EV Digest 6586
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: A few newbie questions.
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: A few newbie questions.
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: FAST(er) NEV's - Update HB 1820 Washington State
by "Darin - at - metrompg.com" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) test
by lyle sloan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: A few newbie questions.
by Tom Ward <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: Curtis stuff
by James Massey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: e-bikes in india ..
by "peekay" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) perfecting by indian makers
by "peekay" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Tesla completes first Validation Prototype
by "Kaido Kert" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) [ebay] DC/DC DCP 300W
by "Philippe Borges" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: 120 VDC to 120VAC Inverter Source?
by Steven Ciciora <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: 120 VDC to 120VAC Inverter Source?
by "David Sharpe" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: 2007 Power of DC EV Racing Challenge
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
14) Re: Yellow Tops... Yes or No?
by "Chris Tromley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: A few newbie questions.
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
16) Re: EVLN(UK Hybrid double-decker bus launched)
by "Evan Tuer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: We Blow Things Up, So You Don't Have To...2007
by "Martin Klingensmith" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: 120 VDC to 120VAC Inverter Source?
by "Michaela Merz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: charging while driving question
by Frank John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) RE: Big Honking Motor
by "Joe Plumer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) RE: 120 VDC to 120VAC Inverter Source?
by "Rick Todd" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Prius battery packs
by "Barry C." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Newbie melts a battery terminal
by "Deanne Mott" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Test.
by "Roger Stockton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Crimp hex jaw size needed 4/0 cable?
by "Mark Ward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) RE: A few newbie questions.
by Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) Re: new DC series motor run-in?
by Frank John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
> --- "Barry C." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
>> > I am wanting to build a EV ... Able to run 65-70mph. 35-50mi.
>> > carry 2 adults, 2 children for around the town errands on occasion.
>> > This is doable?
>>
>
>>No, not practically. If you can cut either the speed or the
>>range in half, it could be. If you can recharge at the halfway
>>point of the 35-50 miles, it counts as cutting the range in
>>half. But if you're really putting on that many miles in a
>>day, expect to replace your pack frequently.
>
> I have been reading and searching trying to find a donor car that I will
> be able to create that would get these results. I have been reading that
> the EV's can achieve these speeds. Is it just that they can't sustain them
> very long?
65-70 mph, is doable, easy even. 35-50 miles is doable, not easy but very
doable.
35-50 miles at 65-70 mph is not so easy.
> My commute from Hayward to Oakland is about 20mi round trip.
20 miles at 65 mph is doable. 1300 lbs worth of lead-acid batteries
should give you about 30 miles range at 65 mph, so 20 miles is only 70% of
that. This is good. You don't want your commute to take 100% of you
range because your range for new batteries doesn't last all that long. 70%
of your range means that the batteries will still be able to provide that
much range for several years ( if you don't murder them first ).
--
If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has > 4 lines of legalistic
junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I
wish with the message. By posting the message you agree that your long
legalistic signature is void.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
>>Another problem is that the Escort wagon starts out on the heavy side,
>> and
>>gets even heavier with all that lead. So it isn't exactly zippy.
>
>
>>David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
>>EV List Administrator
>
> I thought the springs may squat, I was thinking of heavy duty springs or
> airbags to support the weight.
Then your brakes won't be up to the task, so you upgrade them. Then the
bearings won't last long under that much load, so you replace/upgrade
them, then the suspension attachments strip, tear, etc. etc. etc. etc.
If you are just going a little over the rated weight, then you might get
away with it. When you go a lot over the rated weight things go south in
a hurry. It's better to start with a vehicle that can handle the weight.
>
> I have been reading about a lot of cars out there with 144V and 192V
> systems how are they dealing with the weight in small cars?
Using smaller batteries. I believe many (most?) of the 192V conversions
are using something like Optima YTs. These are 12V sealed AGM batteries
that weigh about 45 lbs each. It only takes 16 of them (720 lbs) to make
a 192V conversion.
>
> Thanks
>
>
--
If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has > 4 lines of legalistic
junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I
wish with the message. By posting the message you agree that your long
legalistic signature is void.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Roger -
NEVs aren't required to be crash tested, but the Canadian government got
samples of a few and did just this, then presented the videos of the
tests.
Do you happen to know if the results (or videos) of these tests are
available online?
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
test
____________________________________________________________________________________
8:00? 8:25? 8:40? Find a flick in no time
with the Yahoo! Search movie showtime shortcut.
http://tools.search.yahoo.com/shortcuts/#news
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Citroen Berlingos do 60 mph for 35 miles, no bother (about 75-80% DOD).
