On Apr 8, 2006, at 10:40 PM, Rick Archer wrote: > on 4/8/06 9:29 PM, Vaj at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > > > > On Apr 8, 2006, at 8:09 PM, Rick Archer wrote: > > > >> on 4/8/06 6:30 PM, Vaj at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > >> > >>>> Vaj, I consider you a friend and I respect your scholarship and > >>>> experience, > >>>> and can't match either, and I also respect and to some extent > share > >>>> your > >>>> concerns about premature claims to enlightenment, but I have > >>>> serious doubts > >>>> about your apparent belief that regular folks like Jim, Dr. Pete, > >>>> etc., > >>>> can't possibly be experiencing the "real" thing, or are > >>>> experiencing some > >>>> very preliminary stage and mistaking it for something more > >> advanced. > >>> > >>> Well I can only comment on the contradictions they express here > (or > >>> off list). Some of it's very nice, some is contradictory. > Anything's > >>> possible. > >> > >> And all of it's contingent upon our flawed abilities to judge > others' > >> subjective states from their attempts to express the inexpressible > >> in words. > > > > Well partially. If you've spent a lot of time around non-dual, > > realized teachers who transmit that state by their very presence > (and > > really we are all transmitting our own states, all of the time) you > > learn that presence. It's absolutely unmistakable. And of course > long > > term meditators do develop not only intuition, but other "psychic" > > abilities as well. > > Sure, but I was referring to our ability to judge what state people > like Jim > Flanigan might be in based upon his posts in a chat group. That's not > "spending a lot of time around" him. Also, a teacher has a special > dharma > and skill. He can transmit. It's part of his job description. > Couldn't a > non-teacher - someone with a different dharma - be in an equal > state of > attainment yet not be able to transmit or describe that to others > very well?
*Anything's* possible. Certain things are more probable. We are all transmitting our states, all of the time. Is it possible that someone authentically residing in the non-dual state could not *consciously* transmit their state to others? Sure. But not very probable IMO. Since we all transmit our states all the time, it's not necessary--esp. if the "listener" knows how to rest in that state himself. And there's the rub. Like *is* attracted to like. Failing all that, each darshana does have it's own internal logic to it. Ever watched a bunch of Gelukpa monks--who spend a lot of their time experientially investigating consciousness--debate? ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing http://us.click.yahoo.com/lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/UlWolB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
