"So where do the esoteric experiences you have described from meditation come from if not from the Absolute?"
To quote Maharishi defending his call to study meditation using scientific apparatus: "Every experience has its level of physiology, and so unbounded awareness has its own level of physiology which can be measured. Every aspect of life is integrated and connected with every other phase. When we talk of scientific measurements, it does not take away from the spiritual experience. We are not responsible for those times when spiritual experience was thought of as metaphysical. Everything is physical. Consciousness is the product of the functioning of the brain. Talking of scientific measurements is no damage to that wholeness of life which is present everywhere and which begins to be lived when the physiology is taking on a particular form. This is our understanding about spirituality: it is not on the level of faith --it is on the level of blood and bone and flesh and activity. It is measurable." The relevant part is: wholeness of life which is present everywhere and which begins to be lived when the physiology is taking on a particular form. Maharishi assumes that "wholeness" (Brahm?) exists and our nervous system can change in ways that enable us to appreciate it. You can assert that the wholeness doesn't really exist and that the changes in the nervous system are solely responsible for the perception of the non-existent thing. That might be the case, but if those changes are useful in and of themselves, does it matter? The behavioral improvements shown by the vast majority of inmates in Senegal who learned TM meant it was of value to the prison system and hopefully to the inmates, even if the mullahs eventually ruled against it. Likewise, the new research on genetic expression that was done at MUM by Wenuganen Supaya for his doctoral thesis is very exciting. If it is confirmed by longitudental studies that TM practice really does change teh expression of the 74 genes in beneficial ways that he found in long-term TMers vs non-TMing controls of the same age, this could be very exciting. Such changes are part of the progression towards the ability to appreciate wholeness. It might be that you can evoke those behavioral and genetic changes without enhancing the ability to perceive wholeness, and perhaps in the future, people will opt for that, instead, but if a single technique, or a group of related techniques, can bring about such changes, as part of the process of growing to appreciate wholeness, it doesn't seem that bad a deal to practice them, even if the side-effect, growth in "appreciation of wholeness," is merely an illusion. L ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, <no_re...@yahoogroups.com> wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, <mjackson74@...> wrote : So where do the esoteric experiences you have described from meditation come from if not from the Absolute? From my head. My head creates my experience of the world outside and meditation changes how the different parts of the brain communicates so that my subjective world alters too. I think. It's either that or some mystical thing that is beyond our understanding. So I stick with materialism until proved otherwise because we know our brains are running the show and we've no reason to suspect there is need of any other forces to create consciousness. While it remains poorly understood there will always be wiggle room for people to sneak in ideas that make it seem more than it is. In addition I am watching Hammond talk about seeing Marshy - this guy was hallucinating and that's about it. I felt a bit sorry for him after a while. But he lives in an exciting world, I never get to speak with God.... How was the Mockingjay movie? From: salyavin808 <no_re...@yahoogroups.com> To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2014 3:37 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Live Stream | 30th November ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, <mjackson74@...> wrote : You mean everything is real and the absolute is imaginary? Yup, I'm as much a philosophical realist as you can be in a post-Newtonian, quantum world. From: salyavin808 <no_re...@yahoogroups.com> To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2014 3:19 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Live Stream | 30th November ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, <noozguru@...> wrote : Everyone is "merged" with the absolute, the process of enlightenment is realizing it. The absolute is all that is and everything else is just an illusion. This is where I go wrong. I'm utterly convinced it's the other way round!
