Hi Lars, Thanks for your detailed response. My thoughts inline below....
--Kris On Sun, Dec 16, 2012 at 3:42 AM, Lars Strojny <l...@strojny.net> wrote: > Hi Kris, > > thanks for your response. Just a short note: I'm not in any ways > officially related to PHP FIG, except that I find it personally to be a > good initiative. Rest of the answers below. > > Am 16.12.2012 um 11:50 schrieb Kris Craig <kris.cr...@gmail.com>: > > > My one concern with this idea is that it could give the erroneous > impression that the coding style standards your group advocates are > endorsed, implicitly or otherwise, by the PHP Group. There is no > "official" standard when it comes to spaces vs. tabs and whether to place > brackets on the same line, for example. Given how many different competing > standards there are out there, I fear that we could run the risk of showing > favoritism by "legitimizing" one standards group but not others. > > I see what you mean. On the other hand though, a majority of important PHP > projects are organized there. We (as core developers) can’t ignore what > these projects are discussing and I don't think we should. And if we have a > saying in that, why shouldn’t we endorse such an initiative. > Here's the problem: Who decides what constitutes an "important" PHP project? And as for the minority of "important" projects, do we then say to them that the standards they've chosen to adopt are invalid now? I fear that that's the message we'd be sending, perhaps unintentionally, if php.netin any way officially endorsed this group. I like the idea of consistency, but I believe php.net should remain neutral when it comes to userland PHP coding style. > > > Personally, and I'm just speaking for myself here, I think you guys > over-reached with your PSR-2 style guidelines. I totally agree with your > goal of aiding consistency, but these standards are inherently arbitrary > and it makes me very uneasy to see anyone proclaim that such-and-such is > the "correct" style of doing something in PHP. The only solution I can see > is to create several different style rulesets to reflect all the noteworthy > styles in popular use. Of course, then you run the risk of undermining the > whole consistency goal. > > I, again, can’t speak for PHP FIG, but it seems to me like the survey > technique worked out pretty well. So PSR-1 and PSR-2 are what most projects > are doing anyway. > Most "important" projects, that is. But even if we accept that standard, completely ignoring less common but still prevelant standards is a deal-breaker for me. If FIG wants to become the "accepted" standards authority, then they will have to represent *everyone*, not just the majority or those whom they deem to be "important." > > I wouldn't be adverse to us linking to your project, so long as we do > the same for any others that crop-up and we make it clear that these > third-party standards are not officially endorsed by the PHP Group. I also > think it's cool if anyone here wants to join your project and contribute, > so long as that person is representing him/her self. > > See point above. We can’t ignore what major players in the ecosystem do > and I don't think we should. I would much rather see PHP core have a saying > in their decisions than standing by the lines and letting things happen > (which might even be counter-productive for core). > Since FIG is not a universally accepted authority, I see no point in us getting involved. If later on it incorporates other standards and gains prevailing legitimacy throughout the userland community, then I might be more open to the idea.
