BTW, Kirk and just about everybody on EJB-INTEREST thought I was working in
the evening
late what they overlooked was what I had explained.
Something Booche stated was beyond the intellect of the developer.
The funniest thing is the one who wrote I wouldn't get didn't get it.
when no body understood OO behvaiour that is when I started going
jndi.lookup("mycompanyname");
When I went to the JINI line they didn't understand including John Whitehead
who suggested I use a buddy system until I got the reviews of two Doug Lea's
book.
Ask Greedy - fly to explain it you any one doesn't understand , he can be
found on servlet interest.
Best Regards,
Zahid
-----Original Message-----
From: cupid1 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: 19 September 2001 14:30
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC: Terrorist attacks
Arvind,
Thanks for the insight. I know that India has been and is a great country.
It does not mean that it is a perfect country. Same is true for Pakistan.
Countries represents people and you know that we are the same people. I cant
just sit around and read to some Indians badmouthing Pakistan on this list
all the time.
BTW we are not religious fanatics other wise we will be supporting Taliban
not the USA in this crises. In a recent survey about 70% Pakistani supported
USA against Taliban.
I appreciate the fact that India is a secular country by constitution and
hopeful that one day they will be able to implement the constitution to its
fullest extent.
Since India is such a great country, I wonder why they don't let the people
of Kashmir decide if they like to be part of India? Just Like in Canada
during the past election they took a risk and had referendum on Quebec. I
hope the great nation of Indian would muster up such a moral courage and
bring and end to the killings and sufferings to the innocent civilians who
speak up their mind. Regards.
shuaib
----- Original Message -----
From: Aravind <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Wednesday, September 19, 2001 1:06 AM
Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC: Terrorist attacks
hello shuaib,
here are few points pakistanis should keep in mind
muslims in india are living happier than pakistani people here they enjoy
lot of freedom and the falicities offered to religious minority people
few unwanted things happened in india against minority people but with that
u should not conclude that india is against christians or muslims. pakistan
media wouldnt have told u about the following things
- a muslim has become the president india. can a hindu become a president
in pakistan?
- a muslim was a supreme court judge in india. can a hindu become a supreme
court judge in pakistan?
- a muslim is the man behind indian nuclear programme and important defence
related research, can a hindu will be put in such position in pakistan?
- lot of muslims here has become as governers, chief ministers, union
ministers etc in india
first u think of improving your country. dont fell as victim of religious
fundamentalism. dont believe what pakistan media's hate campaign against
india.
and i wonder pakistan acting like caring about kashmiris. u should note
that kashmir was a peace state and is now being spoiled by pakistan
sponsored terrorists.
Aravind
----- Original Message -----
From: cupid1 <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2001 11:40 PM
Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC: Terrorist attacks
Milindi,
YOU WISH!!!!
Here are few other things that you forgot to mention about Pakistan:
1- When Indra Gandhi was in bed with communist Breznev and they were trying
to end the free and civilized society from the face of earth by spreading
communism, It was Pakistan who stood up and became the last fort of the free
world. Pakistan fought, wounded and suffered but defeated the red army in
the mountains of Afghanistan with the help of USA.
USSR evaporated because of that great sacrifice that Pakistan made, but USSR
's ally India would not swallow the defeat and keep badmouthing Pakistan,
till today.
2- Because of the last week's great tragedy here, US turned again to
Pakistan and Pakistan has always proven as Friend in need for the free and
civilized world in that region and Pakistan is upto its responsible
character always. India can not see and bear this since he has dark secret
in Kashmir.
3- The oppressed people of Kashmir who are being killed, tortured, raped and
maimed by the Indian army look upto Pakistan as the torch bearer of freedom
and liberty. Pakistan will always voice the cries of oppressed people who
are being strangulated by the state sponsored terrorism. That is not what
India likes about Pakistan, so they wish they could erase Pakistan from face
of the earth.
By the way do you remember cast system, the worst type of slavery, which is
imposed on a huge population of its own people by India? Is that the
civilization you are taliking about?
Do you remember that Ayodhiya mosque was demolished by the Indian to build a
Temple instead? Is it any better than Taliban demolishing the Buddha
statues? Do you know that Christians, churches and priests are being
attacked and killed in India every day even today? Is that your brand of
civilization?
