I prefer to frame in terms of (Levin-esque) cognition.   The bio/noo/techno-sphere is busy cogitating on solving the problems/opportunities of being a somewhat isolated gravity-well centered dynamic matter-energy complex moderately coupled to another much less complex (lunar) system and a highly energetic one (sol) and virtually independent otherwise of the other matter and energy fluxes swarming the solar system and orders of magnitude less closely coupled with the galactic/intergalactic context.

The cognitive processes around my woodstoves (are simultaneously) are those of the home/stead itself, trying to maintain human-comfort (and plumbing-friendly) temperatures (with the help of humans who light and feed and damper the fire) in the dead of winter while consuming household trash and prunings from the trees growing on-property.  They are also involved in the problem/opportunity solving work of humans who want to be comfortable, want to be soothed by flickering flames and want to heat/cook/dry various foodstuffs, etc.

If my conscious (and unconscious proprioceptive) self touches the stove surface it it is for various reasons most. relevant to itself (test the temperature, attempt to flick a bit of burnt food off the surface, recondition the steel surface with stove-polish,  catch my balance if I have lost it nearby...    but it is my neural-dominated sensory-motor feedback system whose "cognition" is causing my "jerk back".    In a larger context (organs scale) gut biomes, glucose/insulin couplings, blood-pressure/heart-rate/vaso-C-D, etc are very "busy" solving problems which are their primary/singular "job" which are *tuned* to the scope/scale-centric problems my conscious self, my id, my ego, my socio-cultural-political-economic embeddings, and from below, the tissues/cellular processes are trying to solve.

My conscious *awarenes* overlaps all of these to different degrees.    After many cycles of Ketogenic dieting, occasional wearing of a Continuous Glucose Monitor, various exercise and meditation regimes, I feel my awareness my personal *cogitation/cognition* has spread *downward* a bit while my engagement in sociopoliticaleconomic regimes and awareness of geo-hydro-atmo-biospheric processes (mostly through theoretical/experimental writing/reports rather than direct apprehension) have shifted/spread my locus of awarenesess in the other direction.

My free "will" seems to be a slippery (often post-hoc) apprehension of the coupling between all of those levels.  When I reach out to test the temperature of the surface of the stove, I am trusting that my lower level sensorimotor feedback system will protect me from anything greater than a 1st degree burn (unless of course I've raised the temperature to the stove into orange-hot, when 2nd is very likely).

I've probably just stirred my own brand of mud into this conversation but my (free?) will was weak today and my compulsive slop-generator was apparently overstoked this morning?

- SteveS

EricC wrote:
Good point!
The "scale" at which we view a given event does seem to affect whether we see it as an example of free will or not.

Personally, I would (contra Claude) say that the reflexive pulling of hand away from the hot stove which it touched was "zero" free will, not "low" free will.

Choosing the steak seem like a high free-will example, under (my) normal circumstances, but I could certainly imagine various social-and-cultural pressures modifying my view of someone else's choice of steak. For example, if you could show me that Bill chose steak every time, without fail, that the three people before him ordered steak, and that he never ordered steak otherwise, I would be less confident in my "free will" attribution. Maybe it was literally beaten into him at some point in his life? Maybe he's just likes to go with the crowd?


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