They have 16KWh of nicads and are slightly taller than a UK Ford Escort
van. They have a paylod of 500kg so maybe you could lose the payload and
use lead acid instead of the Nicads.
On Thu, 2007-03-22 at 15:40 -0700, Mark Brueggemann wrote:
> --- "Barry C." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
> > I have been reading that the EV's can achieve these speeds.
> > Is it just that they can't sustain them very long?
>
> Yes. You get speed or range, but not both.
>
>
> > My commute from Hayward to Oakland is about 20mi round trip.
>
> You gave a range of 20-35 in your other post, which makes a huge
> difference. 35 is almost 2X. 20 miles, even at freeway speeds
> is pretty doable.
>
>
> >>> Trojan T145 6V batteries. (144V 24 batteries)
> >> It could never hold that much weight, at least not safely.
>
> > Any recommendations...
>
> I don't think you'll need T-145's to get the range you are (now)
> looking for anyway. My opinion of what a chassis is capable of
> is based on what it would be like to drive it loaded similarly as
> an ICE vehicle. Imagine putting a half a ton or so of sand
> in an Escort and driving around that way. Just because you can
> find places to fit batteries doesn't mean you can keep piling
> them in for the sake of range. Yes, you can beef up the suspension
> but that's just a start. You have to think about braking and
> handling as well, which means balancing the pack from front to
> back, keeping the center of gravity low, and not push your luck
> with GVWR. I've seen conversions well above GVWR and consider
> that an accident waiting to happen.
>
>
> > I have been reading about a lot of cars out there with
> > 144V and 192V systems how are they dealing with the weight
> > in small cars?
>
> They use smaller batteries, like Optimas or Hawkers.
>
> Mark "EV Basher" Brueggemann
> Albuquerque, NM
> S-10 EV
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 02:58 PM 22/03/07 -0700, Mike Golub wrote:
logi did tell me that some of the curtis 1204 are so
old, that they aren't worth fixing, but not sure what
parts they are talking about.
G'day Mike, and All
If you consider the depreciated value, they are probably worth about $0.20
in accountant-speak.
In real terms it is probably considering that the capacitors are that old
that they have to replace the caps as well as the Fets, etc when you take
commercial value of the labour, that they become more than half the cost of
a new unit (or some arbitary value). I'm going to try and measure the ESR
of the capacitors and re-use the ones that are OK, if that can be
determined. Since I already have an ESR meter, there is no extra cost in
doing so (not considering the labour).
For someone who is treating this as a hobby, or considering the wages value
rather than a commercial hourly rate value, it is still worthwhile,
particularly as there are almost no good secondhand units available, so
either rebuild an old one, for which there is a purchace cost of a dead
controller, price of capacitors and Fets, diodes if needed, and allowance
for labour cost, or to buy a new one. No fun in buying a new one, don't
learn anything and can't "tweak" anything.
So far looking at the date codes on the chips, my 1204s look like at least
12 years old, MOSFet technology has improved a lot in those years, so it is
possible to make a controller that heats up slower therefore the full-power
time is longer. As a commercial proposition it is probably marginal to
rebuild these old controllers, but as a lower cost way to get a better
controller and learn some along the way it is probably a good thing (your
results may vary).
I've been looking at voltage upgrade, 48 volts up to 72 volts. To do this
effectively the capacitors are taller, which means making holes in the
heatsink (for ones just a little taller) or mounting them on the opposite
side of the PCB and not putting the controller back into its' case.
In the case of the 1221s I haven't yet looked at what is available, I have
been thinking of capacitors with a bit more capacity and a lower an ESR (if
I can determine what that is) of the originals, leave out a few (maybe 3 or
4) and putting an ultra-low ESR capacitor that are used in inverter
welders, etc in the spaces. (These are only a few uF, rather than the 220uF
of the electrolytic capacitors that are in the controller).
So far it seems that the controller power stages suffer, the control boards
are surviving in the very limited sample so far.
The biggest hassle with the blow-ups is carbonised PCB. For me it works to
remove all the components and bead-blast the board, removing all of the
compromised PCB material, then rebuild any tracks with tinned solid copper
wire and epoxy if needed. Again, this is due to what I have to work with (a
bead blaster). If I didn't have a bead blaster I guess I'd be using a small
wire wheel in a Dremel tool or similar.
Hope this helps
regards
[Technik] James
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
i guess i need to clarify that the e-bikes mentioned in the
subject lines are just called bikes .. actually they are
scooters .. and are called ebikes for some reason or the
other .. matrix and yobyke are the two that i have seen
..peekay
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kaido Kert" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Thursday, March 22, 2007 7:13 PM
Subject: Re: e-bikes in india ..
