Angela said, "There's a contemporary nun whose name escapes me who has written extensively on consciousness."
Her name is Bernadette Roberts. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Angela Mailander <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > You are making at least eight unwarranted assumptions: > > 1. Maharishi saw nothing inferior about the technique > I'd been practicing for twenty-five years by the time > I talked to him--on the contrary--"Verry good, verry > good" was his constant refrain to my account. > > 2. Just because a technique is monastic doesn't mean > it's useless. If a monastic order persists, and they > have for more than a thousand years, then you cannot > assume that they are useless or that there is no > succession of oral transmission--again on the > contrary. Monasticism is certainly a good way to > preserve "the purity of the teaching." They are, > PERHAPS, not so useful in creating a 1% effect. But > whether a time is right for such an effect is another > question. > > 3. Just because you see no evidence in the bios of > saints of this succession doesn't mean that there > isn't one. > > 4. Just because enlightened individuals belonging to > some monastic tradition aren't famous doesn't mean > that the monasteries aren't crawling with them. > Remember, too, that a monastery is not just an order > of a brotherhood or a sisterhood. A monk or a nun > don't necessarily belong to a monastic order. If they > belong to some teaching order or nursing order etc., > they are not monastics. Monastic means "on a path." > Why these paths are kept secret is a very interesting > question. > > 5. I'm not so convinced by the authenticity of > stigmatics, especially since it was revealed recently > that Padre Pio used acid to create his wounds and keep > them fresh. > > 6. My own friendship with Sister Angela (yup--she was > Angela, too) has absolutely convinced me that there > are ongoing traditions of what we're pleased to call > "masters" these days. I guess I'd have to call Sister > Angela a mistress. She'd get a good laugh out of > that. > > 7. You cannot assume that published "spiritual > exercises" are what's practiced in monasteries. > > 8. A concentration technique is not for beginners, > but after you've got the mind under control, there are > all kinds of techniques that would be > counterproductive for beginners. > > > --- holobuda <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > ---Thanks, I've read all of the bios of Saints > > available from the Tan > > Publishing books. The Saints come forth > > independently of each other > > (seemingly); and I see no everpresent, ongoing > > disciplic succession. > > If you take any of the traditional Saints, you will > > find no > > noteworthy physically embodied Teacher (aside from > > Jesus) - except in > > some rare instances in which one Saint follows > > another. Also, > > various Saints seem to be attracted to one-another > > as in the example > > of St. Francis and St. Clair. > > However, the Saints you mention are very few and > > far between - > > Meister Eickhart and Hildegard von Bingen and these > > two in particular > > are famous as well in the non-religious literature > > of mysticism. > > Again, such mystics (in contrast to the tradition > > Stigmatists for > > example) are few in number and pop up rarely in the > > span of hundreds > > of years. > > The dearth in numbers of such exemplary Mystics > > bolsters my > > viewpoint that they arise as Flowers in a field, > > independently of one- > > another and there is no "secret" ongoing Tradition > > of Self-Realized > > Saints in the Christian tradition. Indeed, the > > methods used by such > > Mystics are recorded in their own words. > > But even if there are such secret techniques, if > > they are truly > > secret then they're useless!. If they're available, > > then they are > > still probably inferior to TM, and thus useless > > again. > > In regard to the many years of meditation you > > practiced before > > starting TM, consider the benefit of starting from > > day 1 with TM and > > bypassing the inferior techniques. Thus, no need > > for any techniques > > from the Mystical saints such as Hildegard, the > > Meister; or the > > traditional Catholic Saints who have recorded their > > Spiritual > > exercises. > > You are probably aware of various books such as > > "The Spiritual > > Exercises of St....(so and so). I've read these and > > discarded them > > as counterproductive, frequently involving some type > > of hard > > conentration. > > If you have gained some benefit from the > > "exercises" of the Meister > > or Hindegard, great. > > > > In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Angela Mailander > > <mailander111@> wrote: > > > > > > The monastic tradition keeps coming up with great > > > "saints" who have a clue. Hildegard von Bingen, > > for > > > instance, but there's a whole slew. Where do they > > > come from? Some commentators say that mysticism > > is > > > "sui generis," but then what were these people > > doing > > > in their monasteries? There's a contemporary nun > > > whose name escapes me who has written extensively > > on > > > consciousness. When I taught at the Catholic > > school, > > > I developed a friendship with the spokeswoman of a > > > Carmelite monastery situated on campus, and we > > talked > > > about these things quite a bit. The Carmelites > > are > > > strictly monastic. I never saw this woman since > > she > > > remained hidden behind a screen. She was the only > > one > > > who met the "public" and only from behind that > > screen. > > > She was the only one who talked. The others > > observed > > > strict silence. But silence, though a powerful > > > technique, was not the only technique they > > practiced. > > > So there are techniques that are kept secret by > > the > > > "officially visible" Church--which is not all > > there > > > is. The Jesuits...but that's a whole 'nother > > kettle > > > of fish. > > > > > > > > > --- tertonzeno <tertonzeno@> wrote: > > > > > > > -If by "Catholic Church" one means some secret > > > > version of the truth > > > > that only elitists know, one can conjure up any > > > > "truth" that appeals > > > > to us -say some weird Da Vinci secrets; or > > perhaps: > > > > only Mel Gibson > > > > knows the "real" truth about the Tridentine > > Mass. > > > > You tantalize and tease with such tidbits but > > offer > > > > only empty air. > > > > What's the truth here? Who conveyed it in an > > > > unbroken disciplic > > > > succession? I see no such succession from the > > > > Meister Eckhart. > > > > OTOH if you mean by The Catholic Church - the > > > > organization in Rome > > > > headed by the current Pope, as the former Grand > > > > Inquisitor his > > > > position on "yoga" is well known: Salvation is > > not > > > > an interior > > > > revelation, doesn't depend on "Wisdom" or > > Gnosis; > > > > but is an > > > > acceptance of one's dualist relationship with > > Jesus > > > > Christ who > > > > supposedly died on the cross for our sins and is > > > > based on faith and > > > > belief. Enlightenment is based on Transcendence > > of > > > > belief, not > > > > embracing a dogma. > > > > Basically, your're saying that the Pope's > > version > > > > of the Catholic > > > > Church's teachings is faulty and you know the > > "real" > > > > truth. OK, > > > > what's your evidence for this? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "John" > > > > <jr_esq@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > The Pope also excommunicated Galileo for > > finding > > > > the true nature of > > > > > the planetary system. During Pope John Paul > > II > > > > tenure, the > > > > Catholic > > > > > Church apologized to everyone for making a > > > > mistake--only about 500 > > > > > years later. > > > > > > > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Angela > > > > Mailander > > > > > <mailander111@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > The Catholic Church offers several paths and > > > > > > recognized the phenomenon of enlightenment > > > > throughout > > > > > > its history. But they kept any techniques > > > > secret and > > > > > > behind monastery walls. In fact, if you > > even > > > > talked > > > > > > about enlightenment (as Eckhart did) you > > could > > > > get > > > > > > yourself excommunicated and burned at the > > stake. > > > > They > > > > > > are dead serious about not letting any such > > > > techniques > > > > > > out among the common folk even today. I > > taught > > > > at a > > > > > > Catholic college once and had the incredible > > > > > > experience of sitting in the dean's office > > in > > > > the late > > > > > > 20th c, defending my ass against the same > > > > questions > > > > > > Eckhart had to deal with from the > > Inquisition. > > > > They > > > > > > excommunicated him posthumously since he was > > too > > > > smart > > > > > > for them while he lived. They reinstated > > him > > > === message truncated === > > > Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com >
