EV Digest 6479
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) RE: 25 points about - regen (and 'controlllers: the nth option')
by "England Nathan-r25543" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) RE: 25 points about - regen (and 'controlllers: the nth option')
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: EVLN(Bush spent 5min looking at EVs)
by GWMobile <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: Nicad update
by Dave Cover <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: EVLN(New ratings reduce MPG numbers)
by xx xx <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: EVLN(Bush spent 5min looking at EVs)
by "damon henry" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: EVLN(New ratings reduce MPG numbers)
by GWMobile <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: EVLN(Bush spent 5min looking at EVs)
by GWMobile <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: Wide vs Skinny Tires LRR
by "Phil Marino" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) RE: EVLN(New ratings reduce MPG numbers)
by "Tim Gamber" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: EVLN(Bush spent 5min looking at EVs)
by GWMobile <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: Blind EV's
by "Adrian DeLeon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) PFC-30 Documentation Error?
by Bill Dennis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) RE: Questions on EV
by "Tim Gamber" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: Blind EV's
by GWMobile <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: ZIF Recommendation
by Steven Wilson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: ZIF Recommendation
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Plasma Boy Gets a 50" Plasma ...'Video Only' Supports EV Drag Racing!
by John Wayland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: Nicad update and PFC charger
by "jerryd" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: Plasma Boy Gets a 50" Plasma ...'Video Only' Supports EV Drag Racing!
by Jim Husted <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: Plasma Boy Gets a 50" Plasma ...'Video Only' Supports EV Drag Racing!
by Rod Hower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
This conversation got me thinking.
If you had two motors, one SepEx and the other series wound.
Each had the same style armature
Each had the same mass of iron in the field
Each was running 96V on the armature
Each had enough amp/turns to just saturate the iron in the field
Which one would produce more torque?
Nate
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of thomas ward
Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2007 2:57 AM
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: RE: 25 points about - regen (and 'controlllers: the nth option')
Cor,
I think Seth was worried about arcing the comm rather than burning up the field
windings.
> that WHEN/IF
> the field and armature
> current gets out of balance .....
> ....then you get first arcing
> and sparking at the
> commutator
as far as I know(very little) the likelihood of arcing is related to current
through the armature which is related to field strength, voltage and RPM.
Iarmature=(Varmature-RPM * n turns * field strength ) / Rarmature
The field strength is related to the voltage and current through the field.
If the combination of V,RPM and field strength is wrong the armature current
and voltage will be too high.
I believe the Zapi the controllers are programmable.
www.electrofit-zapi.com
So with a little thought you could program in some sensible limits to avoid
arcing at the comm.
If its any use to you the price I was quoted wass
£628.99 Ex vat SEM3 96v
>From what Lee Hart was saying in a previous post the
arcing problem for sepex motors is usually due to
regen. I have a sepex motor in my van and Lee's
statement agrees with the workshop manual description
of the controller and with my experience (pitted comm
- probably due to excessive regen on a daily basis
when exiting the motorway at 70mph down to 0 in 1/4
mile).
Seth,
If you find you need a >96v motor then think about the
Peugeot/Citroen cars and vans. They use 120V and
162/168V Leroy Somer sepex motors. You can buy a
complete car (120V) without batteries for 1800 euros
in France.
http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr/Forum/viewtopic.php?t=1148
Takes about 2 hours to remove the motor from the car,
weight is approx 75kg.
A 162V Leroy Somer sepex motor from a Citroen van sold
in the UK on ebay back end of last year for about
$200.
good luck
Tom Ward
--- Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Seth,
>
> I am not sure why you are afraid of running a 72V
> motor at 96V.
> Sure - the field winding of a Sepex can be destroyed
> (burned up)
> easily because it has little mass (thin wiring) but
> the armature
> is basically the same as a series motor and they are
> abused
> routinely at around double voltage or more, while
> some racers
> manage to use a 12V motor in a vehicle with a 120V
> pack (Father
> Time, I hear).
>
> If you keep the output of the Sepex controller for
> the Field at
> the same level as for 72V operation, then there
> should be no
> problem to run the 72V motor at 96V, as EVs
> typically run for
> a short while only - when you try to run more than
> half an
> hour, you can't use full power continuously, so the
> continuous
> rating does not really apply to EVs until we can
> store much more
> energy or for someone that has another source than a
> battery.
>
> Hope this helps,
>
> Cor van de Water
> Systems Architect
> Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
> Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private:
> http://www.cvandewater.com
> Skype: cor_van_de_water IM:
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD#
> 25925
> Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
> Second Life:
>
www.secondlife.com/?u=3b42cb3f4ae249319edb487991c30acb
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Seth Myers
> Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2007 1:00 PM
> To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
> Subject: 25 points about - regen (and 'controlllers:
> the nth option')
>
> ok, well I did get some hlepful directions about
> this guy and where to find
> discussions - thanks for those!
