The mid-range (260 miles) Model 3 is indeed available, but it is $45,000. They count on the $7,500 federal tax break and state incentives to make it a $35,000 car. The long range Model 3 can currently be bought for about $49,000 with federal and state incentives then reducing that price. As I am retired with little earned income the $7,500 federal tax credit is of no value. I'll still wait for the $35,000 car. BobK
On Oct 22, 2018 12:59 PM, "paul dove via EV" <ev@lists.evdl.org> wrote: Last time I checked the midrange model 3 was available for order Sent from my iPhone > On Oct 22, 2018, at 9:47 AM, Bobby Keeland via EV <ev@lists.evdl.org> wrote: > > My wife and I are on the waiting list for a 220 mile range Model 3. We > don't need the 310 mile range or the high performance. > > When we travel it is usually by motorhome. I've thought about towing the EV > on a trailer that is covered with solar panels. A recharge while boon > docking would be no problem. > BobK > > On Mon, Oct 22, 2018, 8:41 AM Robert Bruninga via EV <ev@lists.evdl.org> > wrote: > >> ALL EV's are predominantly charged while parked. Solar panels on EV's are >> not for propulsion power but for battery charging during the 8 to 16 hour >> solar day while parked in the sun, not just the 30 minutes the car is in >> use. This is for those without a dedicated charger at home. >> >> Bob >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: EV <ev-boun...@lists.evdl.org> On Behalf Of Alan Arrison via EV >> Sent: Sunday, October 21, 2018 7:26 PM >> To: ev@lists.evdl.org >> Cc: Alan Arrison <bigg...@comcast.net> >> Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: The physics of slapping solar panels on cars >> >> The numbers don't add up for solar panels on automobiles, never have, never >> will. >> >> This has been proven time and time again. >> >> There is no way it gets even 20 miles per kWh under anything but perfect >> conditions and slow speeds. >> >> And the energy from the panels again is under perfect conditions. >> >> It is so light because it has almost no crash protection. >> >> Al >> >> >> >>> On 10/21/2018 3:09 PM, Larry Gales via EV wrote: >>> When I look at the Stella Lux and Stella Vie, I get very different >>> results from the negative views of solar powered cars. I start with >>> the assumption that the Dutch students who have won most of the solar >>> car records are not actually lying. So, the specs for the 4 passenger >>> Stella Lux include these: >>> >>> >>> >>> Length >>> >>> 178 inches >>> >>> Width >>> >>> 69 inches >>> >>> Height >>> >>> 44 inches >>> >>> Weight >>> >>> 826 pounds >>> >>> Battery Capacity >>> >>> 15 kWh >>> >>> Motor Efficiency >>> >>> 97 percent >>> >>> Range on sunny day (Netherlands) >>> >>> 621 miles >>> >>> Range on sunny day (Australia) >>> >>> 683 miles >>> >>> Range at night (on battery) >>> >>> 403 miles >>> >>> Top Speed >>> >>> 77 mph >>> >>> >>> >>> So, if the range at night is 403 miles and the battery is 15 kWh, that >>> translates to 26.8 miles/kWh. Let us suppose that is under ideal >>> conditions, and that a more realistic value is 20 miles/kWh. The >>> solar PV array is 1.5 kW, so a more realistic value under real world >>> conditions is >>> 0.75 kW. In Seattle, where I live, which has about the worst solar >>> potential in the USA, the average solar intensity in July is 6.3 sun >>> hours. >>> So, (0.75 * 6.3 * 20) = 94.5 miles. If we usually travel only 40 >>> miles/day, I could easily see traveling 200 miles on accumulated solar >>> energy, after, say, a week of 40 miles/day travel. And given that 5 >>> months/year we average over 60% of the July values we can travel about >>> 60 miles/day just on stored sunlight from the car. And the 5 >>> passenger Stella Vie is just as efficient. >>> >>> On Sun, Oct 21, 2018 at 12:09 AM brucedp5 via EV <ev@lists.evdl.org> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> >>>> https://qz.com/1423288/why-dont-we-have-solar-powered-cars-physics/ >>>> The physics of why we don’t have solar-powered cars October 15, 2018 >>>> Michael J. Coren >>>> >>>> [image >>>> https://cms.qz.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/10/image1-e1539387897807.p >>>> ng >>>> The Sono Motors Car >>>> ] >>>> >>>> The nuclear furnace at the center of solar system powers almost >>>> everything on earth. Photosynthesis, wind, and even fossil fuels >>>> (once decomposed living matter) all derive in some way from the star we >>>> call the Sun. >>>> >>>> So why isn’t it enough to power our cars? >>>> >>>> It’s all about energy density: how much energy falls on a surface >>>> relative to how much is consumed. We can have solar powered e-bikes >>>> that cover thousands of miles, sailboat drones that cross oceans, >>>> even ultra-light aircraft that circumnavigate the globe. What do they >>>> have in common? >>>> They’re >>>> all very light, slow, and consume a trickle of electrons. Solar >>>> panels generate just enough electricity to keep them moving. >>>> >>>> For anything