> The topic caught my attention as there were two recent nice news about
e-bikes
> First, EVUK posted a welcome news about sub £500 lithium-powered full
> size e-bikes making their way to stores in UK, imported from Japan and
> China
> http://www.evuk.co.uk/news/index5.html
>
> Another nice thing to see, Jonathan Weinert, US student in China,
> posts a video on his blog about high popularity of ebikes over there:
> http://www.jonathanweinert.com/shanghai-blogs/
>
> -kert
>
> On 3/22/07, peekay <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "bruce parmenter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >
> > > But India, perhaps, offers the most e-bike promise. Scooter-like
> > > e-bikes appeal to penny-pinching hipsters, and an e-bike craze is
> > > running fast among India's call center crowd.
> >
> > what is not very well known is that yobike uses Li-Ion battery and
> > yet is cheaper .. it has a locally manufactured hub motor
> >
> >
> > > The arrival of Ultra Motors, a British electric vehicle upstart
> > ....
> > > Ultra is incorporating its more efficient motor, designed by a Russian
> > > scientist, into Hero's bikes; it plans the same for scooters and
> > > rickshaws,
> >
> > what's that ? what is more efficient in the motor designd by that
> > russian scientist ?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ___________________________________________________________
> > Try the all-new Yahoo! Mail. "The New Version is radically easier to
use" – The Wall Street Journal
> > http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.5.446 / Virus Database: 268.18.13/726 - Release Date: 3/18/2007
3:34 PM
>
>
___________________________________________________________
All new Yahoo! Mail "The new Interface is stunning in its simplicity and ease
of use." - PC Magazine
http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
dunno if they are perfecting another makers model but the
guys who make yobykes are certainly capable of designing
simple things like hub motors running off li-ion .. after they
have delivered hundreds (maybe thousands) of electric
furnaces which run on high frequency currents generated
by the solid state circuits of their power packs .. and get
this : those furnaces can melt 10,000 kilos within the hour !
..peekay
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Thursday, March 22, 2007 8:37 PM
Subject: Re: e-bikes in india ..
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Evan Tuer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
> Sent: Thursday, March 22, 2007 8:43 AM
> Subject: Re: e-bikes in india ..
>
>
> > On 3/22/07, peekay <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "bruce parmenter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > >
> > > > The arrival of Ultra Motors, a British electric vehicle upstart
> > > ....
> > > > Ultra is incorporating its more efficient motor, designed by a
Russian
> > > > scientist, into Hero's bikes; it plans the same for scooters and
> > > > rickshaws,
> > >
> > > what's that ? what is more efficient in the motor designd by that
> > > russian scientist ?
> > > Hi EVerybody;
>
> Nice to see the Russians working on something useful<g>! We have
> enough MIG Whatevers, for now. Now if the MIG guyz could come up with a
> lightweight aerodynamic CAR??The Iranians arent paying in a timely fashion
> for the nukes, these guys could be working on some better EV stuff??
>
> Indians are "Perfecting" the E bikes?I'm rootin' for the Indians here!
> When I had a Indian "Teckie" helping me with my computer. I chatted him
up,
> his name was Pat, and, Yes, he had heard of electric cars and wanted a
Riva.
> I sez don't let THAT stop you, build your own! We talked about motors
> batteries and stuff. Put a more human thing to outsourcing. I had told him
> next time he was in CT to stop by. Same IF I were to appear in Bengalore,
I
> think he said.Finally, duties called and he had to get back to work.
> Interesting morning.
>
> Seeya
>
> Bob
> >
> > No idea, but you could try asking them:
> > http://www.ultramotors.co.uk/
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > No virus found in this incoming message.
> > Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> > Version: 7.1.413 / Virus Database: 268.18.16/729 - Release Date: 3/21/07
> >
> >
>
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.5.446 / Virus Database: 268.18.13/726 - Release Date: 3/18/2007
3:34 PM
>
>
___________________________________________________________
All new Yahoo! Mail "The new Interface is stunning in its simplicity and ease
of use." - PC Magazine
http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
http://www.teslamotors.com/blog1/?p=54
New blog post on Tesla site, they achieved a major milestone. They
have validation prototypes (VP) ready, first appears to have rolled
off the assembly line, nine more to produce.
IMHO, their status just went from believable to very serious, as an automaker.
This also means that major car magazines will eventually get their
hands on the prototypes for "official" reviews, lets hope that they
have only nice things to say.