>
> as persuggestions, on to a more technical issue:
>
> I've been looking into regen systems, and can find
> some controllers for
> those (Zapi), though they are more complicated than
> the hobbyist-friendly
> Curtis controller, and Zapi has not dedicated
> customer service staff to
> helping use of these by the hobbyists (which Curtis
> seems to have sort of
> done with their various dealers). They seem to make
> SepEx controllers for
> material handling, though only up to 96 volts (but
> that's what I'm
> considering on either an old vw beetle chassis
> (pretty light weight, like
> all those Ghias, but will probably need some
> reinforcing to carry 96 volts
> worth of 6 volt golf cart batteries
> (16x62 lbs.) )
> or on a new beetle I got an extraordinary deal on
> (well, of course it has no
> engine or transmission, as they were gutted for a
> local university's
> Challenge X contest) which probably couldn't hold
> more than 16 gc batteries.
> Anyway, SepEx offers the advantages of
> apparently smoother driving (less
> 'torquey' - do I sound like an American Idol judge
> with their eternal gripe
> about 'pitchiness?' (I have a wife and daughters,
> otherwise I would fein no
> knowledge of 'ai') (ok, really off taget with the
> discussion here) and regen
> which doesn't require any extra contactors.
> However, finding a motor that
> does > 72 volts and is SepEx is turning out to be a
> bit of a sticky wicket:
> Material handling seems to use these motors the
> most, but they are typically
> 72 volts or under. I asked one 'common ev motor
> maker,'
> shall I say,
> and they said using their 72 volt, 8" motor with
> regen at 96 volts would
> likely work, for some time anyway, but that WHEN/IF
> the field and armature
> current gets out of balance (which they can't verify
> because their dyno
> doesn't go to 96 volts) then you get first arcing
> and sparkingat the
> commutator end, then you burn up the motor;
> otherwise, the motor just runs
> hotter and faster.
> So, likely experimenting with one of these 72
> volt motors is not
> probably a good idea ...
> Any one have any other sugestions for say a 96 volt
> SepEx motor (since it
> would beeven harder to find a SepEx controller above
> 96 volts, I can only
> imagine)?
>
> Also, as to 'controllers the nth option' - has
> anyone seriously
> considered Zapis series motor controllers, they seem
> to go up to 1000 Amps
> if you like, 120 volts, don't seem really high
> priced. Less user friendly
> than Curtis since their wiring is more difficult,
> but if you're going to try
> to make your own controller, a few extra wires and
> manual reading shouldn't
> be so difficult ... I've heard they had some problem
> with contactors wearing
> out, but that (they said) that "Also, the bad
> experience that many people
> have had with contactors relates to a lack of
> sealing of the tips. If you
> get a sealed contactor, you should not have trouble.
> In general, the
> contactor will close and stay closed during
> operation. Since there will be
> no need to open and close the contactor, the life
> should be longer than
> others have experienced with regen and
> forward/reverse contactors."
> Any comments - maybe something to revisit or try
> out? If so, I'll keep
> y'all posted ...
>
> Seth
>
>
___________________________________________________________
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
From: England Nathan
>If you had two motors, one SepEx and the other series wound.
>Each had the same style armature
>Each had the same mass of iron in the field
>Each was running 96V on the armature
>Each had enough amp/turns to just saturate the iron in the field
>
>Which one would produce more torque?
If they have the same ampere-turns on the fields, they produce identical
torques. It doesn't matter if you have 100 amps in 1 turn, or 100 turns with 1
amp.
--
Lee Hart
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Would it have been ok if - said "the president"
Look the article itself was partisian if you want to take that stand.
Otherwise I agree but comeon.
He walks away and doesn't even want to turn the key?
His actions speak for themselves.
On Mon, 26 Feb 2007 3:10 pm, David Roden (Akron OH USA) wrote:
On 26 Feb 2007 at 13:48, someone wrote:
Bush's attitudes ...
NO PARTISAN POLITICS on the EVDL. Got it?
Other listers, please don't respond to partisan political comments, it
just
makes the situation worse.
Sorry to seem impatient, but a few people - just a few - seem to be
consistently forgetful about this, or perhaps they just lack
self-control.
One more time: snide political comments (or even not-so-snide ones)
have no
place here. Keep it to yourself, snigger with your signficant other,
trade jibes
with your coworkers, whatever, wherever. Just refrain from making
partisan
political comments on the list.
Thanks.
www.GlobalBoiling.com for daily images about hurricanes, globalwarming
and the melting poles.
www.ElectricQuakes.com daily solar and earthquake images.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
--- jerryd <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Best is an in-out amphr meter like the E meter or
> Lee's future E dash.
