewire the DC port so that is has a chassis ground.
And
- why is it not insulated? Why do I need a timer?
My Zivan charger worked like that: Plug in and forget. Once the
batteries
are charged, it turns off. Nothing to tweak, nothing to tune.
After tuning for car#1 and car#2, how would I be able to 'mark' the
position of the pots so that I wouldn't have to go through all the
tuning
again for car #1. Count the revolutions of the pot? Kind of 2
revolutions
to the left and 1/2 revolution to the right?
Confused ...
mm.
I can have a charger in your hands in 5 days, or less.
Get me the funds And I will turn a PFC30 in about 12 hours.
Getting the funds here takes longer than making one.
I can do a 20 or 20B or 30 in less than a day, The 50s are waiting for
new
sheet metal, That gets here Monday.
All my PFC series chargers can run off of 110 to 240 AC. simple Mods
let
them run off of DC also.
A PFC50B(your appliaction is less than 150 volts ..so I HIGHLY
recomend
the
Buck option).
This charger can deliver 75 amps of charge current at these voltage
levels.
Not quite fire and forget. Tune it once, do it right then Forget it.
check
your results about every 4 months.
The big feature is that you CAN adjust my chargers....From 12 to 450
volts
output. The power levels adjust from Zero to full advertised line
current.
Rich Rudman
Manzanita Micro
----- Original Message -----
From: "Michaela Merz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, September 09, 2005 10:25 PM
Subject: Re: What charger to use?
Hey John and others:
At 07:09 PM 9/9/2005, Michaela Merz wrote:
Question about a charger: I have two EVs, one with a 120 V system,
the
other with 132 V. I am looking for a charger that would be able to
provide
both voltages, run off 110 and 220 Volts and provide fully
automatic
charging ('fire and forget').
What system would the list suggest and where to get it?
http://www.manzanitamicro.com
Thank you. From what I understand, the PFC-50 would be able to be run
off a 110 V 'normal' outlet with its throttle (kind of a worst case
scenario) adjusted ?
Anybody here able (willing?) to sell me a charger asap (my Zivan just
died
I need my car back :)
mm.
--
Victor
'91 ACRX - something different
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
>
> Lähettäjä: Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Päivä: 09.09.2005 01:23
> Vastaanottaja: [email protected]
> Otsikko: Re: Vas: Re: Steves Mower, was, 2000 mile range EV?
>
>
> >
my father had made a temporary fix by taking the motor out and installing a big
3-phase electric motor instead. It was connected with a thick cord to the
electricity distribution cabinet beside the working area...
>
> We have some big open-pit taconite mines in northern Minnesota. The
> gigantic earth-moving shovels they use are electric, and run on long
> "extension cords". The shovel might take all day to move 100 feet, so
> the cord is an acceptable option. PS: The cord is bigger than your arm!
Maybe father had heard or knew about them and got his caterpillar conversion
idea on that information. This was not too recently, it happened some time in
the sixties.
Seppo
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Greetings all,
First, this is a great list and I'm really glad to have been lurking for
a bit. I've learned a lot already.
So here's what I've found: 1980 VW Rabbit conversion that looks to have
been fairly professionally done. Its got a Curtis 1221B-7401 controller,
Prestolite 20hp 96volt motor (numbers are long since unreadable, though
I didn't crawl underneath the beast to see if there were any etched into
it), Kepro RMD 12-B-48 DC-DC converter (no battery support there),
vacuum pump but is missing the vacuum storage chamber(?) (I know these
can be easily fabricated, so no big deal), has space for an onboard
charger and is wired for this, but is gone, has a nice little dashboard
panel with guages and controls (includes a cryptic switch that allows
monitoring of each battery separately), has some pretty beefy battery
boxes complete with little ventilation fans, power tap in the cabin for
a ceramic heater or hair dryer or whatever. Has a modified hairdryer
attached to the motor for keeping it cool etc etc etc. The suspension
looks good, current owner claims its been beefed up for electric use and
I believe it as the springs look fairly new and the thing is riding
really high right now (no batteries). Its been sitting undriven for 6
years with no batteries. Finally, it comes with a massive heavy charger
(lester 96volt) that runs both 110 and 220. Owner claims to have
documentation, wiring diagrams etc. Thing is ugly as sin ;)
Okay, as I'm a total n00b, what do I need to watch out for? Owner claims
60 mile range and top speed near 65. Is this reasonable? Any obvious
flaws in this set-up that you can see? Is this really too good to be
true? Also, supposedly, its easily converted to regen, though it hasn't
been done: shunt wound motor?