-kert
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
it could serve to someone here
input Voltage: 96V - 336V
Input Current: 5A Max
Main Output Power: 300W @ 25C
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/DC-DC-CONVERTER-DCP-EV-POWER_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ46093QQitemZ150104735348QQrdZ1
i'm not related to this announce.
Cordialement,
Philippe
Et si le pot d'échappement sortait du volant, quel carburant choisiriez-vous
?
http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr
Forum de discussion sur les véhicules électriques
http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr/Forum/index.php
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
With assistance from Otmar a few years back, I have
been able to learn about how the Port a Watts 300
inverter (300 watts cont.) operates. Pretty much
every other (non true-sinewave type) inverter I've
taken apart in that time frame has been similar.
First thing that happens with this inverter is that it
boosts the approx. 12VDC to approx. 160V DC (using the
transformer you see when you open it up) using a
UC3525 chip. Then an H-Bridge of fets makes a 160V
p-p square wave on the output. What we did was remove
the 12VDC to 160VDC portion and replace it with a
rectifier and larger DC bus cap. This way we can feed
it 400 Hz AC (or 60 Hz AC in the lab) and generate 60
Hz AC to feed some water pumps and cooling fans for a
laser we operated on an aircraft. Maybe because of
all the hacking I did on the prototype, but it wasn't
very robust, and blew up at an unoppertune moment.
That, combined with I didn't provide enough spare
parts, we abandonded this...
The 556 timer that controls the fet H-Bridge has the
HV bus as an input, so I think it adjusts the fet
timing based on bus voltage. I think this means it
can compensate some for different bus voltages. This
box also had a thermistor on the transformer I
mentioned that I removed, and will shut down if that
gets too hot. It also shuts down if the 12V gets too
low, and if too much power is placed on the output.
It measures output power by the voltage accross a
current sense resistor, and low-pass filters this.
This allows for a peak transient to not shut the
inverter down. For how long of a peak depends upon
how large of a peak. It uses an LM324 quad op-amp for
the error detection. The only other IC is a CD4013
flip-flop for sequencing the fets.
Some of the larger inverters (such as the Port A Watts
600) are similar but with two input stages converting
12V to 160V.
Quite often Harbor Freight has some 1KW cont, 2KW peak
12VDC to 120VAC inverters on sale for less than $200.
I once carried a 1.5KW cont, 3KW peak inverter around
for an hour at a Homier Tent Sale ($69 if I remember
correctly), until I realized I only wanted to buy it
to take it appart and see how it worked. I've never
even powered up the 600W unit I bought years ago... so
I put it back.
If you are handy enough with electronics and
scrounging, you might consider similary modifing some
old UPSs with bad batteries. Be sure the UPS can turn
itself on without 60Hz being present, though. A lot
of them that I've played with won't.
Good luck, but most importantly, Have Fun!
- Steven Ciciora
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Hello All!
>
> I am working on a project and I need to ask for your
> input. I have a need for
> a 120VDC to 120VAC, 60 HZ Power Inverter at about
> 1500 Peak Watts. I am
> installing this into an EV for a test of sorts.
>
> Does anyone have a source for such an inverter?
>
> THANKS!
>
> David
>
> (Ratliffgrp AT AOL DOT COM)
>
>
>
> ************************************** AOL now
> offers free email to everyone.
> Find out more about what's free from AOL at
> http://www.aol.com.
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________________
Expecting? Get great news right away with email Auto-Check.
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Dear David
I can offer you a light weight semisquarewave inverter. Pl contact off list.
David Sharpe
----- Original Message -----
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Friday, March 23, 2007 8:59 AM
Subject: 120 VDC to 120VAC Inverter Source?
Hello All!
I am working on a project and I need to ask for your input. I have a need
for
a 120VDC to 120VAC, 60 HZ Power Inverter at about 1500 Peak Watts. I am
installing this into an EV for a test of sorts.
Does anyone have a source for such an inverter?
THANKS!
David
(Ratliffgrp AT AOL DOT COM)
************************************** AOL now offers free email to
everyone.
Find out more about what's free from AOL at http://www.aol.com.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Chip,
Sounds great. We are working hard to have "Juiced Up" ready for the
race. AGNuS is getting a voltage boost, a new controller, a street
front tire to replace the knobby, and will be ready to go. I going to
keep OJ2 in my hip pocket just in case.
Shawn
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thu, 22 Mar 2007 10:37 AM
Subject: 2007 Power of DC EV Racing Challenge
Hi Everyone,
The 2007 Power of DC will be June 2-3, 2007 in Hagerstown, Maryland
This year we are going all the way and will have an EV AutoCross,
ScooterCross, Range Rally, Show-n-Shine, and our classic NEDRA Power of
DC drag race all held in beautiful Western Maryland thanks to the
efforts of Mike Harvey and wife Tracy.