>
Jerry, Mike
This is the heart of one of my current issues. I know I've asked about this
before, but has anyone
figured out how to signal a PFC-30 to begin tapering down using the relay in
the eMeter? eMeters
of a certain vintage have a relay that is activated when you've replaced the
amphours used. And
I've read about Rich's chargers and using Mark2-3 regulators connected through
a Regbus setup to
cutoff charging. I've gone through the online documents, but couldn't find any
way to connect the
eMeter to the charger. Is there some kind of interface board that plugs into a
PFC-30 to external
inputs? Can I hook a Regbus card to the charger as the interface?
My default plan is to find a voltage level that is close to full to start the
tapering down and
let it finish with the timer. But not too high that I would risk never getting
there. Then do an
equalizing charge once in a while.
Your thoughts are welcoome and appreciated.
Dave Cover
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
--- GWMobile <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I am glad this has come out.
>
> It wil hasten the transition to all electric plugin
> vehicle for fuel
> economy concious people.
>
I disagree. I don't think mis-information is ever
good. Getting more people used to hybrids gets them
used to driving EV's as well.
The problem I have is I have seen many people claiming
to get much better mileage than that from the Prius.
Just because people can use their A/C and drive faster
than they need to doesn't mean that's how a vehicle
should be tested for mileage. I mean should all
vehicles be tested at full throttle takeoffs and full
speed with all accessories running full blast?
John
____________________________________________________________________________________
Now that's room service! Choose from over 150,000 hotels
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
And what exactly do his actions say???
That he is anti-Japanese? That he believes that the production of lithium
batteries in China is creating an envrionmental disaster? That parking
anywhere but a parking garage is an eye soar? Or your take on the matter
that he feels this is a direct attack on the petroleum industry that must be
stopped at any cost? You have interpretted his actions through your own
prejudices. For all you know he may have had a case of the juicy squirts
and been singing the "gotta go, gotta go, gotta go right now" song in his
head.
So please comply nicely when David asks you too and keep the political stuff
off the list. I'm sure that he gets tired of being the list babysitter.
Posting the story is fine, putting your own political spin on it isn't.
damon
From: GWMobile <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
CC: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: EVLN(Bush spent 5min looking at EVs)
Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007 15:23:29 -0800
Would it have been ok if - said "the president"
Look the article itself was partisian if you want to take that stand.
Otherwise I agree but comeon.
He walks away and doesn't even want to turn the key?
His actions speak for themselves.
On Mon, 26 Feb 2007 3:10 pm, David Roden (Akron OH USA) wrote:
On 26 Feb 2007 at 13:48, someone wrote:
Bush's attitudes ...
NO PARTISAN POLITICS on the EVDL. Got it?
Other listers, please don't respond to partisan political comments, it
just
makes the situation worse.
Sorry to seem impatient, but a few people - just a few - seem to be
consistently forgetful about this, or perhaps they just lack self-control.
One more time: snide political comments (or even not-so-snide ones) have
no
place here. Keep it to yourself, snigger with your signficant other,
trade jibes
with your coworkers, whatever, wherever. Just refrain from making
partisan
political comments on the list.
Thanks.
www.GlobalBoiling.com for daily images about hurricanes, globalwarming and
the melting poles.
www.ElectricQuakes.com daily solar and earthquake images.
_________________________________________________________________
Win a Zunemake MSN® your homepage for your chance to win!
http://homepage.msn.com/zune?icid=hmetagline
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
For those who can afford them and care enough to buy them new hybrids
are a mistake. They should instead spend the money to make one of their
cars 100% electric.
They would be happier and it would help the cause more.
On Mon, 26 Feb 2007 3:30 pm, xx xx wrote:
--- GWMobile <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
I am glad this has come out.
It wil hasten the transition to all electric plugin
vehicle for fuel
economy concious people.
I disagree. I don't think mis-information is ever
good. Getting more people used to hybrids gets them
used to driving EV's as well.
The problem I have is I have seen many people claiming
to get much better mileage than that from the Prius.
Just because people can use their A/C and drive faster
than they need to doesn't mean that's how a vehicle
should be tested for mileage. I mean should all
vehicles be tested at full throttle takeoffs and full
speed with all accessories running full blast?
John
____________________________________________________________________________________
Now that's room service! Choose from over 150,000 hotels
in 45,000 destinations on Yahoo! Travel to find your fit.
http://farechase.yahoo.com/promo-generic-14795097
www.GlobalBoiling.com for daily images about hurricanes, globalwarming
and the melting poles.
www.ElectricQuakes.com daily solar and earthquake images.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hey I didn't post the article.
On Mon, 26 Feb 2007 3:46 pm, damon henry wrote:
And what exactly do his actions say???