Do you remember what happened to Sikh 's when Indian army attacked the
Golden Temple? And do you remember what happened to Sikh's when Indra Gandhi
was gunned down? More than 5000 innocent Sikh 's were dragged from their
homes, shops and schools and were butchered on the street of New Delhi,
Bombay and all over the India. If that is your standard of a civilized world
than Pakistani rather be "UNCIVILIZED".
Pakistan has been and will be a friend of the free world whether India likes
it or not. We are not perfect but we know what is right and what is wrong
and we know how to stand up for what we believe in.
shuaib
----- Original Message -----
From: Milind <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2001 3:03 AM
Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC: Terrorist attacks
If the USA and the civilized world is serious about finishing terrorism then
it should focus on finishing Pakistan first.Taleban is a puppet real culprit
is Pakistan.Pakistan is a country which supports narcotics trade
officially.In fact ISI runs on narcotics money.They have shielded smugglers
and thugs who ve ran away from India.They train terrorists from all over the
world.
It's a biggest menace for the civilized world.
Finish Pakistan and more than 80% of terrorism related problems would be
solved.
Milind
----- Original Message -----
From: iZone Infotech <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2001 11:08 AM
Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC: Terrorist attacks
Great dear friend. The Coal calling the kettle black.
Pakistan and terrorism. I do not want to match words with you because I am
talking peace. But the culprits of Mumbai serial blast which killed many
people are safe in Karachi. Dawoon Ibrahim, the biggest smuggler and killer
of this region is safe in Karachi. Contrary to the Pak propaganda, many
killings of the innocents in Kashmir is done by terrorists(as far as India
is concerned) and Freedom Fighters (as far as Pakistan President is
concerned), including the killing happened 2 days ago.
I am not saying that India (as a country) is perfect. I am saying that ALL
kinds of terrorism is bad, including state sponsored or instigated
terrorism. About giving right to choose, ARE YOU GIVING THE RIGHT TO SIND
PROVINCE?
About Pakistan joining/helping USA, well, you better do it or FACE THE MUSIC
from USA. Dear friend, DO YOU HAVE ANY CHOICE. You are not doing it
because you like to eradicate terrorism. Moreover, your Military ruler is
scared that he will be overthrown, if he helps USA. Your President is
certainly NOT sitting in an envious position. Trouble is sure for you,
either from USA or from Taliban. Both were your 'bed partners' till very
recently.
Leave it there. We must end violence. 'How' is the million dollar
question.
Best Regards,
Dantus
----- Original Message -----
From: cupid1 <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: iZone Infotech <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2001 8:54 PM
Subject: Re: Re: OFF TOPIC: Terrorist attacks
Any one thought of what happened to the super powers who entered Afghanistan
in the past? That was the beginning of the end for them. Remember USSR,
remember GB? I am afraid that US is preparing to make the same mistake that
other super powers made before. Let me put it this way, will US ever try to
send its forces to Vietnam again? And trust me, Vietnam will seem like minor
league comparing to Afghanistan.
Afghanistan is not raid-able in military sense because of its terrain and
people. The terrain is so hostile that only Afghan people has to learn how
to live there. People are so fierce and independent that they never
surrender to foreign powers. They don't have armies because every one is
fighter including women and children. They might not have bread to eat but
they all own AK47. Fighting is part of their culture like cock tail parties
is part of western cultures. When they don't have any foreign power to fight
with, they start fighting with each other. I am afraid that once US forces
are there, they might control couple of cities like USSR did but then they
might suffer heavy causalities. Once they commit themselves they will not be
able to get out from there for years and that will cause them more
causalities. Is it worth to put more men and women of US army at risk? NO.
Please look some other ways then war.
One more thing, US suddenly falls in love, again, with Pakistan. As in the
past, Pakistan is on US side again. Pakistan was with USA when cold war was
raging and the Russian tanks rolled into Kabul and the free world was
menaced by the red army. India's Indra Gandhi was (figuratively speaking)
in bed with Brezneve of Moscow. China and Iran were hostile to USA and it
was only Pakistan who sided with USA and stood up to be the front line for
all the free world. Together we defeated the USSR and saved the world from
the communism. Then suddenly USA left and Pakistan was encountered with the
problems of aftermath of the war with Red Army. But it was ok because we
sided with USA because of ideas of freedom that we shared with USA. It was
not that we wanted to please any one rather it was our believes that we
fought for. We are suffering for that and countries like India are
badmouthing us. India never valued idea of freedom and justice. Siding with
communism, suppressing the huge population of its own with cast system,
which is worse than slavery, refusing to give Kashmir people right to choose
and terrorizing them with guns, rapes, jails and torture of all kind, having
a close economy which is a strip down version of socialism.
Once again it is Pakistan who is standing side by side with USA to fight
terrorism because as a nation we don't condone terrorism and killing
innocent people like being killed in Kashmir, USA and elsewhere.
shuaib
----- Original Message -----
From: iZone Infotech <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2001 5:21 AM
Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC: Terrorist attacks
I agree completely with your Afgan friend. It talks about the same thing as
I said earlier. If America has the power what they claim, it should capture
or eliminate Bin Laden and Taliban and not the poor Afgan people. The people
of Afganistan are equally victims of Taliban. Otherwise it will be a
repetition of IRAQ. Please remember, the people of IRAQ are still
sufferering but Saddam Hussain is having a ball. And the people of both the
countries are innocent, even more innocent than the people of America
because in America the President does what the people want. So, the people
have got a collective responsibility to the actions of the government. That
is not the case with Iraq and Afganistan.
Let's not kill more innocents.
Peace is everlasting. Violence brings more violence and there is no end to
it.
Somebody should forward the email of the Afgan friend to the President of
America.
JOIN TOGETHER FOR A PEACEFUL CO-EXISTANCE.
D. Joseph
----- Original Message -----
From: John Neil N. Sangalang <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2001 1:04 PM
Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC: Terrorist attacks
JUST WANT TO FORWARD THIS MESSAG FROM AN AFGHAN......
> Dear Colleagues,
>
> As we reflect upon the tragic events of this week and an
> appropriate "response," I thought you might like to see this
> letter from my college roommate, Tamim Ansary, who grew up
> in Afghanistan. I think he offers an interesting perspective
> on Bin Laden, the Taliban, and Afghanistan.
>
> Toivo Kallas
> Department of Biology & Microbiology
>
> Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2001 10:14:27 -0700
>
> Dear Friends,
>
> Yesterday I heard a lot of talk about "bombing Afghanistan
> back to the Stone Age." Ronn Owens, on KGO Talk Radio
> allowed that this would mean killing innocent people, people
> who had nothing to do with this atrocity, but "we're at war,
> we have to accept collateral damage," and he asked, "What
> else can we do? What is your suggestion?" Minutes later I
> heard a TV pundit discussing whether we "have the belly to
> do what must be done."
>
> And I thought about these issues especially hard because I
> am from Afghanistan, and even though I've lived here for 35
> years I've never lost track of what's been going on over
> there. So I want to share a few thoughts with anyone who
> will listen.
>
> I speak as one who hates the Taliban and Osama Bin Laden.
> There is no doubt in my mind that these people were
> responsible for the atrocity in New York. I fervently wish
> to see those monsters punished.
>
> But the Taliban and Ben Laden are not Afghanistan. They're
> not even the government of Afghanistan. The Taliban are a
> cult of ignorant psychotics who captured Afghanistan in 1997
> and have been holding the country in bondage ever since. Bin
> Laden is a political criminal with a master plan. When you
> think Taliban, think Nazis. When you think Bin Laden, think
> Hitler. And when
> you think "the people of Afghanistan" think "the Jews in the
> concentration camps." It's not only that the Afghan people
> had nothing to do with this atrocity. They were the first
> victims of the perpetrators. They would love for someone to
> eliminate the Taliban and clear out the rats nest of
> international thugs holed up in their country. I guarantee
> it.
>
> Some say, if that's the case, why don't the Afghans rise up
> and overthrow the Taliban themselves? The answer is, they're
> starved, exhausted, damaged, and incapacitated. A few years
> ago, the United Nations estimated that there are 500,000
> disabled orphans in Afghanistan--a country with no economy,
> no food. Millions of Afghans are widows of the approximately
> two million men killed during the war with the Soviets. And
> the Taliban has been executing these women for being women
> and have buried some of their opponents alive in mass
> graves. The soil of Afghanistan is littered with land mines
> and almost all
> the farms have been destroyed . The Afghan people have tried
> to overthrow the Taliban. They haven't been able to.
>
> We come now to the question of bombing Afghanistan back to
> the Stone Age. Trouble with that scheme is, it's already
> been done. The Soviets took care of it . Make the Afghans
> suffer? They're already suffering. Level their houses? Done.
> Turn their schools into piles of rubble? Done. Eradicate
> their hospitals? Done. Destroy their infrastructure? There
> is no infrastructure.
> Cut them off from medicine and health care? Too late.
> Someone already did all that.
>
> New bombs would only land in the rubble of earlier bombs.
> Would they at least get the Taliban? Not likely. In today's
> Afghanistan, only the Taliban eat, only they have the means
> to move around. They'd slip away and hide. (They hae
> already, I hear.) Maybe the bombs would get some of those
> disabled
> orphans, they don't move too fast, they don't even have
> wheelchairs. But flying over Kabul and dropping bombs
> wouldn't really be a strike against the criminals who did
> this horrific thing. Actually it would be making common
> cause with the Taliban--by raping once again the people
> they've been raping all this time
>
> So what else can be done, then? Let me now speak with true
> fear and trembling. The only way to get Bin Laden is to go
> in there with ground troops. I think that when people speak
> of "having the belly to do what needs to be done" many of
> them are thinking in terms of having the belly to kill as
> many as needed. They are thinking about overcoming moral
> qualms about killing innocent people. But it's the belly to
> die not kill that's actually on the table. Americans will
> die in a land war to get Bin Laden. And not just because
> some Americans would die fighting their way through
> Afghanistan to Bin Laden's hideout. It's much bigger than
> that, folks. To get any troops to Afghanistan, we'd have to
> go through Pakistan. Would they let us? Not likely. The
> conquest of Pakistan would have to be first. Will other
> Muslim nations just stand by? You see where I'm going. The
> invasion approach is a flirtation with global war between
> Islam and the West.
>
> And that is Bin Laden's program. That's exactly what he
> wants and why he did this thing. Read his speeches and
> statements. It's all right there. AT the moment, of course,
> "Islam" as such does not exist. There are Muslims and there
> are Muslim countries, but no such political entity as Islam.
> Bin Laden believes that if he can get a war started, he can
> constitute this entity and he'd be running it. He really
> believes Islam would beat the west. It might seem
> ridiculous, but he figures if he can polarize the world into
> Islam and the West, he's got a billion soldiers. If the West
> wreaks a holocaust in Muslim lands, that's a billion people
> with nothing left to lose, even better from Bin Laden's
> point of view. He's probably wrong about winning, in the end
> the west would probably overcome--whatever that would mean
> in such a war; but the war would last for years and millions
> would die, not just theirs but ours. Who has the belly for
> that? Bin Laden yes, but anyone else?
>
> I don't have a solution. But I do believe that suffering and
> poverty are the soil in which terrorism grows. Bin Laden and
> his cohorts want to bait us into creating more such soil, so
> they and their kind can flourish. We can't let him do that.
> That's my humble opinion.
>
> Tamim Ansary
>
----- Original Message -----
From: iZone Infotech <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2001 12:58 PM
Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC: Terrorist attacks
I'm a little late on this subject, but read the thread. Just a few points
for everybody to think. Please, I am not taking sides.
1. How does somebody become a terrorist? For that matter even a petty
criminal or thief? Do WE the so called civilized society has some
responsibility towards it?
2. 'Taliban' is the product of America and Pakistan. I am sure that
everybody knows it.
3. Bin Laden is the bi-product of Iraq operation by UN or rather US.
So, who is to blame for the current situation?
Now about innocents. In Kashmir (I am an Indian) people are killed by the
same terrorist groups and the government of India is fighting this for the
last so many years. Everybody, including America turned their back on us,
till very recently when the same group became a problem for them also.
Please remember that America, Pakistan and Taliban were friends till the
other day.
The people of Iraq DID NOT elect Saddam Hussain. The people of Iraq are
equally victims of Saddam Hussain as the rest of the world. So why bomb the
innocents and have sanctions on them. Only the innocents are suffering
there. Saddam Hussain still rules the country and eats good food and lives
in luxury. Are WE (UN and US) NOT responsible for those innocent deaths?
Or, is it that innocents are found only in USA and such rich countries.
I strongly condemn terrorism and violence. But all form of violence,
including state sponsored.
Let's not create terrorists....
Let's not create criminals...
Violence invites more violence. It is time to talk peace. I have read
somewhere on the Internet that BinLaden team has access to nuclear and
biological weapons. God save the world (USA, India, Israel and other
countries). I have mentioned 3 countries because they are the biggest
enemies of Bin Laden. I want peace and not WAR.
I am an Indian and a Christian. Both Mahatma Gandhi and Jesus Christ taught
us to be non-violent. You can kill one Bin Laden, but it will create more
Bin Ladens. So, that is not the end of the story but the beginning. We must
make sure that this world is a JUST one, with respect for all, so that more
Bin Ladens are not created. Otherwise America with all its might or the
combined world power will not be able to do anything. Kashmir, LTTE in
SriLanka, Chechniya are all examples.
Stop Killing and Look for Peace. That is the only thing which is lasting.
D. Joseph
----- Original Message -----
From: Yazid Mohaidat <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2001 12:51 PM
Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC: Terrorist attacks
As a proud human I think I have to answer you dear Karl. I believe that
those people who commited this attack think in the same way of you !! Be
sure my friend that everyone in this world is very proud of his nation and
his history. We should respect every man proud of himself as a human and
works for the sake of the humanity,,,,, and disregard those who think that
they are the superior creatures, or the Gods of this world !! If we keep
thinking this and disregarding the others, their relgions, and their
thinking, then we should expect many other attacks like this or maybe worse.
Let's be beloving people, men and women, Muslims, Cristians and all the
relegions !
----- Original Message -----
From: Karl Doane <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 9:46 PM
Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC: Terrorist attacks
I know we should not contiue this but as a Proud AMERICAN, I feel that I
need to respond. I have to disagree with these people who think we should
apologize for dropping a Nuclear Bomb on Japan.
Read your real History, not what the liberal bleeding heart media tells you.
1. THEY STARTED THE WAR with a cowardly sneak attack on Pearl
Harbor.
2. They tortured and executed our captured soldiers.
3. They tried to exterminate the Chinese and all the rest of Asia.
4. They fought till the death and remember the kamakazie planes,
they would not go quietly.
5. We would have lost probably a few hundred thousand soldiers by
attacking their Homeland.
6. We would have had to kill just about every single Japanese
person to take over Japan. I do believe that is more then
our A Bombs killed.
7. You win a war through Attrition, you have to kill so many of
them that they say 'enough'
8 We could have dropped the A bomb on Tokyo, that would have
killed a few more people.
9. I don't they have ever apologized for their acts.
10. Don't start something you can't finish, if they didn't want to
suffer the consequences, they should have stayed on their
side of the Pacific.
11. I do believe that we gave them quite a bit of help rebuilding
their country along with Germany.
As far as the terrorist a.k.a. slimy, cowardly low lifes, that once again
sneak attacked us again. Why didn't they stand up like real men and fight
us head on. No they have to attack a buch of innocent civilians, like
babies and women. I guess they are too chicken to fight our military head
on. Why, they are afraid of having a fair fight, that is why.
I feel bad for the 99+% of the Islamic people who are good, hard working
honest and righteous people. They have to live with the fact that people
who come from their countries did what they did. They shouldn't be ashamed
because I know that this is not what they are like. We as good AMERICANs
should treat these people with every right of freedom that we enjoy.
People have said that we got what we deserved. Well, the next time somebody
like Iraq comes steamrolling over your countries, don't come looking for
help. We bailed you out the last time otherwise I think Iraq would now own
the whole Middle East. You asked us to come over there, we did, and saved
your butt and this is what we get in return. You will get what you deserve
next time.
