On Jun 15, 2006, at 8:03 AM, TurquoiseB wrote: > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> On Jun 14, 2006, at 1:43 PM, TurquoiseB wrote: >> >>> >>> It was just a fascinating evening for me, watching >>> her avoiding her own perceptions. I did not tell >>> her before the talk that Rama could do siddhis, or >>> to watch for them, and he never announced that he >>> was about to do them, even to the point of saying >>> "Watch this." That night, a small gathering of about >>> 50 students and their guests, he just did them ex >>> tempore, slipping them in *while* giving a talk on >>> something or another. And because of her mumbling >>> thing, there was no question that she was seeing >>> them at the time, but then for whatever reason she >>> decided to "not have seen them," and that decision >>> was more powerful than her own perceptions. Go >>> figure. >>> >> >> Unless of course she was pissed because she realized he was using >> some form of suggestion... >> >> Some Buddhist teachers have suggested that Zen Master Rama was >> just doing a form of "magical display" (if he was not hypnotizing >> people)-- a kind of minor siddhi where they change people's >> perceptions. Supposedly much easier to do and a lot more common >> than actual levitation siddhi. >> > > Vaj, just out of curiosity, I'm going to ask you to back > up this last paragraph by naming names. > > I'm asking not out of a desire to defend Rama but out of > pure curiosity. I'm not convinced that you're telling > the truth here, because I've encountered at least three > dozen teachers in Tibetan traditions who have said no such > thing about him. The worst that they said (and that I > agree with wholeheartedly) is that he was a very high > being who in the end succumbed to his own samskaras, > and got taken out by his own attachments. No one I've > spoken to has ever suggested that the siddhis he was > able to perform were anything but real. > > See, the thing is that I happen to know that the Rama > guy only met a handful of actual Tibetan teachers while > he was still alive. I know all of these teachers and in > general they are favorable towards him (with the caveat > listed above, which I agree with). So I'm wondering which > teachers you cite were willing to make such a state- > ment about *someone they never met*. > > There are a *lot* of theories about 'hypnotism' and > 'suggestion' floating around about Rama and the > things he could do. But almost without exception > *none* of the people suggesting these theories > ever saw him in real life. So I'm asking you to > 'name names' to see who would be so silly as to > do this.
If I can find the old email, I'll post it. IIRC these weren't people who knew Zen Master Rama personally. I can see how a magical display would make more sense, esp. if inner qualities were lacking. Had any of this ever been witnessed by a trained magician just out of curiosity? ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> See what's inside the new Yahoo! Groups email. http://us.click.yahoo.com/2pRQfA/bOaOAA/yQLSAA/UlWolB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