On Saturday June 2 is the AutoCross, ScooterCross, Range Rally and
Show-n-Shine. The AutoCross will be held at Hagerstown Community
College. Tracy has also layed out an 8.5 mile Range Rally Event held
near the campus.
Then on Sunday June 3 is our Classic NEDRA Power of DC Drag Race to be
held at Mason-Dixon Dragway.
There is no cost to enter the AutoCross and other EVents on Saturday,
however donations are appreciated. Cost to enter the drag strip on
Sunday is $25.00 which is the Mason-Dixon Dragway entry fee.
We are also going to have a Dinner and Reception. Trophies will be
awarded to the winners. We will have a raffle and Jim Husted is
donating one of his famous 6.7 inch motors.
For more information on this exciting EVent visit our website at
http://www.powerofdc.com
To Register, fill out our convenient Registration Form at
http://www.powerofdc.com/lets_race.html
A downloadable file of the EVent flyer is available at
http://www.powerofdc.com/powerofdc_flyer.pdf
We are also looking for sponsorship so if you are interested just let
us know. Thanks to ThunderStruck Motors for signing on as a sponsor.
See ya in June!!
Chip Gribben
Power of DC
http://www.powerofdc.com
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
240-687-1678
Mike Harvey
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Joe Lado
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
________________________________________________________________________
AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free
from AOL at AOL.com.
=0
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Nikki wrote:
***********************************
I could go for the Optima type 31A (YT S 5.5) (http://
www.optimabatteries.com/publish/optima/europe/en/config/product_info/
commercial/deep_cycle/technical_specs.html)
- which has a 75AH capacity at the 20 Hour rate, a stupidly low
internal resistance, no maintenance and a weight at about 4kgs less
than the alternative - http://www.trojan-battery.com/Products/
ProductSpec.aspx?Name=30XHS - Trojan 30HXS.
I could also (apparently also recommended) go for the http://
www.trojan-battery.com/Products/ProductSpec.aspx?Name=SCS225 Trojan
SC S225.
I'm completely out of my league and in two minds what to do. The
Trojans have a much higher 20 and 5 hour rates than the Yellow Top -
but the Yellow Tops are maintenance free - and lighter. For a car
which (with me onboard) weighs about 370 kgs in total I'm guessing
that saving 12 kgs of weight would make a big difference.
************************************
Hi Nikki,
I'm behind on my list reading again, but I've so far seen no responses
to your post that address a critical question you've missed.
The City El is a very light and narrow 3-wheeler. It depends on its
battery weight for its stability in turns. Because it's so light and
narrow, a seemingly small change in the weight and/or placement of its
batteries can have a surprisingly dramatic effect on its tendency to
tip over in a turn.
Do not get creative here without doing some math. Your first step is
to determine your current total weight and center of gravity in three
dimensions. (Driver included - the driver is a substantial proportion
of the total in this tiny vehicle.) If you're not comfortable with
how to do that, don't deviate much from your current weight
distribution and total weight.
Personally, if I were contemplating what you are without calculations,
I would try to add a moderate amount of weight and place it low and
rearward (the end supported by two wheels)
Chris
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--- Begin Message ---
Ted> I have a 1981 Ford Escort with 20 US 2000 batteries installed...
Ted> The schocks still work properly and it does not bottom out when
Ted> going over a bump.
What's the car's GVWR? How much does it weigh? A quick google check turned
up this page:
http://www.austinev.org/evinfo/build/eva-selectingavehicle.html
Which lists the curb weight of the ICE-motivated Escort (no year specified)
as 2300 lbs and the projected weight when EV-converted as 3457 lbs. If true
that seems kind of heavy. I couldn't find a payload spec for the Escort,
but I can't imagine it would be a half ton.
--
Skip Montanaro - [EMAIL PROTECTED] - http://www.webfast.com/~skip/
"The hippies and the hipsters did some great stuff in the sixties,
but the geeks pulled their weight too." -- Billy Bragg
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On 3/22/07, bruce parmenter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
EVLN(UK Hybrid double-decker bus launched)
The hybrid vehicle, which runs on diesel and electricity, will
produce 40% less carbon dioxide (CO2) emissions than regular
buses.
Mayor Ken Livingstone called for manufacturers to make hybrid
buses more financially feasible to speed up their introduction
across London.
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/corporate/media/newscentre/4552.aspx
Hah! I sent Transport for Longon an email in 2003 (or so) when they
were starting to phase out the old double-deckers (on the grounds of
pollution and reliability), and suggested that they have them
converted to diesel-electric hybrid.