thanks in advance for any advice.
Andrew
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Don,
If you use "pempered" (hard) aluminum, consider design when
you machine a flywheel and motor shaft coupler as one piece.
Possibility depends on the coupler type of course.
Victor
Don Cameron wrote:
You are assuming that I am looking for "cheap" way to do it. Not correct.
I want to **make** a flywheel. I have a machine shop at my disposal and I
want to use it. If you have information about this I would appreciate the
help.
Don
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 03:28 PM 9/10/05 -0700, you wrote:
Has anyone mounted a 9" ADC in a Rabbit? Electro Automotive says they
don't offer a motor mount solution for the Big motor. 8" yes. 9"
no. Any solution? If not I'm making my own.
Lawrence Rhodes
Bassoon/Contrabassoon
Reedmaker
Book 4/5 doubler
Electric Vehicle & Solar Power Advocate
415-821-3519
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
We do now. We just haven't had time to put it on the web site yet.
Shari Prange
Electro Automotive POB 1113 Felton CA 95018-1113 Telephone 831-429-1989
http://www.electroauto.com [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Electric Car Conversion Kits * Components * Books * Videos * Since 1979
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 05:54 PM 9/10/05 -0700, you wrote:
VoltsRabbit #2 had a 9" motor, but it was an '81, not
'80.
ElectroAuto bolted what appeared to be a circular
piece of metal with a tab on it, then welded the tab
to the frame of the vehicle. It was a nice setup, and
never gave a problem during the 4 years I owned the
car. It was obviously a tight fit. Perhaps that was
the issue with continuing in that direction.
This one was custom built on the car. Since there are small variations
from one car to another, we could not send this out blind to fit ANY
Rabbit. It took rather more engineering to come up with one that allowed
some adjustability for variations in chassis. Yes, it is a tight fit.
Shari Prange
Electro Automotive POB 1113 Felton CA 95018-1113 Telephone 831-429-1989
http://www.electroauto.com [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Electric Car Conversion Kits * Components * Books * Videos * Since 1979
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 09:48 PM 9/10/05 -0700, you wrote:
On Sep 10, 2005, at 3:28 PM, Lawrence Rhodes wrote:
Has anyone mounted a 9" ADC in a Rabbit? Electro Automotive says they
don't offer a motor mount solution for the Big motor. 8" yes. 9"
no. Any solution? If not I'm making my own.
I put a Prestolite in a Rabbit and didn't bother with a motor mount.
That's a whole lot lighter than a 9".
Shari Prange
Electro Automotive POB 1113 Felton CA 95018-1113 Telephone 831-429-1989
http://www.electroauto.com [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Electric Car Conversion Kits * Components * Books * Videos * Since 1979
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I am trying to work on that. But all I have is some captured data. If you
have a comm spec I would appreciate a copy of it.
> Stephen Paschke
> Senior Consultant
> Keane, Inc.
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Robert Chew
Sent: Sunday, September 11, 2005 12:23 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Altrax 7245, palm OS porting
HI all,
Has anyone managed to write some c++ program for the palm os to read off the
memory values of the alltrax controller. I think i have provided the comm spec
sheet.