That he is anti-Japanese? That he believes that the production of
lithium batteries in China is creating an envrionmental disaster? That
parking anywhere but a parking garage is an eye soar? Or your take on
the matter that he feels this is a direct attack on the petroleum
industry that must be stopped at any cost? You have interpretted his
actions through your own prejudices. For all you know he may have had
a case of the juicy squirts and been singing the "gotta go, gotta go,
gotta go right now" song in his head.
So please comply nicely when David asks you too and keep the political
stuff off the list. I'm sure that he gets tired of being the list
babysitter. Posting the story is fine, putting your own political spin
on it isn't.
damon
From: GWMobile <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
CC: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: EVLN(Bush spent 5min looking at EVs)
Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007 15:23:29 -0800
Would it have been ok if - said "the president"
Look the article itself was partisian if you want to take that stand.
Otherwise I agree but comeon.
He walks away and doesn't even want to turn the key?
His actions speak for themselves.
On Mon, 26 Feb 2007 3:10 pm, David Roden (Akron OH USA) wrote:
On 26 Feb 2007 at 13:48, someone wrote:
Bush's attitudes ...
NO PARTISAN POLITICS on the EVDL. Got it?
Other listers, please don't respond to partisan political comments,
it just
makes the situation worse.
Sorry to seem impatient, but a few people - just a few - seem to be
consistently forgetful about this, or perhaps they just lack
self-control.
One more time: snide political comments (or even not-so-snide ones)
have no
place here. Keep it to yourself, snigger with your signficant other,
trade jibes
with your coworkers, whatever, wherever. Just refrain from making
partisan
political comments on the list.
Thanks.
www.GlobalBoiling.com for daily images about hurricanes, globalwarming
and the melting poles.
www.ElectricQuakes.com daily solar and earthquake images.
_________________________________________________________________
Win a Zune™—make MSN® your homepage for your chance to win!
http://homepage.msn.com/zune?icid=hmetagline
www.GlobalBoiling.com for daily images about hurricanes, globalwarming
and the melting poles.
www.ElectricQuakes.com daily solar and earthquake images.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
From: "Michael" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Re: Wide vs Skinny Tires LRR
Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007 12:37:03 -0800 (PST)
> They use 20% as an extreme ( "whopping") difference in tire RR, but the
> National Research Council has measured tire RR as low as 0.0062 and as
> high
> as 0.0152. That is an increase of 145% from the lowest to the highest.
> If
> TireRack had used that number, they wouldn't have reached the same
> conclusion.
Sure... but not on the same auto. (Unless you choose to run MC tires on
your SUV. <G>)
These were all passenger car tires.
Phil
_________________________________________________________________
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Heres a very good website with many models of cars, and tells you what
people driving that model are really averaging in the real world.
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/mpg/MPG.do?action=browseList
From: bruce parmenter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
To: evlist <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Subject: EVLN(New ratings reduce MPG numbers)
Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007 13:38:05 -0800 (PST)
EVLN(New ratings reduce MPG numbers)
[The Internet Electric Vehicle List News. For Public EV
informational purposes. Contact publication for reprint rights.]
--- {EVangel}
http://www.ncpa.org/sub/dpd/index.php?page=article&Article_ID=14232
Daily Policy Digest Environment Issues February 23, 2007
CAR M.P.G. RATINGS GOING DOWN
Fuel-saving gasoline-electric hybrid cars don't save as much fuel
as thought, according to new government fuel-economy ratings
available to the public for the first time.
The new ratings go into effect beginning with 2008 models, a few
of which will soon be on sale. But now it's possible to tell
what rating 2007 and older models would get using the 2008
standards.
Toyota's Prius, the best-known and best-selling gas-electric car
in the United States, drops from a 60 mpg rating under the
current system to 48 miles per gallon in the city under the 2008
testing procedure -- a 20 percent decline.
Its highway mileage rating falls about 12 percent, to 45 mpg.
The Ford Escape hybrid, which uses a gasoline-electric drive
system similar to Toyota's, goes down about 12 percent.
"What the cars get hasn't changed. It's just the numbers on the
sticker," says Toyota spokesman Mike Michels. The lowered Prius
rating is "probably more reflective of real-world experience," he
says.
Tests the government has used for mileage estimates were created
in the 1970s and haven't reflected today's driving environment.
They have assumed, for instance, that people don't use air
conditioning and don't drive more than about 60 mph.
Source: James R. Healey, "Car mpg ratings going down; Hybrids
take biggest hit in new system," USA Today, February 23, 2007.
For text:
http://www.usatoday.com/printedition/news/20070223/1a_lede23x_dom.art.htm
For website: www.fueleconomy.gov
For more on Gasoline/Petroleum:
http://eteam.ncpa.org/issues/?c=gasoline-and-petroleum
For more on Environment Issues:
http://www.ncpa.org/sub/dpd/index.php?Article_Category=31
We depend on the financial support of individuals. We need your
help to continue our work. Join the NCPA today!
