My Friend,
You misunderstand me. I do not oppose the wisdom of Sawallish, or
anyone else. I merely wished to share and perhaps enrich (which is as they
may or may not perceive it) my colleagues and companions on the list with
another point of view (which I believed likely correct, and said
"apparently" written) as I have been so enriched--by Thayer and others,
including Sawallish (through you). Surely you do not casually demean Thayer.
It is not important to me, personally, whose hand the Sonata comes from, or
is it likely we will ever for certain know that fact. The Sonata is the
sonata. We share on the list whatever knowledge, insight, culture and
experience we might have, do we not? My reply was intended as nothing more
than that.
Shel
----- Original Message -----
From: "Hans" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "'The Horn List'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Saturday, February 07, 2004 7:04 AM
Subject: RE: [Hornlist] De Kruftt Sonata
Why do you oppose the knowledge of approved well known musicians &
musicologists ? Have you been there in 1800 at the Kaerntnertortheater
in Vienna ? No, you have not. But you should believe those who know the
style of both composers much better perhaps than you will ever know, as
both have easy access to the whole oeuvre. By the way, the autograph of
op.17 was preserved here in Munich, but in private hands, so it got
destroyed by allied bombers in 1944.
=========================================================
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
Of skirshner
Sent: Saturday, February 07, 2004 1:02 PM
To: The Horn List
Subject: Re: [Hornlist] De Kruftt Sonata
Beethoven himself apparently wrote the horn part to the Sonata.
I can not locate my copy of Thayer's biography of Beethoven (english
translation) (to confirm my memory) and have not read in many years the
passages I now refer to, in paraphrase: Beethoven was scheduled to
participate in a musical performance. He learned that Punto was to
arrive in
town the evening before the performance. Beethoven met with Punto when
he
arrived and asked if he would participate in the performance the next
day,
that Beethoven would write something for him. Punto agreed, asking when
his
part would be ready. Beethoven promised it for noon the next day, and
it
was thereafter written and delivered as promised, and the two rehearsed
it
with Beethoven having written for himself but a few notations (as to
what
constituted the piano part). They peformed it that evening and
thereafter
took it on the road, in current terminology. One performance was
reviewed in
part as follows: We all know of the great Giovanni Punto, but who is
this
Herr Beethover?
Shel
----- Original Message -----
From: "Hans Pizka" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "'The Horn List'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Saturday, January 31, 2004 3:35 AM
Subject: RE: [Hornlist] De Kruftt Sonata
The Birdalone publication is a reprint not a transcription. Yes, you are
correct with your assumption. The Krufft & the Beethoven Sonatas are
rather piano sonatas with an obligato horn part. That was the usual way
then. And the piano parts are rather challenging as both composers were
extremely good pianists.
I had discussed the Beethoven Sonata with Wolfgang Sawallisch, and he
assumed that the horn part were not by Beethoven himself but by Giovanni
Punto (J.V.Stich), just set atop of the piano part. So it became a
combination-composition by a famous author plus another famous
co-author. One has to remember that the opus number 17 reflects to a
rather early composition by Beethoven.
=============================================================
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Saturday, January 31, 2004 9:52 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [Hornlist] De Kruftt Sonata
Hans, I heard somewhere that this piece was originally a sonata for
piano and
horn accompaniment and not a sonata for horn and piano accompaniment.
Is
that true?
Also I think Birdalone music has another transcription of the piece in
E, and
it's fairly clean. The only problem is the piano music doesn't have the
horn
part.
I've played the piece before. It's very beautiful, and in E it shines
quite
nicely. In F and in Eb it doesn't seem to have the same effect.
-William
_______________________________________________
post: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
set your options at
http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/skirshner%40ameritech.net
_______________________________________________
post: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
set your options at
http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/hans.pizka%40t-online.de
_______________________________________________
post: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
set your options at
http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/skirshner%40ameritech.net
_______________________________________________
post: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
