Alex
I pointed someone to this on Flashcoders:
http://www.mail-archive.com/flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com/msg58770.html
Do you have any new views on where Flash is heading?
John
On 20/12/2012 05:50, Alex Harui wrote:
Re: [flexcoders] Re: Flex alternatives
Well, there are several pieces. ActionScript is a language. It is
really only the dozen classes or so in the “top-level” in the ASDoc.
String, int, RegEx, Array, Vector, a few functions like unescape,
etc, plus a bunch of keywords and stuff like “var”, “class”, plus a
grammar of how you put it all together. It hasn’t changed much in
years, other than the addition of Vector. There are no plans to
improve on its specification by adding things it is missing compared
to other languages like Java such as method overloading, or mutiple
inheritance. Instead, Adobe is tossing out the whole specification
and developing a next-generation of ActionScript. It will have some
of the same things you see in the current ActionScript, but there will
be new keywords and grammar. The goal is to give up on backward
compatibility in order to get significant speed improvements by making
the language easier to execute at runtime.
ActionScript currently only runs in a Virtual Machine embedded in the
FlashPlayer or AIR. Both runtimes provide additional APIs that allow
you to draw stuff and get network i/o, etc. The current APIs use
ActionScript 3 syntax and are focused primarily on Sprites, Shapes and
MovieClips on a display list. New features were added in every major
release.
Now, Adobe is working on embedding a new Virtual Machine that runs the
next-generation ActionScript in the FlashPlayer and AIR. The focus is
on gaming, and a new set of APIs that talk to a 3d rendering engine is
being devloped in the next-generation ActionScript syntax. There will
be no support for the old Sprites/Shapes/MovieClips and display list.
However, the old virtual machine that runs ActionScript 3 will
continue to be embedded in the FlashPlayer and AIR that run on
tradtional desktops/laptops. I would not expect it to be co-existent
on mobile versions of AIR because the new focus is on the captive
runtime workflow where you pre-process your ActionScript code and the
runtime libraries into a device-dependent executable.
So, given all of that, you can continue to deliver ActionScript 3
content in AIR or FlashPlayer on desktops/laptops “forever”. And
unless you have heard otherwise from the PDF team, they probably won’t
eliminate support for Flash in PDF on desktop/laptops soon.
I think Apache Flex exists because folks have found the Flex workflow
easy and productive and also safe because it uses structured
programming, and former Flex customers are now pitching in to continue
to evolve Flex as much as we can given the constraints of the current
environment. The problem for many is that, because Adobe is not
evolving the ActionScript 3 language, VM and runtime APIs related to
it, folks see it as a dead end and no longer want to develop apps on
it. I can see their point, but there is a reason why DOS is still
around on some custom handheld devices: it works, it is well known,
and has a small footprint for a constrained environment. Flash/AIR
and Flex on ActionScript3 continue to be excellent ways to create apps
quickly, but it has been difficult to convince customers to stick with it.
Anyway, so far, the most interest in Apache Flex seems to be around
trying to leverage the Flex workflow to create apps that run on the
HTML/CSS/JS stack (without Flash). It will have growing pains for
sure, but to me, a question about CPU load is premature. There is
1000’s of people from all over the world working on improving the
runtime environment for HTML/CSS/JS. They have made significant
advances in the past several years and I don’t see a cap on it. So
any pain points you experience now are likely to be solved in the near
future. If you can continue to use Flash/AIR and let others suffer
through the growing pains, consider yourself lucky. Otherwise, put on
some pads and join the battle.
On 12/19/12 9:29 AM, "John McCormack" <j...@easypeasy.co.uk> wrote:
Thank you again.
Although ActionScript is not being developed for the FlashPlayer,
is it possible that it may still be developed separately for use
in AIR? I could deliver content through AIR instead of PDFs.
My problem is that the FlashBuilder / Flash Professional workflow
is such a seductive one, with that easy marriage of graphics and
code, that I don't want to lose it. I have used C++ to produce
graphical programs and the AS3 route is a godsend in comparison.
One wonders "Is HMTL5 going to use any less CPU cycles than AS3,
once it is doing similar work?"
John
On 18/12/2012 05:38, Alex Harui wrote:
Re: [flexcoders] Re: Flex alternatives Things get lost in
translation, but one goal of the parallel frameworks is to not
leverage things that get lost in translation. Otherwise,
since JS and AS are ECMA-based, the translation works pretty well.