Copyright © 2007 National Center for Policy Analysis. All rights
reserved
-
Bruce {EVangel} Parmenter
' ____
~/__|o\__
'@----- @'---(=
. http://geocities.com/brucedp/
. EV List Editor, RE & AFV newswires
. (originator of the above ASCII art)
===== Undo Petroleum Everywhere
____________________________________________________________________________________
Expecting? Get great news right away with email Auto-Check.
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From January 26 to February 8, 2007
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
For all you know he may have had a case of the juicy squirts and been
singing the "gotta go, gotta go, gotta go right now" song in his head.
Now that is funny. I will never watch presidential appearances the same
way again.
www.GlobalBoiling.com for daily images about hurricanes, globalwarming
and the melting poles.
www.ElectricQuakes.com daily solar and earthquake images.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Mon, 26 Feb 2007 14:49:49 -0800, Roland wrote:
How about those super quiet ICE cars. I drove one at city driving speed
and cannot hear the engine. Some times I may try to start the engine,
but it
was already running!!
My wife's 2005 Honda Accord is the same way. The engine is very quiet
outside, but almost silent from inside. Once you're going over about 15MPH
the tire & road noise drowns out the engine noise unless you're under
medium to hard acceleration. We're both guilty of cruising at 65MPH in 4th
gear! The only time I really hear is is when it's moving AWAY from me.
My EV makes more noise just sitting there. Any good ideas to quiet down
those Dayton blowers? I was thinking about wiring it so it turns OFF
unless motor RPM is above 500 or so.
Adrian
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The PFC-30 documentation says the following:
"SW3 controls what event will start the timer:
SW3-1 will start the timer when the acceptance voltage causes the
charger to back off on current.
SW3-2 will start the timer when power is applied to the charger
SW3-3 will start the timer when the Regbus tells the charger to back off
on current.
If no Batregs are connected to the charger, SW3-1 will have no effect."
Am I reading this wrong, or should that last sentence really say:
"If no Batregs are connected to the charger, SW3-3 will have no effect."
Thanks.
Bill Dennis
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Cool what kind of motor, controller, and electronics does it have? and at
what speeds/driving did you get that high range at?
From: Electro Automotive <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: RE: Questions on EV
Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007 10:49:27 -0800
At 03:54 PM 2/25/2007, you wrote:
I think its great your interested in EVs but even 60 miles on lead acid
batteries is difficult at high speeds. The porsche is a good conversion
vehicle from what iv'e heard, but i doubt you will be able to make 60
miles on one charge with lead acids.
Our DC Voilsporsche can do 80 - 100 miles on lead acid, under good
conditions. In fact, we have had customers top 100 miles a couple times,
once as much as 126 miles in a rally. This is using 120V of US 125 6V
batteries. The AC system is more efficient and has regenerative braking,
so it is capable of higher range.
Shari Prange
Electro Automotive POB 1113 Felton CA 95018-1113 Telephone 831-429-1989
http://www.electroauto.com [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Electric Car Conversion Kits * Components * Books * Videos * Since 1979
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--- Begin Message ---
The hybrid that almost hit me walking in the post office parking lot was
absolutely silent while moving.
On Mon, 26 Feb 2007 4:18 pm, Adrian DeLeon wrote:
On Mon, 26 Feb 2007 14:49:49 -0800, Roland wrote:
How about those super quiet ICE cars. I drove one at city driving
speed and cannot hear the engine. Some times I may try to start the
engine, but it
was already running!!
My wife's 2005 Honda Accord is the same way. The engine is very quiet
outside, but almost silent from inside. Once you're going over about
15MPH the tire & road noise drowns out the engine noise unless you're
under medium to hard acceleration. We're both guilty of cruising at
65MPH in 4th gear! The only time I really hear is is when it's moving
AWAY from me.
My EV makes more noise just sitting there. Any good ideas to quiet
down those Dayton blowers? I was thinking about wiring it so it turns
OFF unless motor RPM is above 500 or so.
Adrian
www.GlobalBoiling.com for daily images about hurricanes, globalwarming
and the melting poles.
www.ElectricQuakes.com daily solar and earthquake images.
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Bill,
I see what you want to do with your regs. I suggest you consider
"banana" type plugs and jacks. Let me know if you need help finding
them. Make sure to coat them with grease or something like that to keep
them from corroding (this will be necessary for any connector you use by
the way). There are more expensive rack power connectors that are
similar, but will not work any better for your application. Stay away
from connectors designed for computers, etc, they will not hold up in
the auto environment.