You can dance and gloat all you want but just like Japan found out a few
years back, DON'T MESS WITH US. You can have you Holy War and all that
stuff but remember you only won the first battle. We will win the war and
we will DESTROY you. We are the BEST and STRONGEST country in the world
(They don't call us a Super Power for nothing) and we will not stop until we
completely remove them from this great planet.
If our country was so terrible and evil, then why do Hundred of Thousands of
people want to come to our country and become citizens????? You are just a
bunch of jealous people, who can't stand that we have progressed so far in
such a short time (200+ years). In those short amount of years we went from
13 colonies under the thumb of Great Britian, to the MOST POWERFUL NATION IN
THE WORLD. We are also the most ADVANCED and enjoy the most FREEDOM of any
country in the world. Where are you?? The last time I heard, Afghanistan,
is moving back to the caveman age.
That's good, because if they don't hand over the loser, we will help them go
back there, except a little faster.
That is enough of this rant, but the next time any country that hates and
despises us, has a natural disaster, don't come looking to us for help. Try
to survive on your own for once.
Some of you will say that I am just a crazed person, but this is called
being an American. You attack one of us, I consider it an attack on all of
us. I realize that all the people who gave the ulimate sacrifce before me,
did so that I can live in this country. I love my freedom and will NEVER
EVER apologize for what we did in defense of our country. If you don't like
how we handle situations, don't ask us for our help.
When was the last time we went somewhere uninvited??
Middle East - We were invited.
Kosovo - Invited and did 75%+ of the fighting.
Vietnam - Invited.
Korea - Invited.
Haiti - Invited.
WWII - Japan attacked, We FINISHED it
I am sure that you have heard the saying 'Hell has no fury like a Woman's
scorn' Well guess what, LADY LIBERTY is ticked off and she is going to open
a can of whipa** on those low lifes. May God have mercy on their souls.
AMERICA, HOME OF THE FREE!!!!
-----Original Message-----
From: Duffey, Kevin [ mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ]
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 1:22 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC: Terrorist attacks
First, I see no reason why some oppose this discussion in this list, mostly
because I think a number of us in this list are almost like family. I have
been on this list for almost 2 years, and I have seen a lot more too.
Second, I have to say in defense to not posting this discussion on this
list, of all the mailing lists I am part of, this is the ONLY list actually
talking about this, so most likely it is not appropriate. But this list
covers people around the world more so than any other list I am on. I do
however feel it is good to talk about this, and therefore, I am replying
another thought I had the other day.
I work in a small dot.com company and with me are a few co-workers from
India. I am white, but I consider these co workers my brothers (and sister)
as I respect them very much. In the past couple of days they have taught me
some information about what has happened in India, and other parts of the
world. The reason for my reply is it really bothers me to think that after
10's of thousands of people have died in India and other parts of the world,
nobody once got up and said "Let all of us Countries get together and defeat
this". But when it hits in the US, now it is ok to do this. Don't get me
wrong..I am devastated and if I did not have children I would already have
enlisted with the 100,000's of those doing so now. I am furious and feel
nobody in their right mind should ever have done this not only to the US but
to ANY country. The point is, while I fully support full military
retaliation, this should have been done a LOOONG time ago.
I would like to finish by saying I really am disgusted that so many
Americans are targeting local Arab and even Indian establishments. I have a
good friend who's brother has been beat up and in several fights already
because he is Arabic. This is plain wrong. Period. We ALL need to bond,
around the world, no matter what nationality we are or where we live, to
wipe this out for good. Even saying that we all know it wont be possible to
wipe it out everywhere for good. But if somehow all the countries got
together and said "Hey..you mess with us, we wipe you out. You mess with
them, we wipe you out. You mess with anyone, we wipe you out. Period" and
they would understand that no matter where they target, all countries would
get together and fight this problem, perhaps the incidents would diminish or
even disappear. I do recognize and even fear that there are still Cells
operating in the US and other parts of the world, and that it is not only
possible but more than likely that they will strike again soon during all
this, and more US (and other countries) civilians will be harmed. I will be
the first to admit (and I have heard many many more like me) that I am a
little fearful of certain Arabic looking men mostly because this whole thing
has brought about a severe uncertainty amongst the populations of not only
here, but around the world. But I for one will not just arbitrarily attack
or be biased against them unless there is reason to do so. I pray that we
don't see Marshall Law declared and that we don't see anything close to what
happened to the Japanese in WWII.
