* Ted Mittelstaedt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [0157 06:57]:
> > Tom Vilot writes:
> > I tend to agree.  Are people still using Java? 
 
> Keep in mind that Sun's main Java push was into micro-code for embedded
> devices, that is why Java was written in the first place.

And somehow this mutated into J2EE.... :D

> .....  On the corporate side of the house, people sometimes
> are forced to use tools that some salesmanager or CEO has decided
> need to be used, and if they don't like that their jobs are outsourced
> to India.

The phrase 'Java is the COBOL of the nineties' springs to mind....
 
> If FreeBSD can get a current binary JRE distributed then it helps
> out those companies that use FreeBSD that have applications like that
> which they are attempting to sell, without bothering the rest of
> us who aren't in this boat.  In this case why not make friends with
> them when it costs you nothing?

I don't think it does cost the Foundation nothing, that's the trouble. You 
spend years jumping through hoops to get the certification (the only benefit
of which is it pleases the  managers) and then they turn round and make you
do it again. 

With this attitude it's hardly suprising they piss some people off (especially
when the product you're doing all this for is pretty second rate when compared
to python or ruby imo)...

-- 
'Yeah, well I'm gonna build my own themepark! With blackjack aaand Hookers!
Actually, forget the park. And the blackjack.'
                -- Bender
Rasputin :: Jack of All Trades - Master of Nuns
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