It seems I found a more fundamental definition: "So, if you want to
characterize the complexity of an object, think about how much
you would have to write in order to describe it. Would it take a sentence, a
paragraph, a few pages, a book, or many books? Count
the number of characters in the description. This is complexity." --Yaneer
Bar-Yam "Making things works. Solving complex problems in
a complex world", p. 54. So, linear systems have simpler and shorter
descriptions than non-linear ones. And the same is true for
centralized vs. decentralized systems. Any thoughts? --Mikhail
----- Original Message -----
From: Alfredo CV
To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group
Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2007 1:42 AM
Subject: Re: [FRIAM] When is something complex
To decide if a phenomena is complex maybe It's necessary to identify
patterns of self organization in the "behavior" of the small
units of individual that conform the population of interest. Maybe It's
necesary to check the lack of centralized control and the
existence of some stable states. I think these three features are the
diagnostic features of complexity. I guess....
I don't know what Hayes says but I'll think about these three features for
health insurance, medicare, Social Security and
Pensions in my country... (in fact is not mine, belongs to the richest and the
multinationals.... anyhow).
Regards
Alfredo CV
health insurance,
Medicare, Medicaid, Social Security, and the uninsured
Mikhail Gorelkin wrote:
+1: I guess that complexity cannot be expressed adequately even in a term of
computability. ? --Mikhail
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mikhail Gorelkin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group" <friam@redfish.com>
Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2007 6:24 PM
Subject: Re: [FRIAM] When is something complex
Just two thoughts: 1) it seems that complexity is a more fundamental category
than linearity / non-linearity, which are parts of a
sophisticated ***formal*** system; 2) I assume there are types of complexity
(and, therefore, many - I mean really many - types)
that cannot be expressed in any formal system (beyond linearity /
non-linearity). Something like Gödel's theorem. ? --Mikhail
----- Original Message -----
From: "Nicholas Thompson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <friam@redfish.com>
Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2007 4:45 PM
Subject: Re: [FRIAM] When is something complex
Alfredo,
Good question. In fact, the question of the day, for the Hayes talk.
Mysterious non linear effects in Hayes data leading to the conclusion good
hearted efforts in one direction lead to the opposite result.
I guess "mysterious non-linearity" is a good clue that the phenomenon is
complex.
Nick .
Message: 1
Date: Sat, 15 Sep 2007 12:12:09 -0500
From: Alfredo CV <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [FRIAM] **today ** Lecture Wed Sep 12 12:30p: Jim Hayes -
Hedging Complex and Chaotic Private Health Insurance Markets and the
Uninsured
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], The Friday Morning Applied Complexity
Coffee Group <friam@redfish.com>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Hi
Of course it?s impossible to me to know details of the speeches you
usually have. In the distance I suppose that the first purpose of each
one of these speeches is to know and evaluate a broad type of cases
where complexity is used to understand phenomena. I wonder what makes
some phenomena suitable to be studied with a "complex" approach. What
must somebody take in consideration to decide that is studying a complex
phenomena?
Regards,
Alfredo CV
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FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
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FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
============================================================
FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org
============================================================
FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org
