On 09 May 2017, at 01:10, Bruce Kellett wrote:
On 8/05/2017 8:59 pm, Bruno Marchal wrote:
On 08 May 2017, at 07:01, Bruce Kellett wrote:
On 8/05/2017 2:45 pm, spudboy100 via Everything List wrote:
Rather than use the Boltzmann Brain hypothesis to elucidate the
conservation of energy in thermodynamics and entropy, why not
take Boltzmann a bit more seriously, and search for these suckers
in the galaxy, in other words, treat, as a working hypothesis
BB's as real phenomena? There's nobody out there that is sending
easy to listen to, signals. Maybe the BB's are probing people's
butts as a prank, by pretending they are UFO's? Hardee Har Har!
I think that, given a physical universe, Boltzmann brains are
highly unlikely. The reasons are essentially those elucidated by
Sean Carroll, http://arxiv.org/abs/1405.0298v1 . Namely de Sitter
space is a quiescent vacuum in which there are no quantum
fluctuations of the sort hypothesized to give rise to Boltzmann
brains. The problem is that David (and Bruno) cannot appeal to
such an argument, because Carroll presupposes a physical universe,
and they can't do that on pain of circularity.
Well said.
They need something
Who are "they"?
Carroll, Boltzman, the physicists using mechanism.
like von Neuman-Wigner-Penrose action of consciousness on matter/
quantum-wave. Even Hameroff's view could'nt help. Only some
explicit non-mechanism could save Carroll argument.
What feature of Carroll's argument needs saving?
To be able to choose a type of physics (like de sitter space) in which
the quantum vaccuum is not rich enough to generate the UD or the BBs.
This can be saves if the "de Sitter space" could be justified from the
material hypostases. So Carroll works could be helpful in the future,
if we could derive the de Sitter space itself from the material povs
of the universal machine.
Bruno
Bruce
QM-with-collapse-made-by consciousness is a good candidate, but of
course, if successful, it would made the mechanist out of job. But
today, this seems premature to me. We don'thave any evidence, but
if the Z1* and X1* (and S4Grz1) logics depart too much from nature,
we would have some evidence for it.
Bruno
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