On Sat, Sep 12, 2015 at 12:55 AM, Raymond Jennings <shent...@gmail.com> wrote: > On Fri, Sep 11, 2015 at 5:13 AM, Rich Freeman <ri...@gentoo.org> wrote: >> >> On Fri, Sep 11, 2015 at 5:03 AM, Daniel Campbell <z...@gentoo.org> wrote: >> > >> > I like the general 'gtk' flag we generally use to choose *which* >> > toolkit, and local USE flags for specific versions, if they are >> > supported. But in that case, the general gtk flag should be >> > interpreted as the latest version supported, so users don't come >> > across weirdly behaving packages that default to gtk2 (unless that >> > version is the most stable). >> > >> >... >> > >> > For starters, versioned USE flags more than likely don't belong in >> > make.conf's USE variable and shouldn't be global. > > Personally i disagree with this. > > Versioned use flags for widely used dependencies (like a windowing toolkit) > IMO qualify as global USE flags because they have a common effect across > many packages.
He wasn't suggesting that they have different meanings for different packages. By saying that they shouldn't be global he meant that users should not typically be manipulating them at a global level, such as in make.conf. Back in the day it was common to stick flags like these in make.conf or in profiles, since if you didn't packages wouldn't build GUIs and such. That was before USE defaults and it caused a lot of headaches when multiple versions of toolkits started coming along and setting these flags started causing harm. But, the way we use the terms local/global USE flags is confusing. They can mean that a flag has a package-specific vs global meaning, or the terms can mean that it is recommended that the flag be enabled at the package.use level vs at the make.conf level. To be fair to you, until very recently the first meaning was the most common. People are talking more about the second meaning of late because of problems that happen when people try to tweak fairly detailed settings like gtk3 at the global level. > >> I'd be tempted to even say to not have gtk3 but instead call the flag >> chromium-gtk3 or whatever so that it becomes very difficult to put in >> the global config. However, that goes against our general principle >> of letting the user break their system and keep the pieces if they >> think they know what they're doing. If somebody WANTS to test out a >> gtk3-only system or whatever they should have the freedom to do so, >> understanding that testing sometimes uncovers problems. > > I actually also think that there should be a single USE flag for building on > gtk3, called gtk3. calling it "(packagename)-gtk3" is a bit redundant, and > also flies in the face of having a single global flag with a coherent > purpose. > The only reason for doing it the other way would be to make it harder for users to shoot themselves in the foot by setting these flags in make.conf. They'd have to put 50 flags in make.conf and not just one. However, in general Gentoo operates under the principle that while we should avoid surprising the user, we shouldn't actually make it hard for the user to override our decisions when they feel it is best. -- Rich