I got a reply which said that they wouldn't be doing this as it
wouldn't solve the problem of their lack of disabled access.
And now Ken has pinched my idea and not given me any credit for it.. typical! :)
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Any idea where I can get a couple of thoe Hawker Genesis batteries for less
than my arm? Maybe just a finger? Batteries seem REALLY expensive right now.
Especially when you only need 4 of them.
--
Martin K
On 3/22/07, John Wayland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Hello to All,
Man....so close, yet still so far, those elusive elevens! By now, thanks
to Rod's play by play reports, everyone knows what happened. It's
starting to sound like a broken record...or is that 'the record that
wasn't broken'?
..
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Hello :)
I have one from Exeltech. I have it hooked up to 120VDC and get 1000W
continuous, haven't tried peek yet as I blew my inline 10A fuse. But it
works well with a 800W heater.
mm.
> Hello All!
>
> I am working on a project and I need to ask for your input. I have a need
> for
> a 120VDC to 120VAC, 60 HZ Power Inverter at about 1500 Peak Watts. I am
> installing this into an EV for a test of sorts.
>
> Does anyone have a source for such an inverter?
>
> THANKS!
>
> David
>
> (Ratliffgrp AT AOL DOT COM)
>
>
>
> ************************************** AOL now offers free email to
> everyone.
> Find out more about what's free from AOL at http://www.aol.com.
>
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The newer motorcycles typically use catalytic converters so emission standards
for bikes have progressed. The issue with this approach would probably be
cost/availability. I'd agree with the suggestions to either stick with an ICE
or go pure EV using the money for better batteries/BMS.
----- Original Message ----
From: Peter VanDerWal <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Sent: Thursday, March 22, 2007 7:51:16 PM
Subject: RE: charging while driving question
> I have heard about the pollution issue of generator engines. What about
> using a small motorcycle engine? I know that 2-stroke motorcycles pollute
> more than 4-stroke, but how does the 4-stroke compare to standard
> automobile engines, and the generator? And can you do much to reduce it?
>
Newer motorcycle engines are better than lawmower engines, but nowhere
near newer automobile engines. The emmision requirements for on road
motorcycles is pretty basic and, last I checked, off-road bikes have no
requirements.
--
If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has > 4 lines of legalistic
junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I
wish with the message. By posting the message you agree that your long
legalistic signature is void.
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For an F-250, I would look at this motor. Considerably lighter.
Sounds like a good candidate for a conversion of something like, oh...
maybe an F-250 ?
--
Stay Charged!
Hump
I-5, Blossvale NY
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of John G. Lussmyer
> Sent: Wednesday, March 21, 2007 12:53 PM
> To: EV Discussion List
> Subject: Big Honking Motor
>
> I was over at a friends house, where he has accumulated LOTS of junk
> over the years.
> He has an electric motor sitting there that is rated at 60HP
> continuous, 500VDC. BIG thing.
> So, anyone want to make an electric bus? He'll sell it really cheap...
> :-)
>
_________________________________________________________________
Watch free concerts with Pink, Rod Stewart, Oasis and more. Visit MSN
Presents today.
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You can also try www.conrardyco.com talk to Jim
-Rick
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of MIKE WILLMON
Sent: Thursday, March 22, 2007 5:07 PM
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Re: 120 VDC to 120VAC Inverter Source?
http://www.railway-technology.com/contractors/electrification/schaffler/
----- Original Message -----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Thursday, March 22, 2007 2:00 pm
Subject: 120 VDC to 120VAC Inverter Source?
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
> Hello All!
>
> I am working on a project and I need to ask for your input. I have
> a need for
> a 120VDC to 120VAC, 60 HZ Power Inverter at about 1500 Peak Watts.
> I am
> installing this into an EV for a test of sorts.
>
> Does anyone have a source for such an inverter?
>
> THANKS!
>
> David
>
> (Ratliffgrp AT AOL DOT COM)
>
>
>
> ************************************** AOL now offers free email
> to everyone.
> Find out more about what's free from AOL at http://www.aol.com.
>
>
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I have been searching through the archives and on the internet about
using Prius battery packs instead of the traditional lead acid
batteries. I have only seen one person so far that has done that. Is
there a problem using that type of battery?