Keep in mind that, while Adobe is no longer investing in
ActionScript 3 on the Flash Player, and not developing Flash
Player for mobile devices, and AIR may not run on all mobile
devices, where the FlashPlayer is today, it will likely be
there “forever”. So, if alll of your users are using
desktops/laptops that have browsers that have Flash, you can
continue to use Flex and/or ActionScript 3 to build
applications and they will likely run there not just in five
years, but even after that. There is no time-bomb in the
players that will go off and stop running. Even though
ActionScript Next and FlashPlayer Next are not compatibile
with ActionScript 3, the AS3 VM will ship in the FlashPlayers
that Adobe ships in the future. There is the possibility that
the browser vendors will stop supporting plugins, but I would
imagine they will keep a compatibility-mode somehow. I think
there is too much Flash content out there and to block it from
existing desktops/laptops would “break the web” and I don’t
expect the browser vendors or Adobe take such a risk. There
would be too much negative press. That doesn’t mean that new
computers with new OS’s may not support Flash (that’s what
Apple did with IOS), and many home users may forgo traditional
computers for tablets in the future, so keep that in mind as well.
I don’t know the PDF market that well, but again, I would
expect PDFs to continue to support Flash “forever” as well.
At least for the readers on traditional desktops/laptops.
On 12/17/12 10:48 AM, "John McCormack" <j...@easypeasy.co.uk>
wrote:
Thank you.
That's interesting and very helpful.
One does wonder if a separate translation tool would do
the job faithfully, and so creates doubt.
For someone that wants to use SWFs in PDFs to deliver
educational content that is fully interactive, what
workflow would you suggest using for the next three to
five years?
John
On 17/12/2012 16:31, Alex Harui wrote:
Re: [flexcoders] Re: Flex alternatives Adobe has no
plans that I know of to get ActionScript to work with
HTML5 in the same way that Google is proposing Dart as
an alternative to JavaScript.
The Apache Flex project is working on a compiler
that will translate ActionScript to JavaScript. In
addition, the link I posted proposes a component
framework that would enable you to build or prototype
your app in Flash using FlashBuilder and ActionScript
and then run a separate tool outside of FlashBuilder
to translate it to JavaScript where it will run and
leverage HTML or HTML5 components.
Alternatively, the same ActionScript to JavaScript
compiler would let you write the script portions of
your website as ActionScript using FlashBuilder and
have separate HTML files, then use the same separate
tool outside of FlashBuilder to translate the
ActionScript to JavaScript. And maybe variations will
be created that can output to various JS frameworks.
At this time, there are no plans to change
FlashBuilder to integrate the translation workflow.
Adobe’s focus for FlashBuilder is on building
ActionScript gaming and premium video projects that
run on the Flash player. I suppose if the JS workflow
became wildly popular and Adobe could see a revenue
stream by supporting such a workflow things might
change, but I wouldn’t count on it. There is a better
chance that someone in Apache Flex will start creating
plugins for Eclipse to support the workflow or one of
the other tool vendors will provide an integrated
workflow.
The future of ActionScript 3 in Rich Internet
Applications (as opposed to ActionScript “Next” as
mentioned in the Flash roadmap) is actually being
given more attention by Apache Flex than Adobe. If
you want to continue to use ActionScript 3 to develop
RIAs, I would encourage you to get involved with the
Apache Flex project.
On 12/17/12 2:16 AM, "John McCormack"
<j...@easypeasy.co.uk> wrote:
On 17/12/2012 05:12, Alex Harui wrote:
Re: [flexcoders] Re: Flex alternatives
Adobe has spent the year donating the Flex
SDK and Falcon compilers to the Apache
Software Foundation. While Adobe has a small
set of people contributing to Flex in Apache
and a team that shipped Flash Builder 4.7 and
is working on subsequent Flash Builder
release, Adobe is not leading the development
of Flex and has not been for a full year. The
future of Flex is in the hands of the Apache
Flex community. This document should have
made Adobe’s plans clear:
http://www.adobe.com/devnet/flex/whitepapers/roadmap.html
I followed this link through to
http://www.adobe.com/devnet/flashplatform/whitepapers/roadmap.html
Under Flash Player "Next" this says...
" and provide a foundation on which Flash can
move forward over the next decade."
Does this imply ActionScript working
collaboratively with HTML5 or is it an alternative
to HTML5?
I am asking because I am hoping Flash Builder
will continue to offer me a way forward (AS3+HTML5).
John
--
Alex Harui
Flex SDK Team
Adobe Systems, Inc.
http://blogs.adobe.com/aharui
--
Alex Harui
Flex SDK Team
Adobe Systems, Inc.
http://blogs.adobe.com/aharui
--
Alex Harui
Flex SDK Team
Adobe Systems, Inc.
http://blogs.adobe.com/aharui
