You can link to a page in a PDF. -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3 עַם יִשְׂרָאֵל חַי נֵ֣צַח יִשְׂרָאֵ֔ל לֹ֥א יְשַׁקֵּ֖ר
________________________________________ From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List <[email protected]> on behalf of Colin Paice <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, October 16, 2025 2:49 AM To: [email protected] <[email protected]> Subject: Re: Newer SYSPROGs (was Re: Political topics) External Message: Use Caution I write blogs and refer to documentation. It is so useful when you can link directly to the topic or paragraph, rather than a chapter or larger entity. I use PDF for reading, but HTML pages to link to a topic. On Thu, Oct 16, 2025, 07:51 Abe Kornelis <[email protected]> wrote: > All, > > For documentation to be useful, the information in it has to be findable. > > Creating good structure and properly indexing and cross-referencing all > information in any sizeable library is a daunting task. > > I am currently upgrading the documentation for our team's product. > Using AI (here we go again) helps, although results are still tentative. > I mean, the jury is still out, but it looks like it will help reduce the > task > from 'Herculean' to 'manageable'. I hope it will. > > Software without documentation is as useful as gasoline without a car. > > Kind regards & Happy programming! > Abe > === > > > On 16/10/2025 00:16, Phil Smith III wrote: > > That's an excellent point! "Documentation? What documentation??" My wife > bought a neck massager that has an 18-page manual, and I was astounded that > it was that long in this modren day and age. > > > > The shift from "Here's the IBM doc library for <x>" to "Just Google it" > has also led to reduced focus on structuring the documentation library, I > fear. That's surely not fixable: doc is seen as a pure cost, I think. IBM > is not going to rehire the legions of Information Developers that used to > exist. > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List <[email protected]> On > Behalf Of Lennie Bradshaw > > Sent: Wednesday, October 15, 2025 2:06 PM > > To: [email protected] > > Subject: Re: Newer SYSPROGs (was Re: Political topics) > > > > Sadly, much software on other platforms today has far less > documentation. This leads to low expectations that an answer might be > found. Instead, answers are found in forums. Perhaps we need to emphasise > that IBM mainframe systems manuals are rather more comprehensive and can be > used as a first source of information. > > > > Lennie > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List <[email protected]> On > Behalf Of David Purdy > > Sent: 15 October 2025 18:25 > > To: [email protected] > > Subject: Re: Newer SYSPROGs (was Re: Political topics) > > > > Our first response to a question is;What did the manual say? > > Our second response is:Don't use ChatGPT > > On Wednesday, October 15, 2025 at 12:59:09 PM EDT, Jousma, David < > [email protected]> wrote: > > > > Changed the subject to keep Darren’s feathers down… > > > > As entrenched system programmers most of us are from decades of > experience, we really need to take a softer tone that some here have > mentioned. First off, let’s not scare away newbies from the platform, but > sometimes just a pointer to which manual they can go looking at is all that > is needed. > > > > My mentor used to ask me what I was looking at that I didn’t > understand. And if I replied that I hadn’t looked, well then he pointed me > to the manual. For me, I’ve learned more about everything else by > searching the manual for what I really wanted. After awhile it all starts > to fit together. > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________ > > > > Dave Jousma > > > > Vice President | Director, Technology Engineering > > > > Fifth Third Bank | 1830 East Paris Ave, SE | Grand Rapids, MI 49546 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List <[email protected]> on > behalf of Seymour J Metz <[email protected]> > > Date: Wednesday, October 15, 2025 at 12:44 PM > > To: [email protected] <[email protected]> > > Subject: Re: Political topics > > > > CAUTION EXTERNAL EMAIL > > This message came from outside your organization. > > DO NOT open attachments or click on links from unknown senders or > unexpected emails. > > Report Suspicious< > https://us-phishalarm-ewt.proofpoint.com/EWT/v1/MwwqYLOC6b6whF7V!odOGFh_lgiBhHko4rfivV4VzOYlSakFScohREKt1lGITdYXTA3WpPdeyc3ve7qYrUUIMoYKt8dq79EP_rOs4II3PnV-64oPJWXSHVJdG0BRgyS3QNjll33pZ7KDU7U5tLInALgIXLoigtw$ > > > > > > > > I used to phrase it as "Which part of the explanation is unclear"; maybe > they legit did RTFM and the information was ambiguous or flat wrong. > > > > Yes, that last does happen, and I can't reaonably expect a user to > recognize and deal with it. > > > > -- > > Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz > > > https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://mason.gmu.edu/*smetz3__;fg!!MwwqYLOC6b6whF7V!nnbo8essFOHBsvihlavRW_OmYqJjnXkV9_AJ2xi6-MtH1HpuaWh1ei55btIwI8zepSAALYak-AHutQ9P$ > > עַם יִשְׂרָאֵל חַי > > נֵ֣צַח יִשְׂרָאֵ֔ל לֹ֥א יְשַׁקֵּ֖ר > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________ > > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List <[email protected]> on > behalf of Jay Maynard <[email protected]> > > Sent: Wednesday, October 15, 2025 9:34 AM > > To: [email protected] <[email protected]> > > Subject: Re: Political topics > > > > > > External Message: Use Caution > > > > > > I try hard to always say which FM and where the information is in it > when saying RTFM. > > > > On Wed, Oct 15, 2025 at 8:06 AM Seymour J Metz <[email protected]> wrote: > > > >> Always verify that the relevant information is in TFM before saying > RTFM. > >> In fact, verify that it is not hidden away. > >> > > -- > > Jay Maynard > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send > email to [email protected] with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN > > > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send > email to [email protected] with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN > > > > > > > > This e-mail transmission contains information that is confidential and > may be privileged. It is intended only for the addressee(s) named above. > If you receive this e-mail in error, please do not read, copy or > disseminate it in any manner. If you are not the intended recipient, any > disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this > information is prohibited. Please reply to the message immediately by > informing the sender that the message was misdirected. After replying, > please erase it from your computer system. Your assistance in correcting > this error is appreciated. > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send > email to [email protected] with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send > email to [email protected] with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send > email to [email protected] with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > > send email to [email protected] with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to [email protected] with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [email protected] with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN ---------------------------------------------------------------------- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [email protected] with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