Cheers
**************************************************************
This message, including any attachments, contains confidential information
intended for a specific individual and purpose, and is protected by law. If
you are not the intended recipient, please contact sender immediately by reply
e-mail and destroy all copies. You are hereby notified that any disclosure,
copying, or distribution of this message, or the taking of any action based on
it, is strictly prohibited.
TIAA-CREF
**************************************************************
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
David Roden wrote:
Another reason for the PFC charger's popularity among hobbyist EVers on this
list is ... well, Rich talks about it a lot. Some have accused him of using
the list for free advertising. I don't quite see it that way, but I also
don't doubt that the frequent discussion here helps him sell more of them. ;-
I don't quite have a nerve to constantly keep promoting BRUSA
chargers on EVDL as much as Rich does for PFCs, so thanks David,
you've done the promo so well for me ;-)
...
Outside the nominal voltage range above it will work at maximum current of
25 amps (below range) or maximum voltage of 250 volts (above range). Thus
this charger model can deal with batteries from 6 to 250 volts. Other
models of my charger could charge as high as 485 volts, and the current
Brusa NLG5 can charge up to 720 volts(!).
Yes, the power of single charger is limited to a minimum 3.3kw
(mine actually does 3.6kW), but it is only issue of cost to
cascade several chargers in master/slave(s) mode - as many as
your mains can handle.
The Brusa has a highly capable microprocessor, and uses it to take very good
care of the battery. My NLG4 has up to 5 charging stages and a plethora of
programmable rules for moving among them - even backward. I believe the
current model, NLG5, is similar.
8 charging stages.
Now, the Brusa chargers are far from cheap. Certainly they cost a fair bit
more than the PFC, and I have to admit that the Brusa hasn't the same level
of raw power at certain voltages.
Talking about pricing changes, I must sau that the price in currency
atay put since the chargers were introduced. the price in USD keep
changing (and rose in last couple of years) only due to the exchange
rate which tracks the US economy in general. So the cost now reflects
the "great" shape of economy we're all in at the moment. It was nearly
40% less 4 years ago.
--
Victor
'91 ACRX - something different
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
It is not quite how it works. There is a reliability issue of NLG4
working at 110V load because of thermal problem for some components,
it is not inherent to the design.
The front stage is a boost converter taking whatever input is
available and providing internal high voltage bus for isolated
buck converter that follows.
Ken Olum wrote:
It's kind of a coincidence that the BC3300/NLG412 works on lower
voltages. The charger is a rectifier and a DC/DC converter that
converts the instantaneous input voltage into whatever is needed on
the output. It is designed to draw current proportional to voltage,
so as to give unit power factor. So if you connect it to 110V it just
thinks that you're on the lower parts of the 220V waveform. So it
charges fine, and won't do your batteries any harm, but it charges at
1/4 the rate that it would at 220V.
It also shortens the life of the charger, for reasons that I think are
not well understood, but doubtless have to do is the fact that this
device was not at all designed for this use.
An entertaining solution to having a 220V source is this
phase-combining unit: http://quick220.com/.
Ken Olum
--
Victor
'91 ACRX - something different
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
further googling leads me to believe this is an older electro-automotive
converion, FWIW
Andrew
Andrew Sackville-West wrote:
Greetings all,
First, this is a great list and I'm really glad to have been lurking for
a bit. I've learned a lot already.
