On 2/13/2025 10:17 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote:
Le ven. 14 févr. 2025, 06:13, Brent Meeker <[email protected]> a écrit :On 2/13/2025 4:57 AM, John Clark wrote:On Wed, Feb 12, 2025 at 5:41 PM Brent Meeker <[email protected]> wrote: *>> Schrodinger's Equation is 100% deterministic, so why is it necessary to resort to probability at all?* >///Because one thing of many possible happens./ *Why is that "one" thing special? I can answer that; because it's not special, many things happen, everything that is not forbidden happens. You have no answer to that question other than "because it is". *The only thing special about is that it's the one that happened. If everything not forbidden happens then you're going to need to explain what probabilty means./> I can write an equation for the toss of die that shows that the probability of each face is 1/6. That equation is deterministic. It determines probabilities. And probabilities tell you that some things happen and some don't. Not that every face of the die comes up on every throw./ *Schrodinger's equation producesa complex-valued wave that evolves in time, the square of the absolute value of the amplitude of that wave determines probabilities.You just take the Born Rule as a given because experimenters tell you that it works. Many Worlds can tell you _why_ it works and why you need it. *So you say. But all attempts to derive it, assuming MWI, have failed. I look forward to your paper.*And unlike Schrodinger's Equation your dice equation directly determines a probability*Not as directly as Schrodinger's equation determines QM proability amplitudes.*; classical physics doesn't have or need a counterpart to the Born Rule (although the square of the absolute value of an electromagnetic wave is proportional to its energy). Classical physics can provide us with an excellent approximation of how the orientation of the die will change in time, so why do we need to use probability? The reason for that is practical not fundamental, sometimes in classical physics tiny changes in initial conditions lead to exponentially diverging trajectories over time, and you're never going to know the initial conditions exactly, and even if you did you don't have the computing capacity to use them.* /> And you have no answer to what probability means, until you resort to "uncertainty of self-location",/ *Resort to? If I'm not allowed to give the correct answer then my answer is going to be wrong. Many Worlds says everything always obeys Schrodinger's equation including the observer, therefore there will always be self-location uncertainty, it can't be avoided. *And how does that result in uncertainty, when you are located in every branch.As if you were somehow outside the universe—what actually happens is that the conscious process that is 'you' only has access to the information within a given branch (which is not a singular, isolated entity as Bruce assumes). There are simply more copies of 'you' in branches with higher amplitude, making those experiences overwhelmingly more common.
If there are more copies of me, where are they? I don't see them? If they're copies of me the should be living with my wife in my house. If you mean each one is a different copy of the universe, then that is branch counting and I refer you to JKC's explanation of why that can't work. It requires retroactive causation.
Brent
Quentin It's just the problem of what does probability mean when everything happens. You're just pushing the problem around. Brent-- You received this message because you are subscribed to the GoogleGroups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/9d53a9f6-ae2b-40c0-82d9-2ffff413384b%40gmail.com <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/9d53a9f6-ae2b-40c0-82d9-2ffff413384b%40gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>. --You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/CAMW2kAo7F6_dCk5aquBpaNhy4o7%3D%2B2xp0rwuQe%2BBYjxE2vA%2BtA%40mail.gmail.com <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/CAMW2kAo7F6_dCk5aquBpaNhy4o7%3D%2B2xp0rwuQe%2BBYjxE2vA%2BtA%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>.
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