Too late On Wednesday, March 28, 2012 11:02:21 PM UTC+2, j wrote: > > -1 for moving to stackoverflow. Why do we need another site? I have been > using Google groups for years, no issues so far. What do we get by moving > to stakoverflow? Does it work on Android tablet or something else that we > need to know that is so special about it? > > On Monday, February 13, 2012 3:49:47 PM UTC-5, Ikai Lan wrote: >> >> Supercobra, >> >> I share your concerns about streamlining the user experience. As it >> stands, the user experience isn't great: you have groups, StackOverflow, >> billing issues forms, abuse forms, the public issues tracker, Google >> Groups, Reddit ... I could probably go on. The move to StackOverflow isn't >> necessarily making things more complicated, as our documentation will to >> updated to reflect that it is the primary destination for code questions - >> and in exchange, the Python/Java groups will be placed into read-only. >> We've done this with other products at Google such as Android and >> experienced overwhelming success - not only will App Engine Java questions >> be exposed to developers following App Engine, they will also be exposed to >> tens of thousands of Java developers on StackOverflow. And the tooling! The >> tooling will allow us to identify where we need better learning resources, >> or where the product needs improvements. We could certainly build this >> ourselves, but that detracts from our ability to answer questions, launch >> features, and improve the documentation. There are always tradeoffs in >> those scenarios. >> >> Hope this helps, >> >> -- >> Ikai Lan >> Developer Programs Engineer, Google App Engine >> plus.ikailan.com >> >> >> >> On Mon, Feb 13, 2012 at 11:04 AM, Gregory D'alesandre >> <gr...@google.com>wrote: >> >>> Hi Mos, >>> >>> Google is absolutely committed to App Engine and part of the reason we >>> are moving the Java/Python groups to StackOverflow is to have better, more >>> consolidated answers to questions. While it might be possible for Google >>> to build its own tool tailed to questions and answers, we really like >>> StackOverflow in part because it is where a lot of developers go in general >>> to get answers to questions. As I've talked about on this group before, we >>> currently have essentially 2 support options: Premier Accounts (for >>> $500/month) or StackOverflow / Groups where the community can support it >>> and Googlers will sometimes answer questions. The first has an SLA and the >>> second does not. So, in response to Google investing in better enterprise >>> support, I hope that answers the question. >>> >>> In terms of the concern that this means we are trying to deprecate App >>> Engine. I can honestly and frankly say that there are no plans to do so, >>> quite the opposite, we are growing! Right now we are trying to consolidate >>> a variety of places to get answers into 1 to improve how people get >>> questions answered. We are keeping this group (google-appengine) because >>> it is a great place for discussions, but when it comes to asking a question >>> and getting an answer, we believe StackOverflow is a product more suited to >>> do this. >>> >>> Johan and Ikai both work on the App Engine team so their word is as >>> official as mine, but I figured hearing it from more people might help. >>> >>> Greg D'Alesandre >>> Senior Product Manager, Google App Engine >>> >>> PS - Nice app Andrin, I'm already signed up! :) >>> >>> >>> On Mon, Feb 13, 2012 at 6:35 AM, Mos <mosa...@googlemail.com> wrote: >>> >>>> +111 >>>> absolute agreement; I would like to hear an official statement from >>>> Google regarding long time commitment to GAE ( incl. plans regarding >>>> adequate support options). >>>> >>>> Google, has the best developers in the world. It has so much money to >>>> burn. It has the best internet-infrastructure on this planet. >>>> If Google would like, I'm sure a self implemented "StackOverflow" for >>>> Google-Products would be ready in three month from now. >>>> And now they decide to outsource this one to the .NET based >>>> StackOverflow, that just lost his founder and brain Jeff Atwood? >>>> >>>> That really doesn't look like Google has any plans to invest in better >>>> enterprise support or make GAE a first class Google product. >>>> >>>> I hope I'm wrong.... >>>> >>>> >>>> On Sun, Feb 12, 2012 at 12:21 AM, Supercobra Thatbytes < >>>> superco...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>> I think this is a terrible idea because it makes people check 2 places >>>>> and subscribe to 2 boards. Newcomers to this discussion will have a hard >>>>> time knowing about this. >>>>> >>>>> App Engine team does put enough resources for community and customer >>>>> support. I have a paid app and I cannot get my simple billing questions >>>>> answered. In the billing interface, there is no link or phone # to use. >>>>> Just a link to this forum... unless we pay become a Premier Account for >>>>> $500 / month but first we need to talk to the sales team. Really? So >>>>> desperate users in need of urgent help post questions on forums and if >>>>> they >>>>> make enough noise and show enough distress, others users help them and >>>>> sometimes, in with their immense goodwill and too little available time, >>>>> Google Engineers help too. >>>>> >>>>> Google App Engine team says, 'well support is best effort around here >>>>> or get a Premier Account'. I think this is not the way to do it. Together >>>>> with Google engineers, WE make Google products what they are because of >>>>> our >>>>> deep involvement. >>>>> >>>>> This lack of support is general across most Google products. Our >>>>> company uses many Google products that are now business critical for us: >>>>> Google Apps for Business, Checkout, Analytics, and more. With all of >>>>> those, >>>>> if you have a problem, well, it's your problem because you cannot contact >>>>> anyone. >>>>> >>>>> So is it hard to provide good support? Not for every company. We use >>>>> Amazon S3 and Cloud Service. We are a little tiny customers for them. The >>>>> other day we had a problem that brought down our SaaS app. Emergency. >>>>> What >>>>> do you do when that happens? Well, simple. On Amazon AWS console, click >>>>> on >>>>> 'call me I need help now' button and a human calls you within a minute. >>>>> >>>>> So Google: use a tiny portion of the immense net revenue to add more >>>>> community and product support engineers. I bet that will improve the >>>>> bottom >>>>> line even further. >>>>> >>>>> One last BIG concern. One of the things that first get dropped when a >>>>> product is going to be retired (i.e. killed) is developer and community >>>>> support. Java and Python appengine discussion groups are being deprecated >>>>> and dev support is moved to Stack Overflow. That does not sound like App >>>>> Engine is going forward to me. More like a huge red flag. Is App Engine >>>>> business in danger? >>>>> >>>>> Telling Google users to use Stack Overflow is the equivalent of >>>>> displaying a big sign on Google Groups home page saying "use Stack >>>>> Overflow, it's much better than what we have". >>>>> >>>>> As other users suggested, Google should improve this forum software >>>>> and make it work more like Stack Overflow and not move there... >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups "Google App Engine" group. >>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msg/google-appengine/-/-CMqxkvEya4J. >>>>> >>>>> To post to this group, send email to google-appengine@googlegroups.com >>>>> . >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>>> google-appengine+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/google-appengine?hl=en. >>>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "Google App Engine" group. >>>> To post to this group, send email to google-appengine@googlegroups.com. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>> google-appengine+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>> http://groups.google.com/group/google-appengine?hl=en. >>>> >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "Google App Engine" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to google-appengine@googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> google-appengine+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/google-appengine?hl=en. >>> >> >>
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