[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
>Let me suggest that the dragon- or rather salamander and the hedgehog might  
>hail from Retournac, France. Susan Lambiris has agreed to post some pictures 
>of  a similar salamander and a hedgehog that I took there on the arachne  
>website since I am a mechanical dolt.

http://home-and-garden.webshots.com/album/244348757BRJzVK

Devon!  That's them!  or very close to.  My pair was square, rather than
round, but that's the very hedgehog that I didn't manage to buy.

>I think the Salamander 
>may  have been the symbol of Francis I, of France, although the lace on
display 
>in  Retournac is mostly 19th and early 20th century, much as Sally describes 
>in  relation to Italy.
> 
>It is guipure lace. Unlike Bruges, where the salamander would be made  
>separately and then the background added, it is made like Lester type
Bedfordshire, 
>or Cluny lace, where the pairs come in directly from the  background bars.

I will post a better photo -- hopefully you will be able to see the thread
paths a bit better this time.  He has the strangely thick raised front foot
of the salamander emblem found in the Chateau de Blois, seen here:

http://tinyurl.com/25sdpt

But he has lost the crown and the flame coming out of his mouth, and is
"surrounded" by only one flame.

And now that I've been doing some Googling, it looks like the hedgehog was
probably Louis XII's porcupine.

Now I am really sorry I wasn't in time to buy the matching porcupine.
Pretty good for an "embroidery picture" (which is what the price tag in the
antique shop said).

Lynn Carpenter in SW Michigan, USA
alwen at i2k dot com
http://lost-arts.blogspot.com/

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