Hi Regis, *, On Fri, Apr 5, 2024 at 9:03 AM Regis Perdreau <regis.perdr...@gmail.com> wrote: > > The problem arises in all languages, and in many languages, sugesters > remain sugesters forever.
Each language team is free to handle it how they feel fit. Some allow anonymous suggestions, some require users to be registered, some have everyone being able to translate directly, others prefer to use suggestions/to review submissions before integrating. > How many sugesters become translators each year? > There are absolutely no official criteria for becoming a translator; you > are subject to the judgement of the "official" translators... Yes, that's basically it. The ones dealing with the translation for many years already decide on how translation should happen, they are the ones who can judge best. It is unfortunate, but not everyone who shows up to contribute does so in good faith (thankfully rare to have trolls, but apparently not unheard of), but some might show up with good intentions, but are just not familiar with LibreOffice/the terms used and introduce lots of inconsistency and thus confusion. That of course is partly to blame on the language not working to create a glossary of the common terms, but that's mostly due to the history of the project/that there was no way to create a glossary in the old translation system.../not everything can be covered by a glossary. Starts with the level of politeness the user should be addressed and goes to specific terms for stuff like cursor vs caret, etc. > Should we > wait for translators to retire and sugesters to become rare? No - of course when the previous translators are not responsive and someone shows up to carry the torch, there's no problem in granting the necessary privileges, but as long as there's an active translator/an active translation team there's no need to change the policy/having admins bypass their wishes and willy-nilly grant privileges - that will only result in them leaving. (and I personally would rather keep those who are already known to stick with the project than risking putting the translation onto a newbie that might lose interest in the next month already - pissing off the ones with experience just to not come across as "difficult" is a bad choice from my POV). I think it isn't really a big problem that not everyone can make direct translations, after all even people with translation privileges still sometimes chose to submit something as a suggestion - of course hard to know the details since naturally most of those discussions likely happen in the corresponding NL-lists/communication channels and do not end up on this list. > I think weblate was a very bad choice. Weblate has nothing to do with it, that policy would be the same in any tool. You might have other reasons why you think weblate is a bad choice, but how the LibreOffice project decides to manage permissions certainly is not a problem with weblate. You could give anyone translate permissions in weblate as well, it is just something we think would be a bad idea, again proven by the hesitation by the Korean team who had trolls in other projects already. It is the same with source-code contributions - we don't give anyone direct-commit privileges from the get-go. We accept patches in gerrit from anyone, but only after the user did show that the quality of the contributions is good and not just a one-off, then ESC can suggest granting the privileges. Also suggestions and accepting them isn't the only way the project can handle it, the alternative would be translation with review or setting up suggestions with voting - but that is more or less the same/would make more sense in larger translation teams. > TDF never speaks about sugesters in > translation report > (see > https://blog.documentfoundation.org/blog/2023/06/09/libreoffice-native-language-projects-tdfs-annual-report-2022/ > ) That's also not a fair representation, since that also doesn't explicitly mention translators/doesn't make any distinction between users with direct submission privileges and those who are "only" suggesting. The document speaks about the language community, and that includes both translators and suggestors. Same with our dashboard, that also includes suggestions in the default view/stats > There was a survey, what are the conclusions and which step next ? The results of the survey were published here: https://blog.documentfoundation.org/blog/2024/03/29/results-from-our-survey-of-libreoffice-localisation-tooling-and-workflows/ And next steps are to add machine translation.... But participation was quite low and not everyone feels the same about any issue, so naturally people rely on feedback. Also I strongly disagree that users with suggestions wouldn't get credit for that. Weblate shows suggestions in the user profile and our dashboard reflects that as well. If you have examples where suggestions are ignored in terms of giving people credit, then please point those out, those omissions are certainly not intentional. Also if there are problems in suggestions not being acted upon, either being rejected or accepted or commented-on, then raise the issue and I'm sure there will be a solution. ciao Christian -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: l10n+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? https://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: https://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/l10n/ Privacy Policy: https://www.documentfoundation.org/privacy