Regards,
Steve Wilson
Hyde Park, NY
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From: Bill Dennis
> I think my use of "ZIP" was misleading. I'm not looking for a IC card
> type of connector. I've got 21 shunt regulators. All 21 regulators are
> attached in place, side by side, on two strips of rigid non-conducting
> material, like this:
>
>Each regulator is spaced to sit in front of its corresponding cell, I
>want each side of each regulator to snug into some type of connector
>that's wired to the cell's + and - terminal, respectively. Whatever
>that connectors is, it should be easy enough to push into and pull out
>of so that I can remove or reinstall all 21 regulators at the same time
>by pulling the strips away from the cells. Once the regulators have
>been snapped into their connectors. I'll lock the strips in place so
>that nothing can accidentally pop out during driving.
What about banana plugs? These are the ones you see on all multimeters. They
are good for high voltage and moderately high current, available in single-pin
and 2-pin versions. Mount all the female sockets on a piece of metal or plastic
that stays in the car. Mount the male pins on each regulator. Line them up, and
you can plug/unplug them all at once.
--
Lee Hart
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Hello to All,
A reminder for those who live in the Portland metro area, The Portland
Roadster Show opens this weekend, March 2nd, 3rd, and 4th, at the
Portland Convention Center, and White Zombie is one of the featured
cars. We managed to install all of the new Genesis batteries and by
Thursday, the car will be fully functional and running on its 40% more
powerful battery pack.
I had previously written:
One more thing....White Zombie will be a 'highlighted' car at the
upcoming Portland Roadster Show and will be displayed at the entrance
into the main arena of the show. This is quite an honor and a step
forward for EV acceptance in the hot rod world. The show promoters are
encouraging us to set up and loop videos of White Zombie taking out
classic muscle cars and hot rice burner imports....
All who walk down the entrance stairs into the lobby on their way into
the show will be hit right between the eyes with White Zombie on display
(both in person and on a bright big plasma screen) as it melts its fat
rear tires, jerks its front tires off the ground, and blows away muscle
cars and hot imports. I somehow, talked the video chain 'Video Only'
into providing a brand new, Hi Def 50 inch Panasonic TH50PX 600U plasma
screen and DVD player setup! I also got an even better spot for White
Zombie, showcased right next to the souveneer booth at the arena
entrance-exit. Tim and I got together and designed a looping DVD that
features action racing videos with added-in screen captions like
'Electric Datsun vs 396 Chevelle' ....'Electric Datsun vs 454 Camaro',
etc. There's lots of tire smoke, roaring V8s, and whistling-swooshing
turbos as the gas-fueled competition struggles to catch White Zombie,
the electric muscle car.
In talking with the area manager, he told that we're the first 'free
loaner' customer of a video system in the 13 years he's been in charge
of the multiple locations of video stores, and added that in addition to
the huge advertising benefit for them, he quite frankly thought the
world needed to see an electric car beating high powered gas cars. How
cool is this? The next time anyone is considering buying any new video
gear, make sure to remember 'Video Only' the video retailers who support
EVs.
Tim and I hope to see our EV friends this weekend, so make sure to stop
by to say hello. We'll be easy to spot....we'll be the two guys with the
cool Chip Gribben Electric Muscle Car T-shirts and a huge crowd around
us (and that 50 inch plasma set)!
See Ya......John 'Plasma Boy' Wayland
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Hi Dave, Mike and All,
Some E meters have a relay on it you can set
to control another relay to shut the charger off when it's
filled the set amount based on amp out. Newer E meters still
have the relay circuit on the PC board but you have to
repopulate it with it's parts I hear. Maybe Rich or someone
else can help you better. But voltage for ni-cads is not a
good indicator to tell when charged.
----- Original Message Follows -----
From: "Mike Phillips" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "jerryd" <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Subject: Re: Nicad update
Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007 17:39:19 -0000
>Jerry,
>
>> Do you use an E meter to control your charger or
>> how do you charge?
>
>I have a US Electricar truck. It has a built in charger.
>I've figured out most of the charging parameters related to
>charging. The truck has an Emeter but it's not connected to
>the factory charger. The Emeter is where I get the ah's and
>kwhr's from. I've set the charger to shut off an hour after
>the pack hits 400v(1.587vpc).
That's probably not a good idea. While it may work as
long as the batts are in balance, if they get out it will
get nasty and never shut off.
I'd switch to the Emeter circuit.
>
>> I think the 120-140% is rather high, is that just
>> for the initializing charges? Or equalizing or for all?
>> Why is you will be wasting an awlful lot of electricity
>> at that rate and overheating them. That 20-40% extra has
>> to go somewhere and gets turned to heat. And a big way to
>> produce a lot of H2/02 may explain your bang.
>
>If you log into the BB600 group, you can read the 2 BB600
>manuals. The manuals say that 20-40% overcharge is part of
>the normal recharge routine.
That maybe for jet fighter use where they are
replaced after a couple yrs so life is not maximized. While
it maybe be cold enough where you are that it just keeps
them warm. But overcharging is going to lead to corrorsion.