Thanks
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Went to water my batteries this morning, and found a real mess:
http://www4.ncsu.edu/~dmott/MeltedBattery2.jpg
http://www4.ncsu.edu/~dmott/MeltedBattery1.jpg
Car details: http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/1020
Batteries are Trojan T125's, I believe about 7-8 months old. I've been
driving it about 3 months. This battery actually reads 6.47V measured from
the terminals of its adjacent batteries, but I know that's at best an
intermittant situation. The car has been running fine, in fact I was just
feeling like I was getting the hang of things. And a *serious* bummer to be
off the road in prime convertible weather :-( Here's a start on the many
questions I have:
1. How do I safely clean up this mess of lead?
2. Is this battery toast, or can/should it be repaired?
3. How could this have happened?
4. How can I prevent it from happening again?
5. Could any of the other batteries be damaged by this incident?
6. Could this have started a fire inside the battery box?
thanks very much - De
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Is this thing on?
Roger.
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I am currently fabricating a hydraulic crimper for my battery cables and am
in need of the size in mm or inch for the hex jaws for 4/0 cable. (2/0
would also be good to know)
The plan is to machine a set of jaws that will hold regular sockets that are
cut in half and welded in. I already have most of it done but would like to
avoid wasting time trying different sizes.
Info appreciated!
Mark Ward
95 Saab 900SE "Saabrina"
www.saabrina.blogspot.com
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Barry,
There is a (public) charger list - IIRC the Oakland station has
a public charging point, the charger list will tell you if it
has the type that you can plug into:
Another option is that you check at your actual destination
if they have outlets where you can plug into. Either outlets
on the outside of the building, for vending machines or maintenance,
or other ways to plug in.
Since you stay there the entire day, you can accept that the charging
takes many hours.
Even from a 110V outlet you can charge at up to 1.5 kW if it is not
loaded with other consumers.
During an 8 hour day this gives you 12kWh recharge, which should be
plenty to cover 20 miles one-way (return trip) even when you use
a heavy 'light truck'.
With an EV-optimized small sedan (think CRX style) you should be
able to get under 250 Wh per mile, so you would be able to do a
round-trip from that amount of energy if you are driving carefully.
Hope this helps,
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Second Life: www.secondlife.com/?u=3b42cb3f4ae249319edb487991c30acb
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Barry C.
Sent: Thursday, March 22, 2007 1:59 PM
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Re: A few newbie questions.
--- "Barry C." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > I am wanting to build a EV ... Able to run 65-70mph. 35-50mi.
> > carry 2 adults, 2 children for around the town errands on occasion.
> > This is doable?
>
>No, not practically. If you can cut either the speed or the range in
>half, it could be. If you can recharge at the halfway point of the
>35-50 miles, it counts as cutting the range in half. But if you're
>really putting on that many miles in a day, expect to replace your pack
>frequently.
I have been reading and searching trying to find a donor car that I will be
able to create that would get these results. I have been reading that the
EV's can achieve these speeds. Is it just that they can't sustain them very
long? My commute from Hayward to Oakland is about 20mi round trip. I most
likely would not have the ability to charge half way unless the public
garage by the Oakland city center has charging stations of some sort.
> > Right now I was looking at a Ford escort wagon
>
...
> > Trojan T145 6V batteries. (144V 24 batteries)
>
>Not in an Escort. It could never hold that much weight, at least not
>safely.
Any recommendations... I have looked at Toyota Tercel's, Geo metro's, small
trucks.....
One thing is I am capable of beefing up the suspension.
Thanks for your help.
>Mark "EV Basher" Brueggemann
>Albuquerque, NM
>S-10 EV
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I didn't go as far as you do Roland, but I did run the motor a bit and checked
resistances, as well as, checking brush leads like Jim suggested.
thanks for your ideas
----- Original Message ----
From: Roland Wiench <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Sent: Thursday, March 22, 2007 10:32:03 AM
Subject: Re: new DC series motor run-in?
Hello Frank,
This is one of the running test that is normally done with some motors that
the motor factory may not do. My GE 11 motor was tested for a week before I
received and ran the motor for 36 years before a weak spot in the field
winding parted.
GE the same shop that made my modified motor is now running these test now.
I use a Warp 9 motor as a temporary replacement, I can see that the brushes
were not fully seated or completely full contact curve. Also the face of
the commentator down to the main motor shaft was not insulated, which is
best to do to keep brush dust from tracking from the commentator to the
motor shaft which is chassis ground.
Before I do a running test to break in the brushes, do a ohm meter reading
of the field circuits, commentator circuits, field windings to motor case,
and commentator circuits to motor case.
While testing the ohm values of the commentator, also rotate the motor shaft
by hand. Record all results in a note book for future reference.
