Steven, Steven Sacks wrote: > We've got better things to do than play into Adobe's attempt to buy time > by deflecting it back on the developers ...
I'm not trying to deflect anything or to "buy time". I was just making a statement that it's more helpful to have concrete test cases. You said yourself that "it's difficult to fix", so it seems reasonable to me that having more concrete test cases will make it easier to fix. > It's clear that Grant had discussions with Adobe before he wrote that > blog post and I'm certain that others have approached the Flash player > team with this issue for awhile. You seem to be implying that Grant wrote the blog post only after he was rebuffed or stonewalled by the Flash Player team when he approached them with this issue. I have no idea whether he has contacted the Flash Player team about this issue, but he certainly doesn't explicitly talk about it in his post. In fact, what he does say about the Flash Player team seems to cut the other way: "The player team is a group of smart, dedicated people, who are genuinely interested in what you have to say." I'd like to humbly offer a possible alternative motive for Grant's post. Perhaps he understands that the Player team gets a lot of feedback and has to evaluate each issue based not only on its severity, but also on the amount of content and the number of developers that the issue affects. Perhaps his post was an attempt to clarify to the Flash Player team that they have underestimated both the severity and scope of this issue. > The Flash GC engine's inner workings is something that nobody outside of > Adobe has access into... Not true. The Flash GC engine used in AVM2 is open-source (as part of the Tamarin project). I'm just mentioning this as a point of interest. I'm not in any way "deflecting" the issue here. I don't expect anyone on this list to actually fix Tamarin GC bugs or to understand the inner workings of the GC before filing a bug report. But if you are curious about the AVM2 garbage collector, named MMgc, here's a link to the Tamarin GC docs: http://developer.mozilla.org/en/docs/MMgc > Let's not get into a situation where we are insulting each other's > intelligence by acting like the Flash team hasn't been aware of this > issue for quite some time. I never said the player team hasn't heard about this. In fact, the bug report I linked to in my last message was filed in late November 2007. Another side note--someone mentioned Grant's blog post on Flexcoders last week, and Alex Harui, who is an order of magnitude smarter than I am, responded: http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/flexcoders/message/109455 Francis Cheng | Senior Technical Writer | Adobe Systems, Inc. http://blogs.adobe.com/fcheng -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Steven Sacks Sent: Monday, April 14, 2008 12:45 PM To: Flash Coders List Subject: Re: [Flashcoders] Is Adobe fixing this big FP9 problem? Francis Cheng wrote: > Grant's post is helpful because he discusses the issue in such detail, > but it would be even more helpful to have a concrete test case that > exhibits this problem. > Francis, With all due respect, the Flash team knows about this, and they don't need any more concrete test cases. We've got better things to do than play into Adobe's attempt to buy time by deflecting it back on the developers to come up with examples while the Flash team tries to get out of their blunder. It's clear that Grant had discussions with Adobe before he wrote that blog post and I'm certain that others have approached the Flash player team with this issue for awhile. Nothing has been done to fix it, so you end up with a public exposure of the issue, as Grant has done. The Flash player team has egg on its face because in AS2 if you unload a swf, it unloads, and in AS3, it doesn't. Period end of statement. The Flash GC engine's inner workings is something that nobody outside of Adobe has access into and we can't possibly make tests that demonstrate whether it is or isn't working. The proof is in the pudding and Grant's post is all the evidence you need. Let's not get into a situation where we are insulting each other's intelligence by acting like the Flash team hasn't been aware of this issue for quite some time. The Flash team is well aware of it, they know why it exists and they know it's difficult to fix. In all likelihood, they knew about it before any developer discovered it. I mean, after all, it works exactly like it was coded to work. It's not technically a bug, it's an engineering decision that is coming back to haunt them. _______________________________________________ Flashcoders mailing list [email protected] http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders _______________________________________________ Flashcoders mailing list [email protected] http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders
