Yes India is a democratic country and yes we have a very long tradition of discussion and debate. But have we not had enough of discussion on this topic?
I would like to share my thinking by quoting a native saying which roughly translated means If ocean is churned, you get nectar; but if a cess pool is churned, then only rotten smell emanates. Let me also highlight the few positives that have come out of it: 1. Dr Tino's work in the area of potable water. It can be worth emulating in arid districts like Palamau and Hazaribagh. I also very much liked his concept of honouring local sentiments by putting Ganesha images. 2. Dr Dhuni Soren's very sensible suggestions. Sir we all need your vast international exposure and your maturity in channelising the considerable energy of the group. If the normally silent majority also feels that we needs to move on, do speak up. People still interested on this topic could take it up offline. Thanks --- In [email protected], isaac verghese <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Hi Vikash, > > I am not sure if you are married. But if you had to send your child to a good school back in the 70's u wud have sent them to a Missionary school mate. You cannot deny that. U seem to be one of those guys who was put down by Convent educated kids.I am sure the Loreto girls gave you the boot, right!!! Now you are using Missionaries as your scape goat/punching bag to get back. > > ********************************************************************* *****************************Questions raised were > > 1) Did the missionaries in Lux'borg force you to convert? ( U have no answer to that) > 2) What proof do you have that they are paid to convert?( U have no proof either) > 3) Can you prove that Missionaries forcibly/covertly converted adibasis? ( U cannot) > 4) How do you know if the Adibasis's didnot convert willingly? ( U donot) > > U certainly have a weakness for shots below the belt Vikash. U are not even good at dodging and deflecting. > > What is your hidden agenda Vikash? ********************************************************************* **** > For the rest of the Gang ,why do you want to stop this debate.This is not rude or unpleasant. Its just a few guys trying to clear the air and I think this will lead to something better. If there is one thing I appreciate about Vikash, it is his tenacity. I would like him to keep it up. That's a very good quality. > > By the way I respect OSHO. I think he was a remarkable man grossly misunderstood cos of his twilight days shenanigans. A very intelligent Being who lost his way towards the end. > > Cheers > Isaac > > PS: A temple, a church, a mosque, a sysnagogue is a hospital for the sinners, it's not a social club for the saints. > > > vikash singh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Dear Isaac, > > You have put some basic points here. > > a) Christian is better religon according to you(see > your statement "People willingly accepted a > better religion that freed them from the oppression > of a caste system which primarily extolled"). > > You are blind person who thinks his/her religon is > better than others(Very typical of missioniary, > similar to Muslim terrorists). > > b) We should teach our Adivasi brothers, take money of > missioniaries and get their schools and later throw > them out of jharkhand. > > c) We know :once conversion law: is in Jhakhand, You > people will be without JOB, so your boss(Church) will > not pay your salary. > > Jai Jharkhand > > Vikash S. > > --- isaac verghese <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > This is getting funnier by the day and humourous > > aswell. Vikash goes to a Small town in Luxembourg > > and meets a fanatic Christian Missionary who tries > > to convert and bapize him on the spot. > > > > Vikash when you politely denied to accept their > > gentle invitation, did they chase you and hound you > > with a cross? That did not happen right. They left > > you too.Did they try to forcibly convert you using > > physical might. That didnot happen either ,right. > > They were merely practicing their conviction out of > > love.If u were not interested that was cool with > > them.Did they give you a few dollars, rice,wine to > > convert you.? NO even that did not happen.Is that > > conversion? Your definition of conversion is > > dramatically warped. > > > > How do you know they were paid Vikash? Did they > > show you their payslip? One conversion = 100 > > Euros.Its all a figment of your imagination isn't > > it? U are a liar, Vikash if you have no proof. > > > > The Missionaries in India never forced anyone to > > convert to Christianity. People willingly accepted a > > better religion that freed them from the oppression > > of a caste system which primarily extolled the > > Brahmins and the Rajputs. Everyone else was down > > trodden. In Christianity there is no such class. > > Everyone is the same and so people willingly sought > > refuge.The RICE was not used to convert it was > > merely used to feed the poor and the hungry as is > > written in The Holy Bible. > > > > > > Do the Americans and the Europeans complain about > > being converted to Hindusim by dubious Hindu leaders > > like Acharya Rajneesh and a few others.No.They just > > took it in the stride, because it was their own > > personal choice just like the adibasi's of > > chattisgarh. > > > > Noone is fooled by Missionaries mate.Donot think > > you are very intelligent, u maybe educated but it is > > not the same. People make their own intelligent > > choices. Donot assume that the uneducated adibasis > > who were converted were not intelligent. They were > > probably more intelligent than you and I. Not more > > educated like you and I but more intelligent. > > Education doesnot make one intelligent. Education > > only makes you more ignorant.Intelligence comes from > > your Being.It is easy to fool an educated mind like > > yours but u can never fool an intelligent being. > > > > So next time you go to Lux'bg try to be an Indian > > first and then a Hindu, christian, muslim whatever. > > If someone thinks his mission in life is to convert > > everyone to christianity just respect his mission, > > wish him the best and leave him alone, as long as he > > is not forcing you.Thats the beauty and essence of > > Hinduism. But only true Hindus will know that. > > > > > > Cheers > > isaac > > > > > > > > > > singh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > My Dear beloved friends bear with me. Even > > after my > > several humble request Mr. Gladson is creating > > hatred > > talk by showing that he is peace loving creature who > > is following god jesus et al. > > > > > ***************************************************** > > > > I will tell you one story, I was in luxemborg(Small > > country in Europe), and i was standing on bus > > station, > > there were group of people(New joinees, same as > > trainees in software) who had converge from all over > > world in Luxemborg to learn about "How to convert > > people". One of folks from that group, when say a > > brown skin(That is me and my wife), started behaving > > polite and abnormal, trying to have friendship with > > me. > > > > He mentioned that if required he can come to our > > house > > and talk. > > > > we casually told him to search for another target > > for > > conversion. We are not interested. > > > > Now analysis: > > These people (like Mr. Gladson et al) are trained, > > experts in trying to convert people, they are paid > > for > > it. There Job is to convert people. > > > > How they do it: > > a) They will try to befriend you, talk about love, > > peace. > > b) They wil create fear "That govt or rich people > > will > > take your land", you will be poor etc... > > c) They will create CHAOS and try to demoralize the > > local people. > > d) They will conduct workshop showing that it is for > > good of people, But internally they will start > > working > > on converting people. > > e) They will show the advantage of converting into > > christianity(Money/Good future) > > > > We now need to make strict laws that these people > > are > > not fooled by these missioniaries. > > They are goondas( rowdy) indulge in cheating people > > w.r.t to God. > > > > with best regards > > Vikash S. > > > > --- Gladson Dungdung <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > My dear beloved friends bear with me. Even after > > my > > > several humble request Mr. Venkat is not stopping > > > his hatred talk. Now I believe that he does not > > > understand about humbleness, love, peace, > > > brotherhood and list goes on. > > > > > > My dearest Venkat let me tell you frankly that we > > > all are involved in conversion activities > > including > > > your parents, you and me therefore don't just > > blame > > > the Missionaries. When you born in this word you > > > were just a human baby bit unfortunatly born in > > the > > > family who belives in cetain religion. They > > started > > > conversion work and you were converted to certain > > > religion by your parents and when you grown you > > were > > > told that you belong to certain religion and you > > > also started behaving accordingly. > > > > > > Similary, you would do with you children, cousings > > > or relatives children. In this case, why don't > > your > > > children blame on you for converting them in the > > > religion which you belive and file a case against > > > you in the Police station and at the end your > > whole > > > family including your children would be in the > > Jail > > > because they did not have permission from the > > > goverment (freedom of Religion as you advocate) > > for > > > this conversion? There is nothing wrong but the > > > problem is you speak two languages at a time. when > > > you convert people you glorify it is like you won > > > the battle and if other do the same work you coin > > it > > > as a crime. Be rational and rascal. I would again > > > request to you please don't play with the people's > > > centiments. If you want to do something do for the > > > betterment of the "Humanity" which is all above of > > > the religion, caste, creed, gender, regionalism > > and > > > list goes on. > > > > > > rgds > > > Gladson Dungdung > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Fri, 02 May 2008 ven wrote : > > > >Nachiketa > > > > > > > >Why don't you migrate and take your anti tribal > > > religion..proc christian > > > >agenda somewhere else? > > > >Why don't you tell the Christian missionaires to > > > offer service without > > > >attempting to destroy native religins and gods > > and > > > beliefs. > > > >Tell them to only concentrate on development and > > > not mix it with religion. > > > > > > > >The problem originates with the missionaries as > > > this video amply > > > >demonstrates of Christian missionary work in > > tribal > > > === message truncated === > > > > > > > P V Isaac, > Home:9874 1819 Mob 0415 144 981. > > " What you resist, will persist" > > > http://www.jharkhand.org.in/forum
