Once again, you ad homenim. The subject I continuously bring up is always avoided, insistence that no other data is pertinent, that no one else has anything to gain except Assad in the gassing of the Syrian People.
It is Party Line right out of your Marxists Groups, and it is delivering the same results that Obama and the MSM desire, that we bomb Syria because they did this, when the proof, form Investigations form the UN and Russia and others that people discount because of their names, will not be looked at. Also what isn't looked at is that if the MSM carry's the drums of war, if one is holding up the MSM's and US Governments 'facts' while investigations are being suppressed by those same sources, one should check their data sources if you find your marching along with them. I no longer can take on face value, your Party Line missives for that reason alone, yours for the reason that no discussion of an issue occurs, it all comes back to pointed remarks at any poster that wants to discuss something, not just me, you added Arhata in this as an attempt to shame them. Scott > Scott > > You certainly have not payed attention to my posts of 2 1/2 years on > Syria, if you have come to this wacky conclusion of yours. One can be > against the crimes of the Assad fascist regime and still be against all > imperialists interventions but it seems to be rocket science to you and > others. You can turn a blind eye to them if you like but not I. > > > On Wed, Sep 4, 2013 at 10:06 PM, <scotpe...@cruzio.com> wrote: > >> Yes, I noted your a Marxist. I may have wrongly slandered someone else >> whom I thought was a Socialist, they used the same sources and the same >> tactics with anyone who tried to have a discussion about data other then >> your emotionally packed has to be true Assad did it, cause your sources >> supported the same things the MSM did, which was the desires of Obama >> and >> the MIC. >> >> I now know more about your philosophy from the posted about Syria then I >> knew before, and I'm sad to say I'm not any more endeared form you then >> the Socialists that insisted on posting uncertain details as hard facts >> whose only purpose can be to sanction the US killing more Syrians, >> because >> Obama said, use gas and I'll bomb you, so gas was used. Oh yes, it has >> to >> be Assad, no other discussion allowed. >> >> Sorry, this only means I have to fact check everything you post just as >> if >> it was the MSM, as the agenda of the MSM/MIC was identical to what your >> Marxists Groups were achieving. >> >> Seriously, I thought if either you or the Socialists who posted the same >> exact things you did, who use the same tactics in replying to those who >> present other views or want a discussion about the oddities and >> uncertainties being listed as positive known facts, that you were the >> type >> that would go Huh? Our actions are supporting Western Imperialism in >> this >> case? Could we not have all the data or has someone got us on a leash >> and >> we didn't notice? >> >> Nope... not a hint of that. >> >> I know that scenario, I've used sources that I thought were trusted, and >> didn't vet the information personally to find out I was used to >> disseminate emotionally charged Imperialist Propaganda. >> >> BTW, the subject was, has been and still is, the posts that claim >> immediately and for certain that Assad is the only possible chance >> anyone >> did exactly as Obama desired so he could appease his psycho masters and >> run up another war profiting account for them. >> >> You asked why would the US or anyone else want to use chemical weapons, >> people told you, and you reacted at them, there was no discussion about >> what was sent to you, only defense of a solid view that cannot be wrong >> and no additional data can ever be looked at and attacks on anyone that >> might point out why Assad would be insane to do as Obama wanted so he'd >> have a justification to bomb more civilians, ANYWHERE. >> >> It's back to the old, it's what is done, what is accomplished not what >> is >> said, that defines the charterer of the person. I really had hoped you'd >> seen you were selling what Obama wanted and might take another look. Oh >> well, at least I know where you stand too when the emotionally charged >> propaganda comes from a source you repeat and defend, while not being >> able >> to have a conversation about the data. >> >> Scott >> >> > Scott >> > >> > So you are saying Russian, Chinese and Iranian imperialism( arms, >> loans, >> > training, banking, intel and capitalist ventures and in the case of >> Iran >> > boots on the ground with Quds Force, Iranian Revolutionary Guards, >> > Hezbollah and 4 Shiite groups from Iraq)) does not also profit from >> the >> > Syrian conflict. And I am not a supporting of any of the imperialist >> and >> > sub imperialist groupings. I am a Marxist. >> > >> > Not some Stalinist, right wing or fascist and liberal or a so called >> > progressive who supports the Assad regime thinking they are anti >> > imperialist. >> > >> > Cort >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > On Wed, Sep 4, 2013 at 1:17 PM, <scotpe...@cruzio.com> wrote: >> > >> >> Sorry Cort, but you make this sound like the USA benefits from our >> wars >> >> abroad. >> >> >> >> Yes, US/England's interference, well actually bloody warfare and >> >> practicing genocide on the indigenous populations is more accurate, >> goes >> >> back to the 1970's it goes back to when all other sources of portable >> >> energy were wiped out in the early 1900's and Oil was the only method >> to >> >> be used, the West has been in and trying to control those who have >> the >> >> black gold. But you insist there is not a profit motive? >> >> >> >> The Corporations that help fund political campaigns, whose >> advertising >> >> controls what is actually in our newspapers to the point we have to >> to >> >> to >> >> N Korean news to find something worse, are the beneficiaries. Those >> who >> >> profit from the major user of Oil, the Military Industrial Complex >> uses >> >> 40% of the world supply of Oil. >> >> >> >> As Arhata stated, follow the money. Who profits. >> >> >> >> When the worlds economies and the countries themselves are controlled >> by >> >> those who control the worlds economies, they are the beneficiaries. A >> >> lull >> >> in the oil supply, a lull in the food supply, the foreign nationals >> that >> >> now own 40% of the NATURAL WATER SUPPLIES in the USA can state >> scarcity >> >> and jack prices. >> >> >> >> The only real money makers left in the USA has to do with GMO's and >> >> chemicals, destroying food production around the world, making >> >> scarcities >> >> while controlling the only viable food supplies left, as well as >> Weapons >> >> Manufacturing. 12 years ago 40% of US jobs centered around the >> Military >> >> Industrial Complex. >> >> >> >> Damn, war is just good business, you don't want to see a massive >> >> depression instead of this little one we're living in now do ya? >> After >> >> all, what other jobs would we have to support our economy? >> >> >> >> So why rule out profit by Oil, as you insist on doing in every >> instance >> >> of >> >> the Middle East? The Oil Corporations based in the US and the UK >> profit >> >> immensely, the players that are religiously polarized in this region >> are >> >> the other players, and duh, they have immense amounts of oil too. >> >> >> >> Syria blocks natural gas lines form Saudi Arabia to European supply >> >> depots. Syria blocks sending water from Iraq and Turkey to Israel. >> >> >> >> Syria's majority of the population is that of Iran's population too, >> and >> >> those against them have committed the greatest crimes against >> humanity, >> >> using Chemical warfare (Iraq using US supplied WMD's on Iranian's and >> >> Kurds, Israel on Palestinians). >> >> >> >> Empowering all factions that are pro invading Syria, by fighting >> anyone >> >> who mentions profit motive, or anything about the major chemical >> warfare >> >> known criminals and their parts in Syria, seems to be a constant >> theme >> >> coming out of your Marxist group. Stating your for the people is >> >> consistent, but empowering the Imperialists to invade seems to be the >> >> end >> >> result that these actions will achieve. >> >> >> >> Any discussion, or will I get another personal post instead of >> sticking >> >> to >> >> the subject of, who profits. >> >> >> >> Scott >> >> >> >> > Before the start of the revolution and now war within many wars, >> Syria >> >> > ranked 32nd in oil production and has now dropped many places >> since. >> >> This >> >> > sound like those who said at the start of the US intervention in >> Iraq >> >> and >> >> > Afghanistan ( real US intervention their began in 1978) that it was >> >> over >> >> > oil.> In Iraq the big oil contacts are with China and Afghanistan >> not >> >> much >> >> > is coming out. >> >> > >> >> > No, the Syrian revolution began for other reasons and the US, >> Qatar, >> >> the >> >> > Saudis, Turkey, Iranian, Chinese, French and Russian imperialists >> and >> >> sub >> >> > imperialist actors on both sides, all have other reasons to co-opt >> or >> >> stop >> >> > it other than oil. >> >> > >> >> > Cort >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > On Wed, Sep 4, 2013 at 9:49 AM, Arhata Osho < >> >> > arhataworldfreespe...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote: >> >> > >> >> >> Less than 1% of people died from 'gassing' out of over 100,000 >> >> killed! >> >> >> Is >> >> >> this about gassing of innocent citizens? >> >> >> [image: *=)) rolling on the floor] Wanta buy a bridge from >> Brooklyn? >> >> >> Follow the Money! Is it 'green oil' too >> >> >> How's Iraq doing now? Afghanistan? About 'oil'? [image: *8-| >> rolling >> >> >> eyes]The >> >> >> American citizens finance these wars.[image: *8-} silly] >> >> >> Could that be YOU or people you know? >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> >> *From:* Cort Greene <cort.gre...