I'll do the 110% equalizing and 90-100% charges
between them on mine.
My temperature monitor shows
>that they stay around room temperature when overcharging as
>I currently do. In fact the pack may be overcharging much
>less than the 20-40% that I use to charge them to.
Lets hope so and your voltage you charge to
supports that. How many amps you you charge after reaching
1.587/cell?
The big
>bang was due to excess hydrogen production made from having
>slightly reversed (-0.1v) cells during the maintenance
>discharge process that I put them through per the battery
>manual. This manual that says every 100 cycles or so that
>the cells should be discharged to zero volts and held there
>for 24 hours. It also shows that mild reversal produces
>excess hydrogen, while hard reversal produces excess
>oxygen. I had the pack uncovered the entire time. I even
>drove it on an errand before it exploded.
Wow! I never did that with my small cells. Nor will I
do it for my pack. Again it might be something they do for
the military or required by them.
>
>> To equalize I charged to 1.65/cell but only did
>> that every 5 cycles or without any balancing problems.
>> And about 1.5-1.55 between equalizing charges. Be
>> careful using this as it can rise above that, then drop
>> off as it becomes too charged so voltage other than the
>> 90% dischage is not a good judge of state of charge
>> unless you are tracking it and even then can be tricky as
>> one cell rises as another gets overcharged and falls,
>making the knee hard to detect.
>
>>From my observations of the pack during charging, the pack
>is in the knee, but not past it. You and I are charging to
>nearly the same volts per cell. I cannot equalize to 1.65v
>as my charger only goes to 400vdc. So I can't go above
>1.587 vpc unless I remove several cells and still try to
>charge to 400v.
With the after charging you are surely fully charged.
But if you keep using it that way, when the cells get out of
balance, rare but can happen. With that charge regime, I
wouldn't go higher anyway as you can more easily get into
the voltage knee problem.
>>
making their rating. Since my truck pulls
>> >about 1C-2C from these cells in normal driving, I tend
>> probably happening.
>
>The Greentops are probably around 50ah max. The tests I've
>done show them to be higher than the redtops I also own.
>The greentops are labeled 40-45ah depending on the
>discharge rate.
Want to trade? ;^D
Try to get a whole pack of the same type if you are
using both in the same string. Especially if you continue to
short them for maintance or short, recharge the 2 types
seperately or the smaller amphr units will badly reverse and
while tough, would only last a few of those cycles. And set
your range to monitoring just the smaller amphr cells.
Jerry Dycus
>
>Mike
>
>
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--- Begin Message ---
Damn John, only you....
You greedy sponsor vaccuum! I'm surprised you haven't
just asked for a couple of Tesla's LMAO!!
All you'd have to say is "if I can't break them no one
can" hehe.
Had fun, I'd say good luck but I'd probably puke with
your next post, hehehe.
Congrats, it really looks like 07's gonna be a fun
year. Say hello to Tim and Marko for me.
Cya
Jim Husted
Hi-Torque Electric
--- John Wayland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hello to All,
>
> A reminder for those who live in the Portland metro
> area, The Portland
> Roadster Show opens this weekend, March 2nd, 3rd,
> and 4th, at the
> Portland Convention Center, and White Zombie is one
> of the featured
> cars. We managed to install all of the new Genesis
> batteries and by
> Thursday, the car will be fully functional and
> running on its 40% more
> powerful battery pack.
>
> I had previously written:
>
> >
> > One more thing....White Zombie will be a
> 'highlighted' car at the
> > upcoming Portland Roadster Show and will be
> displayed at the entrance
> > into the main arena of the show. This is quite an
> honor and a step
> > forward for EV acceptance in the hot rod world.
> The show promoters are
> > encouraging us to set up and loop videos of White
> Zombie taking out
> > classic muscle cars and hot rice burner
> imports....
>
>
> All who walk down the entrance stairs into the lobby
> on their way into
> the show will be hit right between the eyes with
> White Zombie on display
> (both in person and on a bright big plasma screen)
> as it melts its fat
> rear tires, jerks its front tires off the ground,
> and blows away muscle
> cars and hot imports. I somehow, talked the video
> chain 'Video Only'
> into providing a brand new, Hi Def 50 inch Panasonic
> TH50PX 600U plasma
> screen and DVD player setup! I also got an even
> better spot for White
> Zombie, showcased right next to the souveneer booth
> at the arena
> entrance-exit. Tim and I got together and designed a
> looping DVD that
> features action racing videos with added-in screen
> captions like
> 'Electric Datsun vs 396 Chevelle' ....'Electric
> Datsun vs 454 Camaro',
> etc. There's lots of tire smoke, roaring V8s, and
> whistling-swooshing
> turbos as the gas-fueled competition struggles to
> catch White Zombie,
> the electric muscle car.