So here's what I've found: 1980 VW Rabbit conversion that looks to have
been fairly professionally done. Its got a Curtis 1221B-7401 controller,
Prestolite 20hp 96volt motor (numbers are long since unreadable, though
I didn't crawl underneath the beast to see if there were any etched into
it), Kepro RMD 12-B-48 DC-DC converter (no battery support there),
vacuum pump but is missing the vacuum storage chamber(?) (I know these
can be easily fabricated, so no big deal), has space for an onboard
charger and is wired for this, but is gone, has a nice little dashboard
panel with guages and controls (includes a cryptic switch that allows
monitoring of each battery separately), has some pretty beefy battery
boxes complete with little ventilation fans, power tap in the cabin for
a ceramic heater or hair dryer or whatever. Has a modified hairdryer
attached to the motor for keeping it cool etc etc etc. The suspension
looks good, current owner claims its been beefed up for electric use and
I believe it as the springs look fairly new and the thing is riding
really high right now (no batteries). Its been sitting undriven for 6
years with no batteries. Finally, it comes with a massive heavy charger
(lester 96volt) that runs both 110 and 220. Owner claims to have
documentation, wiring diagrams etc. Thing is ugly as sin ;)
Okay, as I'm a total n00b, what do I need to watch out for? Owner claims
60 mile range and top speed near 65. Is this reasonable? Any obvious
flaws in this set-up that you can see? Is this really too good to be
true? Also, supposedly, its easily converted to regen, though it hasn't
been done: shunt wound motor?
thanks in advance for any advice.
Andrew
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
ok, im sorry, im a newbie... trying not to be a fly on the wall yet not
wanting to open my mouth too much and show everyone how little i know.. :)
im a little confused... i have an E-10.... it has an NLG412 charger...
but the label clearly states 220.... what is the popular concensus... can i
make a dummy adaptor to plug it into 110? will it cause any damage to any
part of the system....
db
----- Original Message -----
From: "Victor Tikhonov" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, September 12, 2005 2:40 PM
Subject: Re: Solectria Charger Question
It is not quite how it works. There is a reliability issue of NLG4
working at 110V load because of thermal problem for some components,
it is not inherent to the design.
The front stage is a boost converter taking whatever input is
available and providing internal high voltage bus for isolated
buck converter that follows.
Ken Olum wrote:
It's kind of a coincidence that the BC3300/NLG412 works on lower
voltages. The charger is a rectifier and a DC/DC converter that
converts the instantaneous input voltage into whatever is needed on
the output. It is designed to draw current proportional to voltage,
so as to give unit power factor. So if you connect it to 110V it just
thinks that you're on the lower parts of the 220V waveform. So it
charges fine, and won't do your batteries any harm, but it charges at
1/4 the rate that it would at 220V.
It also shortens the life of the charger, for reasons that I think are
not well understood, but doubtless have to do is the fact that this
device was not at all designed for this use.
An entertaining solution to having a 220V source is this
phase-combining unit: http://quick220.com/.
Ken Olum
--
Victor
'91 ACRX - something different
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello Stephen and all, no more need to hack, here it is :^)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Alltrax AXE/DCX serial communications protocol.
The following notes are excerpts from the source code for the controller.
You software guys can most likely figure it out from here as it's terribly
simplistic.
The controller is a slave, it only speaks if spoken to, and only then if it
understands the command, checksum is correct and so on. You'll have to poll
the controllers RAM for data. You can write memory locations in flash and
eeprom, but all it will do is cause us both headaches. I've identified the
commands in this protocol so you don't have to tinker around trying to find
them, but do us both a favour and leave flash/eeprom alone. Call Alltrax
for support.
Serial protocol is RS-232, 9600 baud, 8 data bits, no parity, 1 stop bit, no
handshaking. Protocol only uses a source/target I.D. and checksum to
validate incoming information, it wasn't meant to live on a network. The
controller understands 6 commands, as detailed below, but really all you
should be doing is reading RAM. The target processor in the AXE line is a
PIC16F873, in the DCX it is a PIC16F876.
AXE communications Spec. All references relative to motor controller.
;Communications Packet Protocol
;
; Recieve Packet Format
;
; Name Size Definition
;
; source/target 1 byte Windows App
is 5h, controller is Bh
; command 1 byte command
function to controller
; data1 1 byte
; data2 1 byte
; data3 1 byte
; data4 1 byte
; checksum 1 byte OVERFLOWED SUM OF PREVIOUS
SIX BYTES
;
;
;
;Command byte definition
;
; This is the instruction set for communicating with the
controller.