@gmail.com> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> A US attack on Syria will Prolong the >> >> >> War<http://www.juancole.com/2013/09/attack-syria-prolong.html> >> >> >> Posted on 09/04/2013 by Juan Cole >> >> >> The struggle in Syria began peacefully in spring of 2011, but >> after >> >> >> about >> >> >> half a year it turned violent when the regime deployed tanks and >> >> other >> >> >> heavy munitions against the protesters. Some of the latter took up >> >> >> weapons >> >> >> and turned to violence in revenge. Thereafter the struggle >> spiraled >> >> into >> >> >> a >> >> >> civil war, in which the regime showed itself perfectly willing to >> >> attack >> >> >> civilian city quarters and kill indiscriminately. The struggle has >> >> >> killed >> >> >> over 100,000 persons. As the regime became ever more brutal, the >> >> rebel >> >> >> fighters were increasingly radicalized. Now, among the more >> important >> >> >> groups is Jabhat al-Nusra or the Succor Front, a radical al-Qaeda >> >> >> affiliate. >> >> >> President Obamas plan to bomb Syria with cruise missiles will do >> >> >> nothing >> >> >> to hasten the end of the conflict. Instead, it will likely prolong >> >> it. >> >> >> *It should be remembered that the US couldnt end the Iraqi civil >> war >> >> >> despite having over 100,000 boots on the ground in that country. >> It >> >> is >> >> >> highly unlikely that Washington can end this one from 30,000 >> feet.* >> >> >> The hope for avoiding another decade of killing is that the >> >> governmental >> >> >> elite and the rebels get tired of fighting and prove willing to >> make >> >> a >> >> >> deal. It is probably too late for Syria to succeed at the kind of >> >> >> transition achieved in Yemen. There, the president stepped down >> and >> >> his >> >> >> vice president ran for his seat. At the same time, members of the >> >> >> opposition were given seats in the cabinet. That kind of >> cohabitation >> >> >> with >> >> >> the former enemy is easier if too much blood hasnt bee shed. >> >> >> The best solution for Syria would be if President Bashar al-Assad >> >> steps >> >> >> down and the Baath Party gave up its dictatorial tactics. At the >> same >> >> >> time, >> >> >> the rebels would have to forewswear al-Qaeda-type extremism. >> >> >> Probably each side would have to feel that they could not gain any >> >> >> substantial benefit from further fighting, for negotiations to >> have >> >> >> prayer >> >> >> of success. >> >> >> The prospect of a US missile strike is emboldening the rebels. >> They >> >> >> increasingly hope that the US will come in militarily with them. >> >> >> the rebels dont look at the proposed US missile strikes as a >> limited >> >> >> affair or as solely related to chemical weapons use. Aside from >> >> >> al-Qaeda, >> >> >> they see the US as an ally. Thus, they are complaining that >> Obamas >> >> >> indecisiveness is emboldening Syrian President >> >> >> al-Assad< >> http://www.elaph.com/Web/news/2013/9/833955.html?entry=Syria>. >> >> >> The US is now part of their strategic calculations and they see >> >> decisive >> >> >> American action as an asset. >> >> >> Obviously, such euphoria at the prospect of US military >> intervention >> >> on >> >> >> the rebel side is incompatible with the kind of pacted >> transition >> >> >> political scientists favor. The rebels will have every incentive >> to >> >> hold >> >> >> out for ever more forceful outside Syria intervention in the >> coming >> >> >> years. >> >> >> By striking Syria, Obama has all but guaranteed that a negotiated >> >> >> solution >> >> >> becomes impossible for years to come. In the absence of serious >> >> >> negotiations, the civil war will continue and likely get worse. >> The >> >> US >> >> >> should give serious thought to what the likely actual (as opposed >> to >> >> >> ideal) >> >> >> reaction in Syria will be to the landing of a few cruise missiles. >> >> The >> >> >> anti-regime elements will celebrate, convinced that it will all be >> >> over >> >> >> quickly if the US gets involved. The last thing they will want >> will >> >> be >> >> >> to >> >> >> negotiate with the regime. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > ------------------------------------ --------------------------------------------------------------------------- LAAMN: Los Angeles Alternative Media Network --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Unsubscribe: <mailto:laamn-unsubscr...@egroups.com> --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Subscribe: <mailto:laamn-subscr...@egroups.com> --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Digest: <mailto:laamn-dig...@egroups.com> --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Help: <mailto:laamn-ow...@egroups.com?subject=laamn> --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post: <mailto:la...@egroups.com> --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Archive1: <http://www.egroups.com/messages/laamn> --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Archive2: <http://www.mail-archive.com/laamn@egroups.com> --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Yahoo! 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