>
> In talking with the area manager, he told that we're
> the first 'free
> loaner' customer of a video system in the 13 years
> he's been in charge
> of the multiple locations of video stores, and added
> that in addition to
> the huge advertising benefit for them, he quite
> frankly thought the
> world needed to see an electric car beating high
> powered gas cars. How
> cool is this? The next time anyone is considering
> buying any new video
> gear, make sure to remember 'Video Only' the video
> retailers who support
> EVs.
>
> Tim and I hope to see our EV friends this weekend,
> so make sure to stop
> by to say hello. We'll be easy to spot....we'll be
> the two guys with the
> cool Chip Gribben Electric Muscle Car T-shirts and a
> huge crowd around
> us (and that 50 inch plasma set)!
>
> See Ya......John 'Plasma Boy' Wayland
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________________
Yahoo! Music Unlimited
Access over 1 million songs.
http://music.yahoo.com/unlimited
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John,
That is really cool that you were sponsored with a
huge TV. And then I started thinking..... you have
kick butt batteries and the other companies will
notice. So.... If you get sponsored with even higher
powered batteries, will the car be able to handle it?
I would like to see what the evcalculator predicts for
other battery chemistries, I'm sure you've already
checked this out :-)
Rod
--- Jim Husted <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Damn John, only you....
> You greedy sponsor vaccuum! I'm surprised you
> haven't
> just asked for a couple of Tesla's LMAO!!
> All you'd have to say is "if I can't break them no
> one
> can" hehe.
>
> Had fun, I'd say good luck but I'd probably puke
> with
> your next post, hehehe.
> Congrats, it really looks like 07's gonna be a fun
> year. Say hello to Tim and Marko for me.
> Cya
> Jim Husted
> Hi-Torque Electric
>
> --- John Wayland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > Hello to All,
> >
> > A reminder for those who live in the Portland
> metro
> > area, The Portland
> > Roadster Show opens this weekend, March 2nd, 3rd,
> > and 4th, at the
> > Portland Convention Center, and White Zombie is
> one
> > of the featured
> > cars. We managed to install all of the new Genesis
> > batteries and by
> > Thursday, the car will be fully functional and
> > running on its 40% more
> > powerful battery pack.
> >
> > I had previously written:
> >
> > >
> > > One more thing....White Zombie will be a
> > 'highlighted' car at the
> > > upcoming Portland Roadster Show and will be
> > displayed at the entrance
> > > into the main arena of the show. This is quite
> an
> > honor and a step
> > > forward for EV acceptance in the hot rod world.
> > The show promoters are
> > > encouraging us to set up and loop videos of
> White
> > Zombie taking out
> > > classic muscle cars and hot rice burner
> > imports....
> >
> >
> > All who walk down the entrance stairs into the
> lobby
> > on their way into
> > the show will be hit right between the eyes with
> > White Zombie on display
> > (both in person and on a bright big plasma screen)
> > as it melts its fat
> > rear tires, jerks its front tires off the ground,
> > and blows away muscle
> > cars and hot imports. I somehow, talked the video
> > chain 'Video Only'
> > into providing a brand new, Hi Def 50 inch
> Panasonic
> > TH50PX 600U plasma
> > screen and DVD player setup! I also got an even
> > better spot for White
> > Zombie, showcased right next to the souveneer
> booth
> > at the arena
> > entrance-exit. Tim and I got together and designed
> a
> > looping DVD that
> > features action racing videos with added-in screen
> > captions like
> > 'Electric Datsun vs 396 Chevelle' ....'Electric
> > Datsun vs 454 Camaro',
> > etc. There's lots of tire smoke, roaring V8s, and
> > whistling-swooshing
> > turbos as the gas-fueled competition struggles to
> > catch White Zombie,
> > the electric muscle car.
> >
> > In talking with the area manager, he told that
> we're
> > the first 'free
> > loaner' customer of a video system in the 13 years
> > he's been in charge
> > of the multiple locations of video stores, and
> added
> > that in addition to
> > the huge advertising benefit for them, he quite
> > frankly thought the
> > world needed to see an electric car beating high
> > powered gas cars. How
> > cool is this? The next time anyone is considering
> > buying any new video
> > gear, make sure to remember 'Video Only' the video
> > retailers who support
> > EVs.
> >
> > Tim and I hope to see our EV friends this weekend,
> > so make sure to stop
> > by to say hello. We'll be easy to spot....we'll be
> > the two guys with the
> > cool Chip Gribben Electric Muscle Car T-shirts and
> a
> > huge crowd around
> > us (and that 50 inch plasma set)!
> >
> > See Ya......John 'Plasma Boy' Wayland
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________________
> Yahoo! Music Unlimited
> Access over 1 million songs.
> http://music.yahoo.com/unlimited
>
>
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