; 00h = read byte of program (flash) memory
; 01h = write byte of program (flash)
memory
; 02h = read byte of EEPROM memory
; 03h = write byte of EEPROM
; 04h = read 3 sequential bytes of RAM
; 05h = reset
;
; 04h = READ RAM - This command fetches three sequential bytes of
information
; from RAM (variable) memory and sends it
to the Windows host.
; variable locations are organized in order
to minimize
; the number of read cycles needed to
refresh data.
;
; Read RAM Packet Format (sent by PC)
;
; source/target : 5Bh (windows app is
host, controller is target)
; command : 04h (read three RAM
bytes)
; data1 : ADDRESS, in hex.
; data2 : DON'T CARE
; data3 : DON'T CARE
; data4 : DON'T CARE
; checksum : OVERFLOWED SUM OF PREVIOUS SIX
BYTES
;
; After decoding the packet, the controller shall
assemble the following
; information and reply to the Windows Host:
;
; Response Format (sent by controller)
;
; source/target : B5h
; command : 04h
; data1 : ADDRESS (start address of
three sequential bytes)
; data2 : data @ ADDRESS
; data3 : data @ ADDRESS + 1
; data4 : data @ ADDRESS + 2
; checksum : overflowed sum of 6 previous
bytes
;
;
;
;
; 05h = RESET: This command causes the program to goto the START
location and begin anew. The complete 7 byte protocol must be sent, but all
data is dummy.
The following are RAM locations you can read to get measurement data. High
and low bytes are in successive locations, thus you can fetch both high/low
byte with one read cycle.
THROT_POS EQU 0x20 ;8 bit Throttle position,
00h = off, FFh = wide open
DIODE_TEMP_L EQU 0x2C
DIODE_TEMP_H EQU 0x2D ;Internal Controller
temperature, ;
BATT_VOLT_L EQU 0x39 ; 0.1025 volts per bit.
BATT_VOLT_H EQU 0x3A
SHUTDOWN EQU 0x3B ;Error status, any bit
set, NO PWM output.
OUTPUT_CURR_L EQU 0x60 ; IOUT = 1A/BIT, 0 - 1023A
OUTPUT_CURR_H EQU 0x61 ; high byte
Battery current may be calculated as a percentage of output current,
assuming continuous motor currrent. Convert THROT_POS to decimal, then
Ibattery = (THROT_POS / 256) * OUTPUT_CURR_H,L
Temperature is measured with a Kelvin sensor, temp = 2.73V @ 0C Thus there
is an offset at 0C = 559 counts. Temperature slope = 2.048 counts / deg C
(positive tempco.)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
enjoy but be carreful with your alltrax, bad data and alltrax controller
become a unuseful brick out of waranty.
first having something speak about results here
cordialement,
Philippe
Et si le pot d'échappement sortait au centre du volant ?
quel carburant choisiriez-vous ?
http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr
Forum de discussion sur les véhicules électriques
http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr/Forum/index.php
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paschke, Stephen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, September 12, 2005 8:28 PM
Subject: RE: Altrax 7245, palm OS porting
> I am trying to work on that. But all I have is some captured data. If
you have a comm spec I would appreciate a copy of it.
> > Stephen Paschke
> > Senior Consultant
> > Keane, Inc.
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Behalf Of Robert Chew
> Sent: Sunday, September 11, 2005 12:23 AM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: Altrax 7245, palm OS porting
>
>
> HI all,
>
> Has anyone managed to write some c++ program for the palm os to read off
the
> memory values of the alltrax controller. I think i have provided the comm
spec sheet.
>
> Cheers
>
>
>
> **************************************************************
> This message, including any attachments, contains confidential information
intended for a specific individual and purpose, and is protected by law. If
you are not the intended recipient, please contact sender immediately by
reply e-mail and destroy all copies. You are hereby notified that any
disclosure, copying, or distribution of this message, or the taking of any
action based on it, is strictly prohibited.
> TIAA-CREF
> **************************************************************
>
--- End Message ---