When all is said and done, we need to all come together as a world, not just
nationality or country, and rise above these outrageous acts. It will only
be then that we can see anything close to world peace.
Perhaps I am wrong in writing this, I apologize if I offend anyone. But
after talking to a number of people via email, online chat, and in person, I
get the feeling a lot of people feel the way I do.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Peter Choe [ mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ]
> Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 9:35 AM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC: Terrorist attacks
>
>
> but neither has japan ever apologized for their atrocities during the
> war to this day and even their history books leave out this part of
> their history. the US, however late and however hard they fought
> agaisnt, has made some apologies and compensations to the japanese
> americans they have interned during the war.
>
> and is you are not familiar with what atrocities the japanese
> has done,
> look into the rape of nanking and what they did with comfort women(sex
> slaves) from korea.
>
> thus ends the history lesson for the day.
>
> Haseltine, Celeste wrote:
>
> > Sanjay,
> >
> >
> >
> > The fact that we did drop nuclear bombs that killed and maimed many
> > civilians is one that I am still ashamed of to this day as a US
> > citizen. Nor am I proud that we as a nation have never
> made a formal
> > apology to Japan, as they have provided us for the bombing at Pearl
> > Harbor. But as my father pointed out to me (he was 12
> years old at the
> > time of the attack on Pearl Harbor), it was the only way we
> could bring
> > an end to the war. The two atomic bombs that we dropped
> on Nagasaki
> > and Hiroshima were NOT a response to the attack on Pearl
> Harbor. They
> > were simply the most economic way AT THAT TIME, to bring to
> an end to a
> > war that did bankrupt all of Europe, and almost bankrupted
> the United
> > States.
> >
> >
> >
> > Celeste
> >
> > ----Original Message-----
> > From: Sanjay Gomes [ mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ]
> > Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 11:09 AM
> > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC: Terrorist attacks
> >
> >
> > I am sorry for again writing offtopic but couldn't
> resist a reply to
> > this, I am neither a critic of the US nor a fanatic but ....
> >
> > ..the facts are
> >
> > The Japanese bombed the military targets in the Pearl
> harbour , and
> > in response the US dropped Nuclear bombs on two heavily
> populated
> > cities
> >
> > creating millions of civilian casualties for times to come
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Haseltine, Celeste [ mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ]
> > Sent: 14 September 2001 17:00
> > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC: Terrorist attacks
> >
> > To everyone on JSP Board.
> >
> > I apologize for filling up the board with another
> response, and off
> > topic at
> > that. But I am so tired of hearing how we in American may have
> > deserved a
> > taste of what many in other countries have had to deal
> with the last
> > couple
> > of days, that I had to respond to Isidoros. My
> apologies to anyone I
> > inconvenience on the board today.
> >
> > -----------------------
> >
> > Isidoros,
> >
> > I wanted to thank you for your expression of sympathy
> for those of
> > us here
> > in the US who did loose family, loved ones, and
> co-workers this past
> > Tues.
> > Fortunately for our company in Texas, all the employees of the
> > company that
> > we were working a contract with did manage to get out
> of the World
> > Trade
> > Center Towers and are accounted for.
> >
> > What you say is very true. We vote people into office
> in the US that
> > reflect the majority opinion of whatever political
> issues are at the
> > forefront during the election process. We do hold a
> great deal of
> > world
> > power in our hands, and we often do force our views of
> democracy and
> > justice
> > onto other countries who cultures and views are
> different. And, we
> > may use
> > our military muscle to protect our interests and the
> interests of our
> > allies, sometimes at the expense of the local people.
> >
> > So some of the hatred that has recently been directed at us is
> > understandable. But it is NOT excusable. We are a country who
> > believe in
> > the rights of all free people to take up arms and fight
> for what they
> > believe in. But terrorism in ANY form is a cowardly
> way to fight,
> > and it is
> > one that is without honor. Back when the Japanese bombed Pearl
> > Harbor, they
> > freely and openly wore their national symbols on their
> planes, and
> > their
> > uniforms. And they admitted that they bomb us. Though
> the result
> > of their
> > actions were no different than the results that
> occurred on Tues in
> > NY and
> > Washington, DC, the Japanese were a people and country
> with honor.
