On Monday, March 11, 2019 at 8:04:57 PM UTC-6, Bruce wrote: > > On Tue, Mar 12, 2019 at 12:43 PM John Clark <johnk...@gmail.com > <javascript:>> wrote: > >> On Mon, Mar 11, 2019 at 8:42 PM Lawrence Crowell < >> goldenfield...@gmail.com <javascript:>> wrote: >> >> > all the radiation emitted is entangled with the black hole, which >>> would then mean the entanglement entropy increases beyond the Bekenstein >>> bound. >> >> >> >> Could nature be trying to tell us that the Bekenstein bound is simply >> wrong and spacetime is contentious and can store information at scales >> even smaller than the Planck area? After all as far as I know there is no >> experimental evidence the Bekenstein bound exists or that spacetime ends >> when things get smaller than 10^-35 meters. >> > > Points that I have made many times, here and elsewhere. No one is > listening, it would appear. Actually, though, Penrose has worked this out > for himself. See "Roads to Reality". > > Bruce >
I have of course read Penrose's *Roads to Reality*. Towards the end he makes a pitch for his R-process that he introduced in the 1980s and made a central feature of his *Emperor's New Mind*. The problem is that it is most likely a sort of semi-classical phenomenology or effective theory. It is a result of ignoring how spacetime and quantum fields transform by the same rules. Sure if you do that you will get the R-process, or the previous idea of the super $-matrix by Hawking. Quantum information is fundamentally unitless, and this as a result is probably the best quantity to focus on as fundamental. Issues of the Planck scale, mass units and even the scale invariant breaking of inflation are challenges, for if quantum information is unitless it should then be absolutely conformal. So questions are open. Penrose just throws in the towel and says this violation just happens. There is no proof against this, but in spite of Hossenfelder's admonition against invoking beauty I find the R-process to be less than elegant and if nature were fundamentally this way, rather than as some effective theory, it would be rather disappointing. LC > > John K Clark >> > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
