Ideally, a newbie should be able to type the word "assignment" into the search box on the J Software main page, and get several results, including links to Is (local) and Is (global) on the NuVoc and standard vocabulary pages. Additional links to pages discussing assignment in "J for C Programmers", "Learning J" and other doc would be great. Since this feature would be oriented to newbies, the NuVoc pages should probably be at the top of the list..
When learning a new programming language, reading through all the doc causes information overload, at least for me. To get a flavor for the language, I like to start by searching for common programming functions, like assignment, looping, indexing, conditionals, subroutines, etc. Once I get an Idea where the information about these concepts reside in the documentation, I will stat reading those sections. Then as I require a new function, I will type the common name of that function in the search box, and continue to explore from there. To me, this is a much more efficient way to learn a language, rather that trying to absorb the whole range of syntax and functionality presented in the order the documentation authors want to present it., Of course, the "common name" for any function depends somewhat on what programing language you are familiar with. That's why it's important to have as many different related keywords as possible for "subroutine". Skip Skip Cave Cave Consulting LLC On Mon, Feb 10, 2014 at 6:30 AM, Raul Miller <[email protected]> wrote: > If you would put together a list of words (and perhaps phrases?) that need > definition, I (or we) would be happy to fill in the definitions, and supply > a few small examples. > > We might need to go several rounds of this to adequately satisfy you, but > that's ok. > > Or maybe we have an adequate reference to refer you to? But if that were > the case, I imagine the search engines would have found it for you. So > instead let's maybe think about hashing out something that might be a > suitable addition to the J wiki? > > Thanks, > > -- > Raul > > > > On Sun, Feb 9, 2014 at 8:51 PM, Jim Russell <[email protected]> wrote: > > > (Sorry, I got no further than "No," when I put my iphone back in my shirt > > pocket and "man boob" sent it.) > > > > More later when I try to recall all the dumb words phrases I was > > fruitlessly trying to find as I played with J on my iPhone this past > week. > > > > > On Feb 9, 2014, at 8:22 PM, Raul Miller <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > Do you mean like http://www.jsoftware.com/help/dictionary/vocabul.htm? > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > -- > > > Raul > > > > > > > > >> On Sun, Feb 9, 2014 at 7:06 PM, Jim Russell <[email protected]> > > wrote: > > >> I suspect that a glossary of J (and related programming terms) would > > help a great deal. Or does one exist? > > >> > > >>> On Feb 9, 2014, at 1:30 AM, Skip Cave <[email protected]> > wrote: > > >>> > > >>> I was looking over NuVoc the other day, and thinking how it helped me > > learn > > >>> the J primitives. My next thought was how I wished that we could fix > > the J > > >>> search engine so that when newbies searched for stuff in the J wiki > > using > > >>> traditional programming lingo, they would automatically find the J > > >>> equivalent functions. > > >>> > > >>> When J gave new names to all the J programming elements, it was all > for > > >>> good reasons. However that made it really hard to learn J by > searching > > the > > >>> wiki for programming concepts, using common programming names. When I > > am > > >>> programming in J, I often come to a point where I know what I want to > > do, > > >>> and I know what most other programming languages would call what I > > want to > > >>> do. If I search for that name in the J wiki though, I usually come up > > >>> empty-handed. > > >>> > > >>> What we really need in NuVoc, as well as all of the J doc, is a set > of > > >>> common-use keywords attached to every J concept. Thus if a newbie > > searches > > >>> for "assignment", he will get the vocabulary and dictionary pages for > > Is > > >>> (local) and Is (global), When he searches for "indexing" he will get > > the > > >>> Catalog pages. I could go on like this for quite awhile. > > >>> > > >>> Also when newbies or anyone stumbles upon a new concept in any of > the > > J > > >>> doc, we should make it easy for that person to add new keywords to > > that doc > > >>> page. Hopefully the keywords they add will make it easier for the > next > > >>> person to find that concept in the future. > > >>> > > >>> So my proposal is that each NuVoc page (and all J doc pages for that > > >>> matter) needs a list of keywords at (say) the bottom of the page, > > giving > > >>> common programming names for the J concept on that page. In that > way, a > > >>> newbie searching for "assignment" would at least have a chance of > > finding > > >>> what he is looking for. > > >>> > > >>> However, my idea is more that just putting a list of keywords on > every > > doc > > >>> page, As has been discussed on the J mail list, Newbies who are > trying > > to > > >>> learn J, know what they are looking for, when they search for a > > particular > > >>> concept. What If we could make it so when someone finally does find > > what > > >>> they were looking for, they could easily add words to the keyword > list > > on > > >>> the doc page they found. They could add the words that they were > using > > to > > >>> (unsuccessfully) search for that concept. Then each doc page would > > start to > > >>> collect keywords that people commonly use for that concept, making it > > much > > >>> easier for newbies (and even casual J user oldies like me) to find > that > > >>> concept in the future. > > >>> > > >>> There needs to be an easy (but controlled, and perhaps curated) way > to > > put > > >>> a new keyword on any doc page, while that page is being viewed. There > > needs > > >>> to be a brief statement above the keyword block explaining what it > is, > > how > > >>> to add a keyword, and why one should do it. > > >>> > > >>> I believe that in the long run, this keyword scheme could have a > bigger > > >>> impact on reducing the "steep learning curve" of J than almost any > > other > > >>> documentation mechanism. > > >>> > > >>> Skip > > >>> > > >>> Skip Cave > > >>> Cave Consulting LLC > > >>> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > >>> For information about J forums see > http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > > >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > >> For information about J forums see > http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- For information about J forums see http://www.jsoftware.com/forums.htm
