Nazism took it somewhere much darker, but Fascism already was exulting the fever pitch of ethno-nationalism.
Fascism may have become a generic word we use now a days for that kind of totalitarianism, but in its time and in history, time after time, fascist regimes and parties have always exulted in ethno-fetishism and have promoted an us versus them Manichean world view. In each country where Fascism has arisen it has been characterized by pronounced nationalism most often framed and presented in ethnic terms. Nazism clearly took this notion and ran with Aryan Supremacism, but all the other Fascists then: Mussolini, Franco, and yes Jabotinsky as well (because he was a Fascist) they all saw themselves as leaders of ethnically rooted nationalist movements. In fact show me a famous fascist who was not also a virulent ethno-nationalist. Fascism unlike Communism (at the level of lip service at least) never preached a Universal Fascist state – an 1000 year Reich of one tribe over other inferior races maybe, but that idea lacks universal appeal. Communists sang Internationale as expressed in a line from the lyrics in English: “There simply IS a ruling class, and there is a working class. One day the majority must triumph over the oppression and terror of the minority.” They clearly framed their struggle as an international class struggle. Their slogan was workers unite… or as expressed in the Chilean protest song against Allende “El pueblo unido jamás será vencido” Fascism instead has always been nationalist (as opposed to internationalist) and framed in terms of ethnic and cultural chauvinism… so if there is a difference between Hitler and Nazism and the other fascist Parties and personalities it is a matter of degree and not of substance. -Chris From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of meekerdb Sent: Thursday, August 22, 2013 5:51 PM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood There's a lot of difference between admiring Fascism and admiring Nazism. Fascism was the idea that a nation was a kind of super-organism consisting of people in different stations of life working together to achieve collective goals. It's not a philosophy of government I like, but it's not crazy either. It's roughly the way army's work. Nazism added superstitious beliefs in "blut und volk" and a virulent hatred of Jews and Roma as responsible for degeneration of a mythical Aryan culture. It adopted genocide as the policy for solving "the Jewish question." Brent On 8/22/2013 9:36 AM, Chris de Morsella wrote: Jabotinsky, who is one of the most important historical figures of the development of Zionism in Israel was a great and open admirer of Mussolini and of the fascist ideology. Fascism – during that period of history was seen as a futurist/modern ideology and was admired by many including many Americans of the time. Does this mean Zionism and all modern Zionists love fascism – a fair number of them seem to Lieberman for example – but I hope you see how it is not fair to use Jabotinski’s great admiration for fascism and for Mussolini to characterize modern Zionism. His affinity for fascism certainly probably influenced his development of the Iron Wall ideology of Zionism (read about it) so it has certainly shown up, especially amongst his ideological heirs in the Likud Party, but one cannot therefore characterize all Israeli’s and even more all Jews as being therefore suspect of being fascists. That kind of idiocy would be shot down straight away; why is the same kind of false parallelism not shot down when the subject comes around to Muslims? Why the double standard? Hope this illustration helps you understand how problematic it is to put, the peculiar affinities (for our way of looking at things) of historical figures into a modern context and use their ancient statements and beliefs to characterize whatever the movement or ideology, they had a part in founding, has evolved over the course of history since their times. -Chris From: everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of spudboy...@aol.com Sent: Thursday, August 22, 2013 5:49 AM To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood The Al Bana brothers who essentially started up the MB, as opposed to similar movements, like Abu Salafia. They started the MB formally in 1928, and liked Mussolini's fascists (everybody did back then!) and followed forward in their love of Adolf when he achieved state power. Alberto is correct about the Baathists in Syria and Iraq, and many Muslim writers compare (favorably) Mein Kampf (struggle) with the commands to perform Jihad (struggle) against the Qfar (infidels). These writers and jurists see it as the same, sad to say. Christopher Hitchens (the atheist) and his friends got in a fight with members of the Syrian Nazi Party (part of Assad's coalition), and now Dawkins is actually comparing the Jihadist actions to the Reich (bully for Dawkins waking up). Cheers for Alberto's post as well. Mitch -----Original Message----- From: Alberto G. Corona <agocor...@gmail.com> To: everything-list <everything-list@googlegroups.com> Sent: Wed, Aug 21, 2013 7:02 pm Subject: Re: The Nazi History of the Muslim Brotherhood Just follow the tv of muslim countries, and specially, the political debates. Google: hitler arab countries television It can not be otherwhise since te nazis and the muslims share the same main goal. you know. Abu Mazen, the leader of the PLO after Yasif Arafat wrote its doctoral thesis at the university about denial of the Holocaust. The Baaz party that ruled Iraq and Siria are inspired directly by the Nazi party. There are hundred of examples of continuous praise of hitler or hitler-inspired ideas in the musling world. If you search, you can find a lot of nazi flags waved by muslim fundamentalists. even on the top of mesquites 2013/8/21 meekerdb <meeke...@verizon.net> On 8/21/2013 11:48 AM, Alberto G. Corona wrote: That Hitler is the most respected western figure in the muslim word is a fact. What is the evidence for this? Are there polls? Brent -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. 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