weighing thousands of pounds, like a car, the energy >>>> equation is daunting. A few intrepid carmakers are slapping solar >>>> panels on their vehicles anyway. Few have gotten very far. The German >>>> startup Sono Motors is adding 330 integrated solar cells on the roof, >>>> sides, and rear to give its vehicle a 30-km boost out of a 250-km >>>> (155-mile) battery range. Meanwhile, Dutch startup behind >>>> LightyearOne claims its electric car will “charge itself.” Although >>>> it has yet to unveil a vehicle, potential customers can put down >>>> deposits for a €119.000 ($157,000) car promising to travel 10,000 to >>>> 20,000 km per year (6,200 to 12,400 miles) on its solar panels alone. >>>> >>>> The Sono Motors Car >>>> >>>> Will it work? Don’t bet on it, says Jeremy Michalek, a professor of >>>> mechanical engineering at Carnegie Mellon University and director of >>>> its Vehicle Electrification Group. >>>> >>>> Quartz asked Michalek to estimate how far the best solar panels could >>>> propel a typical electric car on the market. He broke down the math >>>> for us. >>>> >>>> Michalek says about 1 kilowatt (kW) of solar energy falls on a square >>>> meter of the Earth’s surface on a clear day. That’s all the solar >>>> energy available to collect. For a company like Sono, which says it >>>> can convert about a quarter of that energy into electricity (although >>>> that’s very optimistic), a full site of panels might generate roughly >>>> 8 kilowatt hours of energy per day (a best-case scenario with four >>>> square meters of solar panels). >>>> >>>> Michalek says that’s enough to drive a car like the comparable Nissan >>>> Leaf about 25 miles. But there are many reasons (clouds, poor panel >>>> positioning, dirt), this number will rarely be reached. As for >>>> LightyearOne and its claims that you’ll never need to charge your car >>>> in the future? The odds are tough. The maximum conversion rate for >>>> cheap silicon cells to turn sunlight into electricity is just under >>>> 33%, and more exotic materials that achieve 44% efficiency are far >>>> too expensive for mass production. Without a revolutionary >>>> breakthough in solar panel technology, cars that can recharge >>>> themselves with the sun alone remain fantastical. >>>> >>>> Does that mean putting solar panels on cars is always a bad idea? >>>> Maybe not. >>>> A sunny day can tack on enough miles to cover the average US commute. >>>> But Michalek says that’s an expensive way to extend the car’s range. >>>> Anyone with a charging outlet can get renewable energy from the wall >>>> for a lot less. >>>> Sign up for the Quartz Daily Brief email Stay updated about Quartz >>>> products and events. >>>> [© qz.com] >>>> >>>> >>>> + >>>> >>>> https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/tech-news/driverless-car-hype-gives-way- >>>> e-scooter-mania-among-technorati-n919706 >>>> Driverless car hype gives way to e-scooter mania among technorati >>>> Oct. 13, 2018 Driverless car hype gives way to e-scooter mania among >>>> technorati ... In a matter of months, electric scooter startups have >>>> gone from tech oddity to global ... Millions of dollars in funding >>>> and billions of dollars in valuations have made scooters the next big >>>> thing since the last big thing ... >>>> >>>> https://media3.s-nbcnews.com/j/newscms/2018_28/2491731/180709-bird-sc >>>> ooter-san-francisco-njs-1541_0d7cd3431408077aac647d098c7ba8a7.fit-124 >>>> 0w.jpg >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> For EVLN EV-newswire posts use: >>>> http://evdl.org/archive/ >>>> >>>> >>>> {brucedp.neocities.org} >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Sent from: >>>> http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/ >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub >>>> http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org >>>> Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA ( >>>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) >>>> >>>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub >> http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org >> Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA ( >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) >> _______________________________________________ >> UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub >> http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org >> Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA ( >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) >> >> > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: < http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20181022/b5138008/attachment.html > > _______________________________________________ > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA ( http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) > _______________________________________________ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... 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