Ah! Much thanks.
-----Original Message----- From: 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List <everything-list@googlegroups.com> To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Wed, Jan 20, 2021 7:38 pm Subject: Re: Evolution 2.0 Prize - $10 million Read Nick Lane's book, "The Vital Question" and listen to his address to the Royal Society. It's online. Brent On 1/20/2021 3:52 PM, spudboy100 via Everything List wrote: For Chemistry, specifically biochemistry, we still cannot after 70 years(?) go beyond the Stanley Miller-Harold Urey experiment to see if the can run a chemical process that starts with elements and leads to even simple life. I am not asserting religion here, but what have we missed? This is worse than nuclear fusion's time-lag, or Waiting for Godot. -----Original Message----- From: smitra <smi...@zonnet.nl> To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Wed, Jan 20, 2021 12:32 am Subject: Re: Evolution 2.0 Prize - $10 million That's an interesting paper! Note that the theoretical physicist Paul Davies is the one who took the initiative to set up this prize and he is strong skeptic against all current approaches in prebiotic chemistry. I've read the work of his research group (Paul Davies and Sara Walker), their no-go arguments are quite strong, but they don't propose solutions that I find all that attractive. That led me to do my own work in this field. Saibal On 19-01-2021 18:01, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote: > I do not know if you have seen this paper: > > Molecular Codes in Biological and Chemical Reaction Networks > https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0054694 > > They claim that in random chemical networks one can find some semantic: > > "High semantic capacity was found in the studied biochemical systems > and in random reaction networks where the number of second order > reactions is twice the number of species." > > I guess that they should apply for the prize. > > Evgeny > > Am 19.01.2021 um 00:58 schrieb smitra: >> On 18-01-2021 18:03, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote: >>> Am 18.01.2021 um 01:01 schrieb Lawrence Crowell: >>>> There are molecules that already do this. DNA and polypeptides are >>>> sequences that are in effect codes. >>> >>> Yes, this is exactly the point by the prize. The question is to show >>> how something like this could happen spontaneously. >>> >>> Evgeny >>> >> >> It requires violating local thermodynamic equilibrium. I'm working on >> an article and a few presentations for upcoming conferences where I >> explain this in detail. This then proves that none of the current >> models for prebiotic chemistry can explain the origin of life. A >> viable scenario is to get to a large random organic structure forged >> in an interstellar ice grain, where organic molecules at low >> temperatures under UV irradiation will only interact with nearest >> neighbors. Thermodynamic equilibrium is never reached, the system >> moves farther and farther away from this as the reactions under UV >> radiation continue. This way one gets to large so-called percolation >> clusters of organic molecules that have a random structure. >> >> Such random organic structures look totally useless to explain the >> origin of life, because what you want are the very specific molecules >> that are involved in the biochemical processes in living organisms. >> However, the structure of these random organic molecules is such that >> it has interior structures with compartments containing large random >> polymers and random interior surface structures. These can then serve >> as micro-environments within which prebiotic chemistry under normal >> local thermodynamic equilibrium conditions can work. With a finite >> number of N structures in a compartment one will break symmetries such >> as chiral symmetry at a level of 1/sqrt(N). Small molecules can escape >> the compartments via pores in the random structure while large >> molecules get trapped inside. >> >> Saibal >> >> >>> >>>> LC >>>> >>>> On Monday, January 4, 2021 at 12:28:18 PM UTC-6 use...@rudnyi.ru >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> "How do you get from chemicals to code? How do you get a code >>>>> without >>>>> designing one?" >>>>> >>>>> "What You Must Do to Win The Prize >>>>> >>>>> You must arrange for a digital communication system to emerge or >>>>> self-evolve without "cheating." The diagram below describes the >>>>> system. >>>>> Without explicitly designing the system, your experiment must >>>>> generate >>>>> an encoder that sends digital code to a decoder. Your system needs >>>>> to >>>>> transmit at least five bits of information. (In other words it has >>>>> to be >>>>> able to represent 32 states. The genetic code supports 64.) " >>>>> >>>>> https://www.herox.com/evolution2.0 >>>>> >>>> >> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visithttps://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/4f5386b035f1970dece5c3151f25c2f6%40zonnet.nl. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/1915006299.3754755.1611186728354%40mail.yahoo.com. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. 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