> > They
> > fought and died for what they believed in, and we in
> this country have
> > respected them from the day they signed the armistice, up to the
> > present.
> >
> >
> > The people behind the attack that took place on Tuesday
> have refused to
> > stand up and admit who they are. Because of this, many
> Americans
> > view their
> > actions, and whatever beliefs they may hold that lead
> them to the
> > attack on
> > Tues, in contempt. They are cowardly, and are a people without
> > honor. In
> > addition to the attack on US soil on Tuesday, these
> same people have
> > killed
> > so many others in so many countries, that it is time that we
> > globally take a
> > stand and put a stop to terrorism once and for all. That is why
> > NATO, and
> > many other countries, including those who are openly
> opposed to the
> > US such
> > as Libya, have joined the US in condemning what
> happened on Tues.
> > Whether
> > this will eventually lead to military action or not,
> it's hard to
> > say. But
> > this American is willing to cast a vote for military
> action IF their is
> > sufficient evidence regarding who was behind this
> attack, and IF the
> > person
> > or persons responsible refuse to stand up for their actions and
> > beliefs in a
> > court of law (UN court or otherwise).
> >
> > Thank you again for your prayers, and continuing
> praying that we as
> > a global
> > community can put a stop to terrorism once and for all without
> > resorting to
> > military action.
> >
> > Celeste
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Isidoros Vacropoulos [ mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ]
> > Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 1:48 AM
> > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC: Terrorist attacks
> >
> >
> > Good morning,
> >
> > I'm sorry that i use this list for telling my opinion about the
> > terrible
> > things that happened in USA. Whoever does not want to read this
> > mail, he can
> > just erase it. I don't think it is tiring to erase an email....
> >
> > I would also like to express my deep sorrow to the
> citizens of the USA.
> > Maybe there are fellow subscribers that may have lost friendly
> > people or
> > relatives.
> >
> > Secondly, i would like to say that i'm from Greece and
> i'm a Christian
> > Orthodox. After reading all these mails in this list, i
> would also
> > like to
> > say my opinion...
> >
> > Noone in this earth has the right to feel happy for the
> dead people
> > and for
> > all the destructions in the city of New York.
> > N O O N E. Beyond religion, political beliefs and financial
> > situation , we
> > are all human beings and who are not given the right to
> feel relief
> > for some
> > people who die, even if their political or religious
> background is
> > not the
> > same to ours.
> >
> > On the other hand, noone has also the right to decide
> an attack and
> > kill
> > innocent people.
> > Whether you want it or not, the fellow subscribers that
> come from
> > the great
> > countries, like USA,Germany,Great Britain and the other ARE
> > RESPONSIBLE FOR
> > THIS TRAGEDY TOO.
> > Voting for presidents and people in high places in the
> goverments
> > who decide
> > that they will bomb innocent people (YUGOSLAVIA,
> AFRICA....) is not
> > less
> > responsibility than taking this decision. I want to
> make clear that
> > i'm not
> > saying that USA got what it deserved....I don't think that human
> > beings are
> > the right beings to decide who has done wrong and who
> has done right.
> > I'm just saying that you are the one who voted for your
> presidents.Your
> > presidentd decided many bad things and attacks in the
> near past (and
> > noone
> > can deny it) and these presidents made so many
> countries,folks and
> > people
> > enemies of yours.
> > What i'm saying is that you gave the right to some
> people to hate you
> > because you made attacks that shouldn't have happened.
> > Whether you want it or not you hold the situation of
> the planet in your
> > hands. You can decide now what will hapen in my country
> in the next 30
> > years.If you ever understand the power that you hold in your
> > hands.............
> >
> > Again, i want to express my deep condolences to the
> families of the
> > dead and
> > wounded people,
> > i'm sure that are deep religious people in my country
> that will pray
> > for
> > you.
> >
> >
> > Isidoros
> >
> > (P.S)
> > I would like some fellow subscribers, especially from
> USA, to judge my
> > opinion.
> >
> > Thanx
> >
> >
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