My resistance values when the motor was new, was over 20 megohms to ground
and after 10 years it decrease to 50 kohms, which was cause by brush dust
tracking to from the commentator to motor frame. About every 10 years, I
normally break down the motor, clean, tested, and had it re-enmal by a motor
shop, install a new set of brushes, did a low voltage running test using a
commentator stone that you can get from a motor shop.
This time, I had the whole inside of the surface of the motor case painted
with white high gloss epoxy paint and had the motor shop enamel the front of
the commentator down to the motor shaft and up to the motor bearing
surfaces.
For a break in running test, it is best to get the following items and
assemble it as testing kit:
A container to hold a 12 volt meter and about 60 amp meter. I use a clear
plastic box with snap locking type cover.
A auto type 12 volt meter and amp meter. About $15.00 for the pair.
A 500 amp battery cut off switch, the one with the big red flag sw.
A 50 amp fuse with holder or a 50 amp auto circuit breaker.
A pair of alligator clips for connecting onto a 12 volt battery.
Two wire terminal ends to connected to the motor.
Two lengths of No. 10 AWG wire, one red for the positive and one black for
the negative.
The red wire connects to the positive of the battery, goes through the fuse,
tap off small positive line to one side of the voltmeter and through the
disconnect switch, through the amp meter and than to the motor.
The black wire can go right to the motor. The is a small tap off the black
negative wire with a smaller wire to run to the voltmeter.
If the motor is not install in the EV, make sure you clamp it down into a
frame to hold the motor case from rotating. I use a wood frame that is also
a dolly, so I can roll it under the vehicle for installing.
After the battery and motor is connected up to this test unit, you will see
the battery volt reading on your volt meter. Record this voltage for a
timed reference. Now close the battery disconnect switch for just a second
to see if your motor is turning the correct way. If not than interchange
one of the A1 or A2 with the one of the field connections.
Turn on the battery disconnect switch and you will see a ampere reading
surge during startup and then it should float down for a running ampere.
Record the ampere for future reference.
Visual check the brushes and commentator while the motor is running. If
there is slight arcing, this may be normal until the brushes have form a
complete shape to the commentator so each segment forms a better make before
you break between each commentator segment.
If you hear a clicking sound, this may be one of the commentator segments
being a little higher or the brushes are position in the wrong direction for
the rotation. My brushes in my GE-11 are angle at 15 degrees so the sharp
edge of the brushes are moving away from from the surface of the
commentator.
If you motor and brushes are set for a CW rotation, you should never rotate
the motor in CCW rotation or you may chip the edges of these brushes.
If you do have some clicking noise, than use a commentator stone on the
commentator while the motor is rotating. A motor shop can supply you with
the right type of grit stone for this commentator.
Stone the commentator for about 5 minutes with a light touch moving back and
forth on the commentator. Continue to run the motor on 12 volts. Watch the
12 volt battery voltage and when the voltage is down to about 10.5 volt,
than you may need to charge it again. This is where I use a small digital
timer, to see how long it takes to discharge the battery to 10.5 volts.
I ran my Warp 9 for 8 hours and after timing the voltage drop of the
battery, I could leave and come back before the battery goes below 10.5
volts. The running ampere on my motor is about 26 amps, so my 10 amp
battery charger was too small. I am now using a 40 amp smart charger, so
the charger provided the voltage, while it was connect to the battery to
make it work.
If you have a DC-DC converter in the 40 amp range that can either work off
120 VAC or battery pack of 90 to 200 volts, that does not a battery to
provide the voltage, this will work too.
After about 6 to 8 hours of running, check the curved of the brushes to see
if they are about fully curved. The commentator should have a dark tan
color or some times call less brown color, do not sand this color off to
make it a nice bright color. The graphite of the brushes fill in the rough
surface of the commentator, so it becomes a more conductive surface.
If the commentator has a very dark color, than the commentator surface was
very rough and not smooth which received more brush compound. My GE
commentator is MICRO MIRROR to a bright mirror reflection. After 10 years
of running my very hard tool steel type of graphite silver brushes only worn
less than 1/2 way down.
If you ever replace the brushes in the future, make sure you replace them
with the same type and hardness that they are design for this commentator in
that motor. For some motors, you can get different types of brushes that
are very soft to some times that are hard as tool steel that may last over
10 years.
Roland
----- Original Message -----
From: "Frank John" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Thursday, March 22, 2007 6:56 AM
Subject: new DC series motor run-in?
> Are there any recommendations for running-in a new ADC 9" motor? I seem
> to remember someone mentioning spinning over at lower voltage to wear-in
> the brushes? Would appreciate any advice.
>
> TIA
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ____________________________________________________________________________________
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>
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